posted 08 December 2004 12:53               

I know that a lot of lyme patients have been on diflucan for yeast problems. What are your experiences? Has anyone taken this dosage for the required length of time to back up this report or to say that it definitely did not work for them?

Clinical effects of fluconazole in patients with neuroborreliosis.

Schardt FW.

Betriebsarztliche Untersuchungsstelle, Bayerische Julius-Maximilians-
Universitat, Wurzburg, Germany. Fritz.Schardt@m...

Eleven patients with neuro-borreliosis had been treated with 200 mg
fluconazole daily for 25 days after an unsuccessful therapy with
antibiotics. At the end of treatment eight patients had no
borreliosis symptoms and remained free of relapse in a follow-up
examination one year later. In the remaining four patients, symptoms
were considerably improved. At the end of therapy immune reactivity
(IgM+) disappeared in three patients. Since borrelia spp. are almost
exclusively localised intracellular, they may depend on certain
metabolites of their eucaryotic host cell. Inhibition of P450 and
other cytochromes by fluconazole may incapacitate Borrelia upon
longterm exposure.

PMID: 15337633 [PubMed - in process]
.....................................................................

We believe that borrelia maybe susceptible to p450 inhibitors such as
HCQ and fluconazole. The later being safer and more effective.

Yes, diflucan is usually prescribed for yeast infections, however,
there's good evidence to suggest that borrelia are also vulnerable to
P450 inhibitors. Borrelia have only 1 P450 homologue enzyme,
putidaredoxin (PdR), and that would make it extremely susceptible to
an inhibitor of that enzyme. Fluconazole may just be that inhibitor.

Schardt's success in these patients is very significant.

Schardt is now recommending 50 days at 200 mg rather than only 25

I think that it is possible that the 4 patients had problems that were due to undiagnosed co-infections.

Micul

posted 08 December 2004 14:09               

I have tried it 4 times. 3 out of 4 I saw improvement.

The fourth time I didn't notice any difference but I was only taking half the dosage as the other times.

posted 08 December 2004 14:49               

I am also taking mega goodies and suppliments: acidophilus(low fat kind), MG big time, CoQ 10, B's in the butt, a fairly new immune enhancer: Bio Bran from UK, etc....

I stagger everything so I am taking something every flippin 30 minutes but if I get better what the heck!!

I have chronic late stage borerliosis and neuroborreliosis.

Below is more hope for all of us who are sick and tired of being sick and tired!

Eur J Med Res. 2004 Jul 30;9(7):334-6.

Related Articles, Links

Clinical effects of fluconazole in patients with neuroborreliosis.

Schardt FW.

Betriebsarztliche Untersuchungsstelle, Bayerische Julius-Maximilians-Universitat, Wurzburg, Germany. Fritz.Schardt@mail.uni-wuerzburg.de

Eleven patients with neuro-borreliosis had been treated with 200 mg fluconazole daily for 25 days after an unsuccessful therapy with antibiotics. At the end of treatment eight patients had no borreliosis symptoms and remained free of relapse in a follow-up examination one year later. In the remaining four patients, symptoms were considerably improved. At the end of therapy immune reactivity (IgM+) disappeared in three patients. Since borrelia spp. are almost exclusively localised intracellular, they may depend on certain metabolites of their eucaryotic host cell. Inhibition of P450 and other cytochromes by fluconazole may incapacitate Borrelia upon longterm exposure.

PMID: 15337633 [PubMed - in process]

Please forgive if I am a little bit overzealous today, been down for the count for the last couple of weeks herxing like hell and am finally getting it under control! I am encouraged!! Ain't life grand!!??

posted 08 December 2004 17:45            

My Lyme got worse and worse while on antibiotics. I just could not get better. I asked for a Candida blood test and voila, I had high levels of active Candida. I took Diflucan for one month and many of my Lyme symptoms subsided. It did not cure me of Lyme but it took away many of the same symptoms that were actually Candida and not Lyme.

I think that it is easy to misdiagnose one for the other when doing a clinical diagnosis based on symptoms. My LLMD did not think I had Candida and kept trying different abx, which made the Candida worse. I had to convince him that I needed to treat the Candida as well as the Lyme. Many MDs do not recognize Candida as a serious illness, which it can be.

Just my 2 cents on why it seems like Diflucan is curing Lyme.

posted 08 December 2004 19:20               

quote:

---

Originally posted by beachcomber:
Candida mimmicks Lyme symptoms in so many aspects. I would be interested in seeing the bloodwork for Candida vs Lyme prior to taking Diflucan with good results.

.............. I think that it is easy to misdiagnose one for the other when doing a clinical diagnosis based on symptoms.

---

posted 08 December 2004 21:20               

If Diflucan does kill Bb, then I would expect to feel crappy for some time, maybe even up until after treatment was stopped. Especially if I was taking abx with it. I don't think any of these test subjects were taking abx at the same time as Diflucan.

I was put on diflucan for 10 days, and I was extremely tired the whole time. I did notice right away that my urine color came back to the yellowish color that it had been before I got sick, instead of being clear or just slightly yellow even though I was taking a B vit complex. My voice also got stronger again instead of always being weak and hoarse.

posted 09 December 2004 09:25            

To clarify what I said: I think that the people with Lyme may also have Candida, which is common due to abx. I don't think I was suggesting that these subjects did not have Lyme at all. I was just thinking that they also had Candida & the Diflucan was hitting that, which helped to clear symptoms.

Also, it is very possible that one can be free of Lyme (after treatment) but be left with severe Sustemic Candida due to the Lyme treatment protocols. These subjects may think it is still Lyme that lingers, when in fact it might be Candida.

Sorry for the confusion. I don't doubt that the subjects tested positive for Lyme. But, a blood test for Candida should also be done to help make sense of the study. If Lyme can be cured by Diflucan, I will gladly increase my weekly dose that barely keeps the Candida in check.

posted 09 December 2004 09:51               

the study says there were 11 subjects studied. 8 ended up symptom free and the other 4 were greatly improved.

doesn't that equal 12.

how could that get that wrong in a study so small or am i missing something?

thanks
bill

posted 09 December 2004 10:05            

quote:

---

Originally posted by skimpbiz:
Should Diflucan be taken by itself without normal lyme antibiotics to maximize effectiveness?

Or is it ok to stay on your usual lyme med's protocal while taking it?

---

posted 09 December 2004 10:43               

This is also a very small trial with only eleven people. My reason for bringing this up was to get actual experiences of people here to see if this holds up in real life. So far only one person has said that they were on antifuguals for a year with little results. It is unclear if this person was on diflucan for long enough, or if the 200 mg was taken. They said that they were on a few diff antifuguals for a year. It seems that most people only take it for short periods of time.

posted 09 December 2004 10:59               

Hello? Those people had lyme. Those people took abx. Those poeople GOT the COINFECTION of candida.

Flagyl is ALSO a p50 inhibitor. Interesting that it is ALSO an antifungal.

Wake up! Candida can and usually IS a coinfection!

posted 09 December 2004 11:07               

Their antibody tests became negative so that is interesting. If it were merely candida, that would not likely happen.

Perhaps they had simple, uncomplicated lyme infections. Not everybody who gets antibiotics for lyme, relatively short term courses, gets candida "coinfections." So that is not a good answer here.

Perhaps others on diflucan here were not given high enough doses, and/or had coinfections. Perhaps one needs even stronger doses.

It is an interesting study.

posted 09 December 2004 13:04               

Betriebsarztliche Untersuchungsstelle, Bayerische Julius-Maximilians-Universitat, Wurzburg, Germany. Fritz.Schardt@mail.uni-wuerzburg.de

Just an idea that might be worth the time.

posted 09 December 2004 15:07               

My guess is that most lymies have only been on diflucan for short periods, or too small of a dose. I think what the trial did was to take the 200 mg once a day in a single dose.

posted 09 December 2004 15:27               

I doubt diflucan kills lyme. Highly. It does however kill yeast.

Therefore, thus, however, moreso, BLAH BLAH BLAH

HELLO? Its candida

I doubt you meant to try to insult me for voicing my opinion, by asking me not to insult the researchers.

posted 09 December 2004 19:56            

11 subjects??? That is hardly a study.

Again, just MHO.

posted 09 December 2004 20:16               

I doubt it is NOT my scientific basis, its my personal opinion. I also doubt I ever claimed to be a scientist!

we'd all be cured if all any of the research put forth was ever correct, now wouldnt we?

Lymenet isnt a "scientific board". I can put out my opinion when I want to, or post the obvious when I want to.

And thats MY opinion, and Im sticking to it.