I have hypercoagulation much worse than most other Lyme patients according to my doc. Seems like I should treat it if that's the case.
However, heparin is he treatment of choice, and my doc has a long list of antibiotics that aren't allowed to be used with heparin. Basically all penicillins, cephalosporins, and tetracyclines. Problem is that I'm always on one of these.
So my question: have any of you used heparin even while on these classes of antibiotics, or do you know of other highly effective hypercoagulation treatments that maybe I could try?
Thanks! Sam
Posts: 748 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2015
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Jordana
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I've never been on heparin. But aren't there other blood thinners? I think coumadin? Or is that heparin?
I know aspirin is very effective at blood thinning; turmeric -- lots of other herbs do it and reishi mushrooms.
Posts: 2057 | From Florida | Registered: Feb 2015
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I use several types of systemic enzymes together. Nattokinase has blood thinning properties.
Other things known to thin the blood include ginkgo biloba, garlic, fish oil, vitamin E, and various mushrooms. One time I ate a portobello cap and nicked myself the next morning, definitely bled more (long before I was taking supps or knew about Lyme).
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Jordana
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Sam, how do you know you have hypercoagulation, and how does the doctor tell if it's "worse" than other people's?
Posts: 2057 | From Florida | Registered: Feb 2015
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Yeah, there's Coumadin too, but my doc says "nothing holds a candle to heparin" when it comes to treating hypercoagulation. He has a list of antibiotics that you can't take with Coumadin either.
I do take fish oil and such but it doesn't seem to be enough. Maybe I could try lunbrokinase or something.
My doc does several blood tests to check your coagulation. Thrombin/anti-thrombin complexes or something like that. There's several different blood tests he uses.
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Jordana
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Okay - I was curious because I looked up the tests and I hadn't heard of any of them. A lot of us think we have this but have never been tested.
Posts: 2057 | From Florida | Registered: Feb 2015
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If I feel well enough to find may papers sometime I'll let you all know what tests he used on me. Seems like this could be an important part of the puzzle for some of us.
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Catgirl
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Agree with gz, systemic enzymes help. Fascinating gz, I didn't know mushrooms did that!
Sam, the fry bug causes hyper coagulation (something to consider).
-------------------- --Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together). Posts: 5418 | From earth | Registered: Mar 2011
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Yes, the Boluoke (sp) [lumbrokinase] may help. I was treated with heparin and I'm pretty sure I took some of those abx. Maybe they didn't know about the interaction back then.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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bluelyme
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My doc said hep has a half life of like 3 hrs and breaks up biofilm ?...venom really helps my thick blood flow ...also dr c says proto when attacked will thickin blood ..also thinking ginko ,asprin and lumbrokinase in high dose
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I've worried about the Fry bug. I wonder if I have it. Maybe that's why I can't get well.
My only difficulty with Boluoke is the timing. I'd love to try it though. Glad to hear you might have taken heparin with these abx Lymetoo, I'm tempted to try heparin along with them too and see what happens.
I think the only reason you're not supposed to is because they reduce the effects of heparin. But I'd think maybe it would still have at least some effect. Not completely sure though.
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Tincup
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WPinVA
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I tried all the enzymes and they didn't do enough.
Currently taking aspirin. You could also try willow bark, the natural source of aspirin.
but make sure your doc is ok with you switching. some people need heparin and aspirin.
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Tincup
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Just so you know... LLMD said aspirin, cumiden and other blood thinners won't do the same as heparin if it is Lyme related.
So please don't think aspirin will help or do what is needed. Don't want to see anyone get worse because they didn't know.
quote:Originally posted by Tincup: Just so you know... LLMD said aspirin, cumiden and other blood thinners won't do the same as heparin if it is Lyme related.
So please don't think aspirin will help or do what is needed. Don't want to see anyone get worse because they didn't know.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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TX Lyme Mom
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Because my husband has taken Coumadin for several decades, we are aware that vitamin K is contraindicated because it has blood thickening effects. For this reason, vitamin K is seldom included in most nutritional supplements, but I vaguely recall that there is one popular chewable, chocolate-flavored vitamin supplement which contains vit K -- can't remember which one it is now, but it comes in a box and is sold OTC. (It might be ViActive(?), or some name like that.)
Bottom Line: Make sure than none of your vitamin supplements contains any vit K because it has strong blood thickening properties. We bought some of it once and had to throw it out after it caused odd symptoms in our daughter, but again my memory is vague, so please don't ask me what symptoms she experienced -- most likely bad headaches, if I had to guess.
Also, because my husband must be careful not to consume too many sources of vit K, it is good to be aware of foods like liver which are good sources of vit K. Also, V-8 juice is on the list of foods to avoid or to restrict for patients who take blood-thinning medications (either Heparin or Coumadin).
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Tincup
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Glad you added that TX MOM. Good info. Important!
I use to have to take RX Vitamin K for many years, till after Lyme when I now have the complete opposite situation.
I also loaded up on tomatoes, dk. green veggies, and other food that added Vit K.
And yes, I've seen Vit. K in some vitamins and supplements over the years (since no RX is now needed), so I'm glad you mentioned that. Good reminder for me to check mine just in case!
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