desertwind
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posted
Yes or No???
If you have leaky gut is it contraindicated to take probiotics?
I have heard/read conflicting view. One says no, do not take pro.'s if you have leaky gut because the live bacteria can enter into the bloodstream and cause a sort of bacterium/sepsis.
The other view says yes take it because you need pro.'s to heal a leaky gut.
I have H.Pylori and inflammation in my git(via endoscopy/stool sample results)and find lately when I take pro.'s I have a pretty intense body reaction - not a good one. Wondering if there is an issue with probiotics with permiable (sp) gut issues. Thoughts????
Posts: 1671 | From Tick Infested New Jersey | Registered: Apr 2010
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posted
I think EVERYONE in the world should be taking probiotics. How can you heal a gut without them??
Try kombucha, kefir, fermented vegetables, whatever floats your boat!
Also consider bone broth to heal the gut.
Which probiotic were you taking? Maybe you need dairy free?
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96220 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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desertwind
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posted
Ido need dairy free but have been taking VSL #3DS every other day. I know that is not dairy free but was suggested that I try it every other day to see how I do. Maybe that is the issue.
I take Ultra Flora and Health Trinity. I use to take Custome Pro.'s...
So maybe get my pro.'s via foods instead? What is bone broth!!!???!!!
Posts: 1671 | From Tick Infested New Jersey | Registered: Apr 2010
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posted
I'd say definitely take probiotics. It helps with mine for sure. There is also a really good set of protein shakes by Xymogen that help with gastro health, and I've seen great improvement on them. I'll PM you the names.
-------------------- You name it, I've got it. Full-time medical anomaly. Posts: 432 | From Southeast | Registered: Aug 2011
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-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96220 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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desertwind
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posted
I use to take that Xymogen drink - also DF2000 powder from Xymogen. Maybe time to get back on those two again. There is always a gut issue going on!!!
I will go back on the Healthy Trinity and Ultra Flora and maybe get back on Custom Pro. Maybe my body was reacting to the dairy AND corn in the VSL..
Thanks for the link Lymetoo!
Posts: 1671 | From Tick Infested New Jersey | Registered: Apr 2010
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TerryK
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Most of the reading I've done suggests that probiotics are part of the solution for leaky gut.
An article published in Clinical Gastroenterology, noted that a review of the literature indicated that the main function of probiotics is to reinforce the intestinal mucosal barrier against detrimental agents. That seems to reinforce the idea that they are needed to heal a leaky gut. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14507583?dopt=Abstract
Those who have a bad reaction to probiotics are likely experiencing die-off of bad bacteria as the good bacteria populate the gut. I'm sure there are other reasons for a reaction but that is probably the most common.
I am working on healing my gut and I am taking probiotics.
Terry I'm not a doctor
Posts: 6286 | From Oregon | Registered: Jan 2006
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desertwind
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posted
Great info. Terry. I tend to get the body/pain reaction at higher doses of the VSL#3DS. So possibly it is a die off or an allergic reaction to one of the other ingrediants in it.
Most of my symptoms come on at night after taking the VSL.
I will start back on a more gentle dosage - I was taking over 1,000 billion - maybe just too much for me. Also started herbs such as Slippery Elm, Marshmallow Root and Licorice Root to help heal my gut. LLMD put me on a protocol for H.Pylori and additional parasite meds. Working on it....
I appreciate all the info. on this topic. DW
Posts: 1671 | From Tick Infested New Jersey | Registered: Apr 2010
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Razzle
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posted
My gut is a mess, but I feel better and tolerate foods better when I take the probiotics. Yes, it is theoretically possible for probiotic strains to escape into the blood stream.
But that is rare and I have to wonder if the strains getting into the blood stream in these cases have been altered by GMO's or other bad influences and have become pathogenic instead of symbiotic.
Also, with h. pylori-induced gastric irritation, you may need digestive enzymes that do not contain HCl or high amounts of protease enzymes. Use bromelain and papain instead for protein digestion.
-------------------- -Razzle Lyme IgM IGeneX Pos. 18+++, 23-25+, 30++, 31+, 34++, 39 IND, 83-93 IND; IgG IGeneX Neg. 30+, 39 IND; Mayo/CDC Pos. IgM 23+, 39+; IgG Mayo/CDC Neg. band 41+; Bart. (clinical dx; Fry Labs neg. for all coinfections), sx >30 yrs. Posts: 4166 | From WA | Registered: Feb 2011
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posted
VSL has CORN too?? No wonder. You're getting GMO's as well then.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96220 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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beaches
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posted
Desertwind, would you mind PMing me your H.Pylori protocol?
Razzle, what are protease enzymes?
Posts: 1885 | From here | Registered: Jul 2012
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Razzle
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posted
Proteases are enzymes that digest protein containing foods. Papain (from papaya) and Bromelain (from pineapple) are examples of plant-based proteases and these are generally more gentle on the GI tract than Pancreatic-derived (usually from pig pancreas) protease enzymes.
-------------------- -Razzle Lyme IgM IGeneX Pos. 18+++, 23-25+, 30++, 31+, 34++, 39 IND, 83-93 IND; IgG IGeneX Neg. 30+, 39 IND; Mayo/CDC Pos. IgM 23+, 39+; IgG Mayo/CDC Neg. band 41+; Bart. (clinical dx; Fry Labs neg. for all coinfections), sx >30 yrs. Posts: 4166 | From WA | Registered: Feb 2011
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beaches
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posted
Thanks Razzle. I am trying to figure out the digestive enzyme thing.
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tickled1
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posted
Desert, I'd love the H. Pylori protocol too!!!
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tickled1
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posted
Freaked out by the thought of probiotics entering the bloodstream causing a type of sepsis.
I have H. pylori. Makes you wonder. If H. Pylori causes leaky gut can it also infect bloodstream? I believe H. Pylori is a spirochete also.
Posts: 2541 | From Northeast | Registered: Jan 2008
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Nasal Amphotericin B seems to be working well, as my facial swelling is markedly diminished.
This is an example where there is contradictory information. Sacc B is supposed to increase SIgA (a sign of leaky gut)but in my case this created other problems. I was on sacc B for over 5 years.
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tickled1
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posted
I also developed a problem from probiotics. I developed and overgrowth of lactobacillus from taking recommended dosage and often even less. This caused d lactate acidosis for me.
I am now told I can only take D lactate free probiotics. This is completely different than dairy/lactose free by the way. 2 completely different things.
D lactate is the by-product of lactobacillus and our bodies can't clear it well causing neurological problems.
Posts: 2541 | From Northeast | Registered: Jan 2008
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Razzle
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quote:Originally posted by beaches: Thanks Razzle. I am trying to figure out the digestive enzyme thing.
-------------------- -Razzle Lyme IgM IGeneX Pos. 18+++, 23-25+, 30++, 31+, 34++, 39 IND, 83-93 IND; IgG IGeneX Neg. 30+, 39 IND; Mayo/CDC Pos. IgM 23+, 39+; IgG Mayo/CDC Neg. band 41+; Bart. (clinical dx; Fry Labs neg. for all coinfections), sx >30 yrs. Posts: 4166 | From WA | Registered: Feb 2011
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desertwind
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posted
Lymetoo; Yes VSL does have corn in it. I called the company last year and they confirmed that it has a very tiny amount of corn in it but "not enough to cause a problem". I am off of it.
I ordered D Lactate free pro.'s from Custom.
I wonder about the neuro issues and D-LActate as most of my symptoms are neuro.
Also.....my Gastro (lyme friendly bless his soul!) said that chronic /untreated H.Pylori can cause neuropathy. I started with gut issues about 9 years ago and never treated H.Pylori - never even knew I had it.
Anyway, so much health concentrated in the gut. Beaches and Tickled - Pm sent...
Posts: 1671 | From Tick Infested New Jersey | Registered: Apr 2010
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tickled1
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Wow desertwind. We sound a lot alike. Wish I had your Gastro! So interesting about H. Pylori causing neuropathy! I really wonder if it could be the root of all my problems. Thanks for the pm!
Posts: 2541 | From Northeast | Registered: Jan 2008
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