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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » advice on MMR vaccine and child w/Lyme

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Author Topic: advice on MMR vaccine and child w/Lyme
jwall
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I have been losing sleep over this. There has been an outbreak of measles in my area. My child is 6 and is fighting Lyme...he is doing much better lately. his LLMD (Dr. J, DC) said to get the measles ONLY vaccine if that is possible, but no to the MMR.

There isn't a measles only vaccine option. I don't know what to do! I feel strongly that I should take him to be vaccinated, especially because we like to travel and eventually he is going to have to get the vaccine.

He is 6. I always felt like I should hold off with him for some reason. What are the chances he could develop austism after a vaccination at 6 years old?

Measles can cause serious complications. If I decide to get the vaccination, should I give him anything to prepare...help detox? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

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Lymetoo
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Yes, there are things you can do to help protect him. I'll go search. Keebler probably has that info if I can't find it.

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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Lymetoo
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Icon 1 posted 23 October, 2011 02:03 PM Profile for Keebler Edit/Delete Post Reply With Quote -


http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/09/19/The-Truth-about-the-Flu-Shot.aspx

What To Do if You are Forced to Take Swine Flu Shot (by Dr. Mercola) 2009

Excerpt (from the very end of the article):

Treatment for Toxic Vaccine Exposure

1. Place a cold compress on the site of the injection immediately after the injection and continue this as often as possible for at least two days. If symptoms of fever, irritability, fatigue or flu-like symptoms reoccur -- continue the cold compresses until they abate. A cold shower or bath will also help.


2. Take krill oil as a source of animal based omega-3 fats.

3. Curcumin, quercetin, ferulic acid and ellagic acid as a mixture -- the first two must be mixed with extravirgin olive in one teaspoon. Take the mix three times a day (500 mg of each)


4. Vitamin E (natural form) 400 IU a day (high in gamma-E)

5. Vitamin C 1000 mg four times a day

6. Astaxanthin 4 mg a day

7. Zinc 20 mg a day for one week then 5 mg a day


8. Avoid all immune stimulating supplements (mushroom extracts, whey protein)

except beta-glucan -- it has been shown to reduce inflammation, microglial activation and has a reduced risk of aggravating autoimmunity, while increasing antiviral cellular immunity.


9. Take a multivitamin/mineral daily (one without iron -- Extend Core)

10. Magnesium citrate/malate 500 mg of elemental magnesium two capsules three times a day

11. Vitamin D3:

A. All Children -- 5000 IU a day for two weeks after vaccine then 2000 IU a day thereafter

B. Adults -- 20,000 IU a day after vaccine for two weeks then 10,000 IU a day thereafter

C. Take 500 mg to 1000 mg of calcium citrate a day for adults and 250 mg a day for children under age 12 years.

12. Avoid all mercury-containing seafood

13. Avoid omega-6 oils (corn, safflower, sunflower, soybean, canola and peanut oils)

14. Blenderize parsley and celery and drink 8 ounces twice a day

15. Take Jatoba tea extract (add 20 drops in on cup of tea) one day before the vaccine and the twice a day thereafter.

you can get it at iHerb's site for under $8.00:

http://www.iherb.com/Amazon-Therapeutics-Jatoba-1-oz-30-ml/14429?at=0

---------------------

- keep scrolling way down after this article, Dr. Mercola shares some other thoughts.

Full article at link above. There is a lot of good information there to consider, even if not for this particular tetanus shot.

Of course, it might be distressing to read but I think you did the right thing as tetanus is nothing to mess around with.

I think the supplements suggested above will help.

If not already registered at Mercola's site, if you just register email address (nothing more) to get a email, you can read all his work. Costs nothing to read. He's very generous with sharing his studies.
-

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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Lymetoo
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Of course, most of that is for an adult.

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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beaches
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Did he have the MMR vaccine when he was little?

Have you had his measles titer checked to see if he has immunity?

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jwall
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No, we have not had the MMR at all. I felt like something was off when it was time to do the MMR, so I never got it done. he has had all of his other shots though and seemed to do ok with those.

He has had Lyme since he was 2, diagnosed when he was 4, and is in treatment still at 6.

He is in the midst of babesia treatment - omnicef, malarone, septra and flagyl. I think we are winding down with it. He seems much better lately, but still very thin. He rarely gets sick with the common cold or strep or any other common childhood ailments.

The outbreak was in the county next to mine and I think they have it under control, but it still really worries me.

My 8 year old was able to have the shot split up, but then they stopped offering it that way. he did fine with that and I know he has the double copy MTHFR mutation that I have. I'm not sure about my 6 year old - he hasn't been tested for that.

He has sensory issues though with clothing and light and sound and joint pain, mood issues iwth Lyme.

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jwall
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thank you for all the info. on how to prepare. I already give him a hefty dose of the nordic naturals fish oil, a multivitamin with methyfolate, vit C (1000 mg), and probiotics.

Should I add a big dose of vit A, Vit D, and zinc?

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lax mom
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My little son started banging his head the day after that set of vaccines around 18 mos.

I'm not blaming the vaccine, because he has Lyme...it just didn't help matters.

Even so, I would STILL have him vaccinated, just not so many at one time. They give these little babies sooooooo many vaccines at once.

He will need his 4 yr old shots next fall and I'm at a loss.

--------------------
♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥
(aperture)
http://flash.lymenet.org/scripts/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=115161;p=0

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beaches
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So good to hear about a mother's instinct! Good for you.

Yes, I know they recently stopped just giving the measles part of the MMR. What a shame. Now kids who lack measles antibodies have to get all 3. It just doesn't make sense at all if your kids already have immunity to mumps and rubella.

Speaking of which, have you had his measles titer drawn?

If it's nml then obviously he won't need that shot, fingers crossed.

And good for you for being on top of the MTHFR issue. That's something very recent for us.

If your son has to get the shot, there are ways to mitigate adverse effects.

I have that in my files somewhere. If you'd like, I will PM you.

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Lymetoo
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quote:
Originally posted by jwall:
He rarely gets sick with the common cold or strep or any other common childhood ailments.


-

Hmmmm.... maybe...

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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jwall
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So could he have natural immunity passed from me? I have not had his titers drawn for measles.

Yes, please PM me with ways to mitigate adverse effects. Thank you Beaches!

The only thing that concerns me is his Dr. (the expert Dr. J in DC) told me not to, that he doesn't agree with the MMR (I'm not sure if he doesn't agree with it period or if he just doesn't agree with it for children with Lyme). And he is an infectious diseases Dr. He told me to get teh measles ONLY if that is an option, but it's not. So irritating!!! if they did offer it as an option, I'm sure more children would be vaccinated.

I hate to go against what our Lyme Dr. is telling us to do for him, but I'm so worried about it.

My sister in law would tell me not to worry about it because if he does get the measles, it will be fine and he will recover. But, I have read some pretty horrific things about the measles (even 10 years down the road, it can cause a fatal nervous system disorder YEARS later that I just read about - popping up in Germany) and if we can avoid getting the disease at all, I definitely want to go that route.

I just worry about him all of a sudden developing autism or something like that.

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jwall
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Lymetoo, hmmm...maybe I should go ahead and get the vaccine??
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beaches
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Trust your instincts as a mother, always.

I will look through my notes and PM you.

In the meantime, get his measles titer tested. Your peds can easily do this through Quest.

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beaches
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Oh and don't listen to your SIL.
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jwall
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Her baby hasn't had any shots and I do worry about her too. But, she doesn't seem worried.

My mother instinct right now is saying get him vaccinated. We do travel and it's probably time. The outbreak so close really scared me.

I will call tomorrow about the measles titer. He has to have blood drawn anyway for his regular safety labs, so I'm sure they can add that on. I'll also have her add the MTHFR on to his labs as well.

My pediatrician said she would also run immune labs just to make sure his immune system looks good prior to giving him the shot.

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IckyTicky
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Just be very careful. My best friend's son didn't get autism from the vaccine...but by the next day one of his eyes was frozen (cross eyed). He had to have surgery just today to fix it. It was definitely caused by the vaccine.
My kids have LD and we don't vaccinate. But that is a choice for the parents. No condemnation here.

--------------------
IGM: 18+, 23+, 30+, 31+++, 34+, 39IND, 41++, 58+++, 66+, 83-93IND
IGG: 31+, 39IND, 41+
Also positive for Mycoplasma Pneumoniae and RMSF.
Whole family of 5 dx with Lyme.

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IckyTicky
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Also.. my mother had the vaccine and got measles three times (seriously lol)

--------------------
IGM: 18+, 23+, 30+, 31+++, 34+, 39IND, 41++, 58+++, 66+, 83-93IND
IGG: 31+, 39IND, 41+
Also positive for Mycoplasma Pneumoniae and RMSF.
Whole family of 5 dx with Lyme.

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jwall
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Thanks for the heads up. I am really torn.my kids have had all of their shots (just missing this one) and did ok with them all. This was before Lyme entered our world - we were all healthy.

Eventually he will need the shot as we like to travel. I am going to call my Lyme Dr again today.

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lululymemom
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When my daughter was little she had significant reaction to the rubella vaccine.. I later found out it was not that uncommon and quite dangerous.. I only allowed her to have measles and mumps vaccine after that..

--------------------
IGM 41 IND, 83-93+ IGG 31 IND,34 IND, 41++, 58+, 83-93 IND

31 Epitope test neg.

Bartonella henselae 1:100

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jwall
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They don't offer measles only vaccine anymore. The 3 are grouped together unfortunately.
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map1131
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My newest granddaughter 5 1/2 mths old has already been stuck 9 times +++. Are they serious?

Can't they spread these vaccines over some time period? No wonder child have severe reactions. Talk about overloaded the immune system!

It makes me physically sick to my stomach to think about it. It certainly worries me more than the disease/viruses etc that she MAY be exposed too.

Can't even image the worry you would have if you know a child has lyme & co.

Pam

--------------------
"Never, never, never, never, never give up" Winston Churchill

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lululymemom
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Thats unfortunate since some are only allergic to one part of the vaccine..doesnt make sense..

--------------------
IGM 41 IND, 83-93+ IGG 31 IND,34 IND, 41++, 58+, 83-93 IND

31 Epitope test neg.

Bartonella henselae 1:100

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Lymetoo
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quote:
Originally posted by jwall:
Lymetoo, hmmm...maybe I should go ahead and get the vaccine??

-
No, I'm thinking since he doesn't get colds and other things going around, he may stand a good chance of not getting measles. I never get colds or anything either.

BTW, I had the measles when I was a kid. No problems.

My opinion is that vaccines LOWER immunity in general.

They give 12 times the number of vaccines that were given in 1940.

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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sammy
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Since he is already sick, I would want to make sure that I did everything that I could to protect him from further disease. I would make sure that he was caught up on his vaccines.

Jwall, you know the risk in the area where you live. You know your son best. Do your research (sounds like you already have since you know long term complications of the infections). Then go with your heart, your mother's intuition.

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sammy
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Incase you are interested:

"No Evidence Multiple Vaccines Raise Autism Risk, CDC Says"

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/781670?nlid=30106_785&src=wnl_edit_medp_nurs&uac=98681HX&spon=24

Here is the Journal of Pediatrics that the medscape article is based on:

http://www.jpeds.com/webfiles/images/journals/ympd/JPEDSDeStefano.pdf

"Secrets of the MMR scare. How the case against the MMR vaccine was fixed" from BMJ

http://www.bmj.com/content/342/bmj.c5347?sid=cd35b6db-3b0e-4e33-9393-fe1f08d424e8

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surprise
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Oh, I should stay out. But when I saw a
CDC study that says vaccines are just fine and dandy...

in the 80's, autism was 1 in 10,000
and the required vaccines for ages 5 and under was 10.

2013, autism is 1 in 50 (does not include ADD)
and the required number of vaccinations for ages under 5
is 42. That is right. 42!

The fact that the pharmaceutical companies refuse to sell/ break up the MMR makes me ILL.

I am sorry it is so agonizing. I understand.

--------------------
Lyme positive PCR blood, and
positive Bartonella henselae Igenex, 2011.
low positive Fry biofilm test, 2012.
Update 7/16- After extensive treatments,
doing okay!

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surprise
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By the way, there has NEVER

been a study done between non- vaccinated children with autism, against fully vaccinated children with autism.

It is also scientifically impossible to have a genetic epidemic.

--------------------
Lyme positive PCR blood, and
positive Bartonella henselae Igenex, 2011.
low positive Fry biofilm test, 2012.
Update 7/16- After extensive treatments,
doing okay!

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Lymetoo
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You may want to listen to this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChRaTA_E8WM&feature=share

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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tick battler
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I stopped vaccinating my children after my daughter lost her coordination after the measles part of the MMR. I had asked my ped to order it separately and she did. She was a toddler but was stumbling the next day and kept falling. It was clearly related to the shot. She probably had lyme at the time but I was not sure. She recovered but it was very frightening to think what might have happened if I had give her all three shots.

You might read some Dr. Mercola articles on vaccinations. There are natural ways to treat...you might speak to an ND. Our EDS practitioner can make a remedy with frequencies to theoretically kill any organism that is programmed into her computer.

tickbattler

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philly78
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In regards to the vaccines and autism....correlation does not equal causation. There are SO MANY different things that contribute to the increase in autism diagnosis.

Do we get more vaccines? Yep. But we also are exposed to all kinds of crap in the air and in our food. We are surrounded by electronics too and imo all of these things contribute.

I have a 13 year old son who was diagnosed with autism which I later found out was lyme...congenital lyme. I did all his vaccines and if anything I think the problem is getting too many shots at once.

I have a 1 year old now and we chose to do a delayed schedule.

As for your child never getting sick, that doesn't necessarily mean that his immune system is good. It could be that he just doesn't have an immune response. I went 16 years without getting sick even being exposed to all the sick people in the ER (which is where I work). This past winter though? Now that I am near remission from lyme? I got sick multiple times!

I was actually sick more times this past winter than I had been in 16 years combined. Crazy. Anyway....my point is I wouldn't make a decision based on whether or not he gets sick.

Go with your instincts.

Now...when my youngest got his vaccines, my LLMD gave me some homeopathic rememdies to use prior to and after getting the vaccines. I wish I could remember what she had me do.

--------------------
When faced with pain you have two choices....either quit and accept the circumstances, OR make the decision to fight with all the resources you have at your disposal.

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jwall
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Thank you all. I know you all understand how awful it feels to be a parent making this decision. I wouldn't have thought twice about it really if we all were not fighting Lyme. Pre-lyme, I had heard about the MMR and autism though, so for both boys, I decided to hold off on the MMR. My 8 year old got it around age 4 I believe.

On the one hand, he could get measles and have serious complications. On the other hand, I could give him the shot and in an instant, he could be a different child!

I am so worried about that. He is 6 and hasn't had any shots for quite a while, so maybe the problem is from giving too many shots at once when they are babies.

I was lucky to have had the shot split up for my 8 year old.

I am thinking my 6 yr old may not get sick because of his suppressed immune system. I am the same way - never get sick. I used to catch colds and normal illnesses and now I never do.

I called my LLMD's office again today and they talked to the pediatric NP treating him. She said because there has been an outbreak just 30 minutes away, that she would go ahead and give him the shot. otherwise, they would say hold off.

She did say to prepare for additional stress and inflammation caused by the vaccine. Because it is a live virus, it is more stressful on the immune system. She said to expect more inflammation and to call with any concerns or just to let them know how he did with it. She also said to prepare with giving him additional supplements.

My pediatrician said that she sees a fever 2 weeks after the shot in many of her patients. She said she has never seen a case of autism caused by the MMR and rarely sees any complications at all. She said a fever is typical.

I know he will need the shot eventually. I believe they have the outbreak under control, but just 30 minutes away really scared me. The person had traveled to India and brought it back.

My good friend's nephew has autism and she said she will get the vaccine protocol from his mom that tells them how to prepare for vaccines before and after.

tick battler, the loss of coordination with the measles shot really scares me... [Frown] Such a hard decision. Then again, what would full blown measles do though? That really scares me as well.

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Keebler
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-
LymeToo,

Thanks so much for posting my previous post. I really appreciate that as it saved me so much time and work (I had not saved that to my note file - but have now).

I love it when anyone can remember or find what others post and just go ahead and do that when possible.
-

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Keebler
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-
Perhaps a local LL ND could also offer advice.

http://flash.lymenet.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/2/13964

How to find an ILADS-educated LL:

N.D. (Naturopathic Doctor);

L.Ac. (Acupuncturist);

D.Ay. (Doctor of Ayurvedic Medicine);

D.O.M. (Doctor of Oriental Medicine);

Integrative / Holistic M.D., etc. (Be aware that those in this category can have various levels of formal herbal &/or nutritional education, perhaps even just a short course. Do ask first.)
-

Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
jwall
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I watched that youtube video, thank you. I like him - where is he located?

Would Dr. K advise his patients who are children to be vaccinated? Just curious.

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poppy
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Actually I think there was a study of unvaccinated Amish children, none of whom had autism.

The trouble is that the medical establishment party line is that all vaccinations are good, the more the better. Black and white situation, they say. When really it is gray and there are legitimate questions about how many shots kids get at such a young age.

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MannaMe
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My siblings and I all had the measles back when I was in 3rd or 4th grade in school. No problems for any of us.

There was an outbreak in school and lots of the others had it also. Never heard of any complications for any of them either.

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Tammy N.
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Although I don't have children, I empathize with what you are going through. No one should just your decision. It's obvious you love your children and are trying to do the best you can.

For what it's worth.....I have a lot of friends and family who elected to NOT vaccinate their children. Continue to do your research (opinions matter, but research matters more). When my nieces and nephews were young I remember researching a lot at the time to help my family members make good decisions, and for me it was clear that I would not immunize if I had children.

Many years ago I had a half sister that died at the age of 3 after the DPT shot. That's what opened my eyes at an early age. Otherwise I never would have thought to even question the doctor's expertise.

Since then I've often wondered....for those of us who did get immunized, did it ruin our immune systems and is that part of the reason now why we cannot combat this horrible Lyme illness?

What is right for one person is not always right for the next. I pray that the right and perfect decision comes to you with a sense of peace. God bless.

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jwall
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Just heard on the news this morning there are 5 new cases - this is 25 minutes away.
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