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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » Mild Hyperbaric Treatment (Page 44)

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Author Topic: Mild Hyperbaric Treatment
tom f
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Does anyone else experience burning sensations during hbot? I am experiencing burning above the muscle but below the skin mostly in my thighs, calves and hands - do have nerve damage in thee areas. I notice the burning is even worse if a have juice/smoothie and then dive - this makes no sense at all.

[ 06-24-2019, 09:41 PM: Message edited by: tom f ]

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carbokitty
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Sorry Tom~so far that is not a symptom I have. I do get burning when I am exposed to mold but its more on my skin or on my tongue.

I wanted to check in. I have just finished my 60th dive. There is a problem with my oxygen concentrator and after troubleshooting with James at ADM where I purchased it, he is replacing it. It apparently is giving me less than 82% oxygen (beeps and the yellow light is on). I have continued to dive under those conditions.

I do feel as if I am cheating, however. After a week+ of abnormal gut symptoms (actually, what was normal for me prior to mHBOT) and disrupted sleep, I added some berberine (goldenseal tincture) and some activated charcoal. I am amazed that these small tweaks made such a huge difference! However, prior to mHBOT, goldenseal and activated charcoal did not make my sleep or my stools "normal" (formed). So for the time being, I am going to continue for a little bit, slowly reducing the berberine.

As an aside (maybe I mentioned this before), I did a hair analysis in January, shortly after starting mHBOT because some in the mold community feel that there is a connection between heavy metals and mold sensitivity. I had no issues with heavy metals, except silver (and so interesting that I had been at my parents condo and eating with actual silverware and not stainless). However, many of my nutritional minerals were low. I am guessing that is because I have been taking activated charcoal on and off for many years because of its ability to bind mold. I have since added back some of the lowest minerals. I do any of this very slowly due to so many sensitivities.

Sorry! Some of this is way off topic! Just wanted to check in. I know my use of mHBOT is a bit different from most of you-however, I feel very connected to this community, having read the whole thread and very grateful for everyone's shares of their journeys and especially for all the help I've received from Phoiph. Thank you!

Have a lovely day,

Carbokitty

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kgg
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Tomf, are you in the FB group for mild hyperbaric treatment? This has come up for discussion there.

Carbokitty, thanks for checking in! I think it is great that you have found those supplements finally helping. I get it. My young adult son takes things and they do nada. Just one more encouragement for him. Thanks!

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Marnie
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There are many causes of hyperlactatemia and the resulting

lactic acidosis

but the most common is increased production of lactate from anaerobic glycolysis

due to reduced oxygen delivery to tissue cells (tissue hypoxia).

https://acutecaretesting.org/en/articles/l-lactate-and-d-lactate-clinical-significance-of-the-difference


Borrelia burgdorferi contains a L- lactate dehydrogenase gene)

This subpathway is part of the pathway pyruvate fermentation

to lactate, which is itself part of Fermentation.

https://www.uniprot.org/uniprot/B7J121

In comparison, only LDH ( = L-lactate dehydrogenase )
activity was decreased by TUDCA treatment.

https://www.jci.org/articles/view/18945

TUDCA is a bile salt that contains taurine. It is being researched for many diseases.

Available OTC. IMO, might be best with Doxy too. Synergy.

Ultimate goal looks to be to suppress a liver enzyme called CYP7A1 (= cholesterol to bile salts).

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Phoiph
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tomf~

I don't have a definitive answer, but a theory based on my experience.

When nerves are damaged (as mine were; I had a lot of numb areas & small fiber neuropathy), the areas can be painful (or do strange things, such as twitch, or vibrate, etc.) when "re-awakened" by 02 under pressure.

My impression is that your nerves are responding to the oxygen, but it will take time for the sensations to normalize.

I'm not sure why you observe it to be worse when you have juice/smoothie beforehand, but it may have something to do with blood sugar levels. Maybe try a small high protein snack before instead to keep your blood sugar levels stable.

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susank
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I just did a dive after two years of not doing them.

I've had a rough past two years.

Lots of stress - allergies - jaw clenching - pain etc - which made getting in the chamber again seem impossible.

With the help of a friend I just did a test dive tonight - to see if my right ear would cooperate.

She helped me get in/out and did the zippers.

My goal was to make it to .5 PSI - see how my ears would do.

Once inflated the needle went to 1 PSI quickly - and I quickly dialed it down.

I went up and down between .5 and .8 for about half an hour. My right ear did better than expected.

I am hopeful.

Also concerned - getting in/out by myself is painful. I need ideas /help with this. I'm afraid I'm doing more damage to painful areas pre and post dive.

My shoulders are in bad shape - as well my back.

It feels like I'm pulling muscles doing all things "dive" except for the dive itself.

--------------------
Pos.Bb culture 2012
Labcorp - no bands ever
Igenex - Neg. 4 times
With overall bands:
IGM 18,28,41,66 IND: 23-25,34,39
IGG 41,58 IND: 39
Bart H IGG 40

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Phoiph
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Susan~

Getting in and out will get easier.

If you haven't already, you might want to try some very gentle stretching before you get in. You could get a beginning yoga DVD and do it before your session.

I know your chamber is small, but if you roll onto your stomach, then get on all fours before standing when you get out, you might find it easier.

I am so happy you are giving it another try!

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notthisguy
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Hi, im about to buy a mhbot unit for lyme but cant really decide which one to buy.
Im struggling between the brands: Summit2Sea, newtown and macy-pan.
i dont really want to buy a used chamber, because i have lots of allergies issues and dont want to risk it. well and also because of warranty.
I hope someone who followed this thread more closely can make a comment about those chambers.
I tried to dig through this thread but 44 pages is really really hard for someone in my condition.

kind regards

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Peimomma
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Susan you might try placing your chamber on a bed with the zipper on the side for easy entry and exit up higher off the ground.
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Peimomma
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Notthisguy
There are many users of both S2S and NT on the Facebook group with no issues. Macy-Pan is relatively new to the market so I don’t know anyone off the top of my head that has one but I’m certain there’s one in the group. Many have discussed the ease of exchange or repair with whichever company you go with to purchase your chamber.

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Kaibyrd
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Notthisguy, I’m kinda new to Summit to Sea, having just bought mine in November but I really like it. Very easy to use with the gauge on both the inside and outside, no smell when new, light inside from the white material used to make it. The zippers were a bit difficult to use to begin with but now they move very easy.

--------------------
KB

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susank
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Pei - Interesting idea. Thanks.

Trying to envision this. Rolling over into the chamber? What about the frame?

Know of any pics doing it this way?
Anyone? Could be sent to my email address?

So the window would be facing to the side?

I'm so tiny the Solace is fine size-wise.

When I did my test dive at a wellness place - it was a Vitaeris. IIRC on a platform with steps to walk up and use to step into it.
Of course the gal there helped me - IIRC held my hand to balance me / did the zippers and everything.

Looking at my chamber now while typing - dunno if possible to roll into it. Thinking about this. Thanks again.

Yes, Phoiph - I'm trying again.
My ears did better than expected - the rest of me - worse than expected.

--------------------
Pos.Bb culture 2012
Labcorp - no bands ever
Igenex - Neg. 4 times
With overall bands:
IGM 18,28,41,66 IND: 23-25,34,39
IGG 41,58 IND: 39
Bart H IGG 40

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notthisguy
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maybe some of you can help me finding a decision which brand to buy.
I'm wondering if anyone here has a summit to sea mhbot and could give me a quick review about their chambers. Do they gas off? How is the quality? Did you have any problems with it? etc.

Thank you very much in advance.

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elsworth
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I'd like to do a follow up on my post about clear PVC Hudson Masks.

I did reach out to Dr. Rhea's clinic in Texas, as Phoiph suggested. I bought one of their metal masks, and some tygon tubing. I've been using this mask daily for over three weeks now, up to 20 minutes per day. And I'm very happy to say that, things have been going much better.

The metal mask is never going to be as comfortable as a PVC flexible Hudson Mask, but at least I can use it without getting the hibbie jibbies after ten minutes (!)

If you are chemically sensitive, just go ahead and order a metal mask from Dr. Rhea's clinic. That would be my recommendation.

Now, onward to the next step. The chamber.

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Kaibyrd
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Ellsworth I think people have done this to make it easier to get into for some.

--------------------
KB

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elsworth
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Thank you Kaibyrd.

I deleted the original post, after I read the manual. It says you can put it on a bed without the frame in the manual. (Hey, men don't read instructions.)

My original question was can you put a Newtowne C4-34 on a bed without the external frame ?

The answer is, yes. But it would need to be a big bed. And you have to make provisions for not rolling off the bed when at pressure.

After doing my test inflation... the bed looks like it's outta here.

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Phoiph
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Hi Summit to Sea users...can you chime in to help notthisguy?

He could use some feedback on your experience with this manufacturer.

He is limited with his purchase options, as he is in Germany, and has to consider where to send a chamber in if it needs future repairs, etc.

Sending a chamber back to the states for repair would be cost-prohibitive, and the Summit to Sea factory is in France.

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Kaibyrd
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Phoiph, my reply is above.

--------------------
KB

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Phoiph
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Thank you, Kaibyrd...
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Kaibyrd
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You’re welcome Phoiph. 😊

--------------------
KB

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notthisguy
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Hi,
im wondering if anyone needed 1.5 ATA instead of 1.3 to get some symptome relief?
Since there are also 1.5 ATA chambers out there I always think maybe I just should pay extra to be on the safe side.

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Phoiph
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notthisguy,

As you may know, in the US, FDA regulations require home chambers to go no higher than 1.3 ATA.

I became well using 1.3 ATA, as have the majority of people I know.

I have heard of a few people who have modified their chambers, but this will void the warranty and prevent future repairs if necessary.

Things may be different in Germany, but I would research it carefully, and consider whether the extra cost is really warranted.

Many people with chronic illness will need to work up to 1.3 ATA gradually, and find the effects very powerful and effective at that dosage (if they are patient). A higher pressure doesn't guarantee a faster recovery, and would be too much for many.

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notthisguy
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germany doesnt care about FDA and doesnt regulate hbot.
we can even buy homechambers with 2.0 ATA (not that I would do it because of fire hazard, but it would be legal)
so the question really is just about if anyone found 1.3 ATA to be not sufficient but did well with 1.5 ATA (or even higher)

I'm pretty sure I will be one of the people who need to work up to 1.3 ATA since im very sensitive to everything (foods, supplements, medication.) But working up to something doesnt automatically exclude that higher pressures cant be worked up to and be more beneficial (if that makes sense?)


Also on another note:
how many people found that mhbot helped them with MCAS?
Because this is my biggest problem right now out of all my symptoms. I can only tolerate 3 different foods without having an anaphylatic shock.....

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Digby
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Notthisguy, I started with a big chamber at pressures around 2 -2.6 ATA. I did 20 sessions and didn't see any improvement, just felt worse (not a herx as far as I could tell). The mild chamber at 1.3 got me from home bound/dysfunctional to hiking and biking. I still have problems but I've been sick since 1974, so there is probably damage to my immune and nervous system. From my perspective I wouldn't go above 1.5 and for me 1.3 worked fine.
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Kaibyrd
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Just wanted to update.

2 weeks ago I had to have a tooth pulled. Last tooth on bottom right. I swelled up big time and had to go on antibiotics, Z-pac 5 day.

The swelling has almost gone away now and I thought the pain was nearly gone as well but Sunday night it started coming back. There’s no new swelling and everything looks like it’s healing well, there’s just pain. I’m not taking much ibuprofen now but I still need one 200mg 2-3 times a day.

Sometimes it feels like I may be having a reaction to the numbing shots I was given when the tooth was extracted. I get itching on the edges of where the numbing stopped and I still have a sore lump in the bend of the jaw where they like to give the injection most for those back teeth. Also, I asked for the shots without epinephrine because my heart races bad when given the shots that contain it.

I feel as if I’m starting over with hbot. Like I did a month in (in February) and I was so wiped out I couldn’t do anything at all. Does anyone have experience with dental issues early in their hbot treatment?

--------------------
KB

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kgg
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I too have to have lidocaine without the epinephrine. It makes my heart race too. Seems like it is a long time for it to still be swollen. Were you supposed to check back in with the dentist? I have bad teeth, runs in the family. So I can't blame my teeth work on mHBO. My dentist told me to dive after I had a tooth pulled to help with the healing. fwiw
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Kaibyrd
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I usually don’t have problems with my teeth but this one got a hairline fracture in it and was getting bad. I did go back last Monday but he said everything looked good. There’s very little swelling left now so I just don’t know what could be causing the pain I still have. Some of the pain is coming from the injection sites.

I was hurting too much when I got home the day of the extraction to dive but that’s the only day I missed.

--------------------
KB

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carbokitty
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Hi KB~
Sorry you are having pain. I wonder if maybe the injection hit a nerve? Or maybe caused some bruising at the site?
Have you tried putting heat around your mouth and does that help? It may help move any blood that's accumulated there that might be causing pain (like a bruise).
Sometimes people have ongoing problems with things called cavitations that occur at the extraction site where maybe some of the tooth was left. Its an infection that forms in the bone. But because the location of the pain seems to be on the gum and at the injection site, it, thankfully doesn't sound like a cavitation.
I hope it resolves soon and you feel better.
Carbokitty

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Kaibyrd
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Thank you Carbokitty. Yeah it doesn’t sound like a cavitation to me either but if it’s not better in a couple days, I’ll have to go back in.
I was using ice packs last week for the pain I had then but I haven’t tried heat yet. I’ll see if that helps.

--------------------
KB

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Digby
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I used to ask for the anesthetic without epi because of heart palps and a general wired feeling. I saw the dentist a couple of months ago and forgot to mention it. I was concerned but had no problems at all. I believe that is due to mHBOT. I am no longer chemically sensitive either.
Hang in there most things improve if you stay the course for the long haul. I had to learn not to micromanage my progress.

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carbokitty
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Hi! I thought I would give an update as I have completed 80 dives.
That goal seemed so unattainable and so far away and here I am! Although I am certainly not finished. Its just a milestone.

It was interesting reading Digby talk about learning not to micromanage symptoms. I am still doing that. I am actually glad to an extent that I am.

My symptoms and history and diagnosis are a bit different from others. I had a set back last month after eating a spicy burger out. Just as a reminder, my main symptoms are diarrhea and food sensitivities with a diagnosis of mold sensitivity and SIBO (small intestine bacteria overgrowth). Diving wasn't resolving the injury from the burger. Changes in diet weren't making a difference. I finally did another 2 fecal microbiota transplants. They had limited benefit. I finally added ginger in a tincture form at night before bed. Its recommended as a pro kinetic (to move the migrating motor complex in the small intestine). That seems to have settled and stabilized things.

In the meantime, I bumped up my dives to 90 minutes most days. That also helped somewhat.

I feel that mHBOT now has a better chance of doing some complete healing to my tender lining of the small intestine and the nerves with the bacteria out and not causing ongoing damage-and the ginger is apparently helping do that.

So that's where I am.

I also had a problem with the oxygen concentrator in that it would beep and the light would come on after I was in the chamber. James replaced it and its all been good every since.

Thank you all and especially Phoiph for your support and community.
Carbokitty

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Phoiph
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Thank you, Carbokitty.

I'm sure you have already done thorough testing, but are you familiar with the GI MAP (DNA Stool Analysis) by Diagnostic Solutions Lab?

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Digby
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The following link is a useful education for anyone wanting to understand mHBOT. It is one man's opinion and I don't necessarily agree with everything he says but it will be very useful for beginners and a great review for accomplished divers. FWIW... http://biotoxinjourney.com/the-case-for-mild-hbot/
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carbokitty
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Thanks Phoiph for the suggestion. I have not done that test. I have done several others for parasites but they can be notorious for false negatives. I have been positive for SIBO, small intestine bacterial overgrowth, so I know I have/have had that. I tested negative in January but my symptoms tell me I have sine relapsed. I will consider this test.
I have planned to retest for mold via urine in August but may push that back as I’ve had random (unplanned) exposures since I tested in January and started mHBOT.

Thanks everyone!
Have a great weekend!
Carbokitty

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Phoiph
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Carbokitty, I just sent you a PM.
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Jazzman
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I thought I would post an update. Last week I finally made it to 1h for oxygen under full pressure, wearing the oxygen mask. As I posted earlier, over the last number of weeks I have been slowly increasing the oxygen time a minute a day. When I reached 40 minutes I decided to go to 2 minutes at a time and the interval to 60 minutes was uneventful. As I also mentioned earlier, the timing I was using was timing the oxygen down at the end, instead of up st the beginning of a dive.

I did purchase an Oxymask, after using a Hudson type to start. I can't discern any real difference between the two in delivery: I found the Hudson to be a bit more comfortable and I think I will move back to using it.

Now I guess it's just a matter of being patient and making sure I am consistent in diving every day, which I have been other than when I had a few hiccups at my beginning this journey. No light switch moments, I have been sick a long time and really did not expect any, but I can say without a doubt my neuropathy is considerably better, just about completely resolved in my right hand. My left hand was much worse than my right, but now feels at a level my right used to feel at before diving and my feet have improved as well.

Too soon to comment on much else, but last weekend I did finish a woodworking project that has been sitting for 3 years and enjoyed the work and didn't feel it was a chore. I had a clear head and was feeling up energy levels and motivated.

Notthisguy, the unit I purchased gives the option of switching out the 1.3 ATA valves to 1.5 ATA valves, it ships with both. Because I have been sick for over 25 years I thought, like you, I may need the option of going to a deeper dive. I no longer feel this way, I am in no rush to go to higher pressures, if at all. My understanding is that anything over 1.5 ATA is no longer consider mhbot, but hbot.

One more thing I will say on this is that I used to live out west, close to the mountains, at a higher elevation. I have no current plans on moving back there, but life is strange so who knows. This is where going to 1.5 ATA may be a necessity as higher elevations affects the performance of mhbot chambers. So 1.5 ATA, at elevation, may actually be equal to around 1.3 ATA. There is information out there that I read on doing precise calculations on this effect.

A friend of mine wanted to know how long it will take before I know if it's working, I told it may be quite a while, maybe even a year or two, he did seem a bit surprised by this. I have this treatment, in my mind, kind of like aging. It's slow and gradual, hard to observe changes in the short term, but over a longer term, much more apparent.

Posts: 11 | From Canada | Registered: May 2019  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Digby
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Member # 3888

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Jazzman....Awesome update! Thanks for sharing.
Posts: 443 | From NW Arkansas | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
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