They offer hyperthermia. I went for a consultation, and the way they do it is raise your body temperature to a fever, but they also give you doxy and through an I.V. give you 7,500mg of vitamin C. The theory is that the heat causes the spirochetes to come out of hiding, and the medication along side the huge boost to the immune system via C enables the body to attack.
They suggest 10 treatments and claim to have sucessfully treatment many who had chornic lyme.
While you are in hyperthermia, there is a blood pressure cuff on you, a heart monitor, thermameter, ....I think that is it, along with an I.V. running.
I don't know what else to try. The doctor is very lyme literate and knows about the big infectious disease doc in Zurich that doesn't believe in chronic lyme, and some of those people eventually find there way to hyperthermia he says.
Anyway, tomorrow I have my first try.
Mary
Posts: 1032 | From North Carolina | Registered: Aug 2003
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- There is no degree of heat that will kill spirochetes that is safe for a human.
I've read from several top LL authors that heat causes spirochetes to go into their protective cyst form.
Doxycycline also causes spirochetes to go into cyst form. I see nothing they are to give you that will address the cyst form at all.
Spirochetes HATE heat and will do all they can to burrow deeper and create their protective cocoons within us, even going deep into our bones.
Same with vibration.
Heat can be very dangerous for those with lyme.
I know you want this to work, and I hope (if you decide to do it) that it does.
For myself, I would never go this route. Now, this doctor may do things differently but in the past, with other doctors, there have been a few fatalities with hyperthermia treatments.
I researched Intracellular Hyperthermia Therapy (ICHT) as a possible option years ago. I spoke with some who went through it and some felt better but only for a while.
I considered going to Italy (before an Atlanta clinic was opened, then closed. Then they went to Mexico and a fatality forced closer of that clinic). I hear it's also being done now by a doctor in Germany.
Other major considerations:
1. MYELIN SHEATH
Also to consider is that, for many with lyme who have the characteristic myelin sheath damage to the nerve fibers, heat can be very dangerous and cause neurological damage that could be permanent.
This is where it's best to follow those diagnosed with "MS" (although we know "MS" can often be lyme or other chronic stealth infection) . . . with MS, the myelin damage dictates avoidance of heat.
2. LIVER
For those with lyme, the liver is often toxic and so overworked. HEAT HURTS THE LIVER, in such cases as it's forced to work beyond it's capacity. Liver damage can result but that also further stresses all body systems and organ.
3. The HEART often cannot handle heat and lyme.
4. Ditto for the ADRENALS.
Now, you may be one of the few with lyme who can handle high heat and do okay. If you are not, however, be very clear about the damage that can come from high heat so that you can cover all the bases as you further research is this would be a good fit for you or not.
I feel really badly pouring a bucket of water you your excitement about this, especially since you are to go tomorrow for your first treatment.
I guess, you've studied this in depth for some time and talked with many who have done it - and talked with everyone a year later, too.
So, I can only hope that there is something about this doctor or this clinic that might make this different from those who've done it in the past.
I also hope they have liver, heart and adrenal support for you. Not sure how they can help protect from myelin sheath heat stress, though, that's also important to have in place.
Take care. Best of luck to you. -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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lymewreck36
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 4395
posted
Hi again folks:
I have been through my first treatment. First of all, they raise your temperature to only 38.3 celcius, which is very close to 101 F. You stay at that temperature for 1 1/2, then they slowly start to bring you down.
NOt to forget that you have 7,500 mg vit C through an I.V., and you take your lyme/babs meds directly before treatment. For me that is quite a list, but everything is at a low dose because that is all my body can handle. Directly after treatment, you are given doxy.
I was quite dizzy after the treatment and exhausted. That night, I had deep bone pain like I used to have in the early days when my immune system could still produce a fever. Haven't had that in ages.
I could barely sleep. It was a night from hell, with central nervous system herxing, bone pain, and bug eyed all night despite my sleep meds.
The next day I was tearful the entire day, weepy, in pain, dizzy, in more pain........
The next day a little less of the after effect, and the next day, a little less. I go under again this coming Thursday. Then I start next week going twice a week.
I've had nothing to pin my hopes on after 12 years of treatment and two very recent suicidal episodes as my body was rejecting all my medications.
So I've pinned my hope on this, plus the doctor's appointment I have in 2 weeks in D.C. with a llmd that is willing to discuss a complete blood exchange.
Other than that, my journey is over. So, No, I haven't done heavy research into whether or not this is a cure. It is not as severe as ICHT was, which I remember very well from the early days when I joined this group many moons ago.
All I know is this, the treatment hit something, and my husband is committed to supporting this financial adventure as long as it takes, because he wishes to grow old with me, and I wish to with him, and I wish to witness the lives of my three children.
I have to try this. I don't have options to look at.
Maybe I'll be the first one on this group to run into an unexpected cure. Who knows. I just can't think it to death because I have no choices. If I could take high dose medication to control the symptoms, I would stick with that. But I can't.
Mary
Posts: 1032 | From North Carolina | Registered: Aug 2003
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Lymedin2010
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 34322
posted
What is the MAX they bring your body temp to?
I can easily bring my body temp to 101 by soaking in hot water for a few min. I use a thermometer while in the tub to check.
I have gotten my temp past 102 and at that point my heart beats faster. High temperatures increase vasodilation and your heart has to work harder to pump blood. I get dizzy and need to lay down after I get up from bath.
I lay down in bed with covers on to maintain temperature as long as possible, usually another 30 min & then it gradually decreases.
I feel much better afterwards, but it does not last for long. Usually a few hours. I think the spirochetes that I see in my blood turn to cyst form with the heat and then you feel better.
The heat also makes my blood more watery and fluid. When I get a finger prick or needle, it is harder to stop my bleeding after a hot bath and this lasts for hours after that.
Posts: 2087 | From NY | Registered: Oct 2011
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Tammy N.
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 26835
posted
lymewreck, thanks for sharing your experience with this.
I know how you feel....like it's a last resort sort of thing. The last 2 years for me have been the most difficult and this last year has been the worst.
A big unexpected turn around for me was treating parasites. I started with a rotation of different meds (Biltricide for 2 days, then Ivermectin and Pyrantel for 2 weeks, then Albenza for 2 weeks, then finally Alinia for 2 weeks).
I repeated this cycle twice and am now taking herbs with salt/c for the last 6 weeks+. I expect to go back on meds again soon.
Throughout all of this, I have been passing parasites EVERY SINGLE DAY for about 5 months. I am beyond shocked at this. I had NO CLUE I had such a monstrous infection.
Now I am coming to learn that most, if not all, of us have similar infections. The Lyme and co-infections have hijacked our immune systems. Our immune systems are not able to kill off the bugs....including parasites, so they just keep growing.
Since I began treating parasites my symptoms have improved greatly and my energy has soared. Some symptoms are creeping back but I am not surprised as I am killing so much that it's hard for the body to keep up. Plus we've started treating the lyme and co-infections and they are not happy.
But overall I am much better than I was. I've never felt more sure that I am finally on a path to wellness. I know it's a long haul, but at least I am on the path.
I just wanted to share some news of encouragement. Hang in there. It's wonderful you have a husband who loves you and wants you to be well. And three children. I pray you feel better so you can enjoy these beautiful blessings in your life.
Be well, Tammy
(breaking up paragraphs for easier reading for many here)
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96223 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Catgirl
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 31149
posted
Tammy is right (most docs are clueless about parasites). They are ALL over the world (part of nature).
Hang in there.
-------------------- --Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together). Posts: 5418 | From earth | Registered: Mar 2011
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Wow, thanks for your post. I pray that it is very successful for you.
Tammy N.,
I have just started a parasite cleanse. I am plateauing with ABX so before I change protocols I will give this about two to three months. For the first 3 weeks not much but the last 5 days I am starting to see results.
I will add Salt and C back as I get a little further along, had to stop because of increased blood pressure. I may add meds also but right now it is a lot of herbs including Mimosa twice a day. Now that I am getting results (not great but okay) I am going to go to 3 times a day and move it up to four as long as I can handle it. We shall see in about a week.
All the Best, MattH
Posts: 607 | From Houston Texas | Registered: Mar 2011
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sparkle7
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 10397
posted
I heard Tom Grier talking about using a hot tub with his treatment & he said it worked. It was on a Coast to Coast AM show - I think it was earlier this year. I think there were some posts here on Lymenet about it. You could do a search. I don't recall the abx he used but the theory is sound & it has worked for people.
This is not the same as heating your blood to kill spirochetes. This techique is just supposed to make the spirochetes move more towards the skin where the abx can work better - if I recall correctly. I may be off but he did use something like this & he did say it cured him.
I agree to try the anti-parasite herbs or drugs. They helped me alot.
Posts: 7772 | From Northeast, again... | Registered: Oct 2006
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beaches
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 38251
posted
From what I've heard, going into a hot tub at 104 degrees is good for you and kills the damn things.
104 is the key temp of the water, not YOUR temp. You should stay in for 15-20 minutes max.
Posts: 1885 | From here | Registered: Jul 2012
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Sammi
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
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posted
Mary, I appreciate you posting your experience with this.
You have been through so much. I hope this will help you.
Posts: 4681 | Registered: Oct 2000
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Abxnomore
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18936
posted
Sending you good wishes, Lymewreck. I hope your treatment is a success.
One thing to note is that the ICHT treatment that was done in Atlanta did not use DNP. That clinic later open a facility in Mexico which allowed it to use DNP. It was not affiliated with the ICHT treatment center in Italy.
The doctor in Mexico was an unqualified doctor who was not well versed in the protocol, didn't develop the protocol but stole it and tried to duplicate it and failed miserably.
His procedures were different than the one done in Italy and was dangerous and a total failure. That clinic closed down shortly after it opened.
I did the ICHT in Italy and 12 years later I am still totally free of all lyme symptoms and babesia. It was a lifesaver for me and my illness had gone undiagnosed for a very extended period of time and I was in bad shape with few options left.
To date I know of three others that I have kept in touch with who are still lyme free after doing the treatment in Italy.
(breaking up paragraphs for easier reading for many here)
[ 10-25-2018, 04:37 PM: Message edited by: Robin123 ]
Posts: 5191 | From Lyme Zone | Registered: Jan 2009
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Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
posted
Lwreck, I just sent you a PM, but hadn't read this thread before.
Sorry to know you are still in big trouble. But happy to know you are herxing (or similar to that)!
I guess the Vit C can do some job on many other issues too.
Blood exchange will probably not work (my feeling) as many pathogens are not in the blood.
Another question: is your sleeping place protected against electrosmog?
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
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Sammi
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 110
posted
Mary, how are you doing? How have your other treatments gone? Please check in when you can.
Posts: 4681 | Registered: Oct 2000
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poppy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5355
posted
Yes, we would like to hear an update on how this is going. Are they doing anything to control the herx?
Posts: 2888 | From USA | Registered: Mar 2004
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If you click on someone's profile, you can go thru their most recent posts.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96223 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
posted
If I read this correctly, Mary tried hyperthermic treatment sometime in 2012, 2 years AGO!!
I think she's still looking for treatments, I don't know the outcome of this specific treatment though... It can't do bad, I suppose, Vit C is known to be very helpful too.
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
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lymewreck36
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 4395
posted
Oh my gosh. Just found this thread and realize that people were looking for me. I'm back in the U.S. now, still struggling as ever with babesia, and recently told by Duke that my 16 years of positive babesia tests were false positives because they are all IgM's. Posts: 1032 | From North Carolina | Registered: Aug 2003
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Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
posted
How were the hyperthermia sessions years ago? helpful?
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
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lymewreck36
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 4395
posted
And here I am again, so much later. Hyperthermia brought me many good things thru detox effects. Really amazing, but still needed every bit of medication to keep going.
As time has passed, the years that is, I have gotten worse because Babesia keeps adapting, making it harder and harder to keep control and function. Some days, brushing my teeth feels Olympic.
Wishing everyone wellness
Posts: 1032 | From North Carolina | Registered: Aug 2003
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posted
I have had a horrible time with babesia! I tried antibiotics, herbs, mepron.
Have you considered bee sting therapy? I’m 3 months in. What a ride. It’s brought my babesia symptoms acute, air hunger especially. I’m hoping that this will finally be what helps me.
Posts: 133 | From North Shore | Registered: Sep 2015
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posted
I had Hyperthermia in 2015, it seemed to help a little bit the first couple of months back, but three months back and following their post treatment was worse than ever. I did not know I had bartonella and babesia when I went, I found out later that it would only help with lyme not with co infections. It was a waste of time and money.
Posts: 68 | From new york | Registered: Aug 2016
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