Topic: Not okay to take VSL #3 or Saccaromyces Boulardii with a picc line?
dbpei
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 33574
posted
I just learned that it may be dangerous to take these 2 probiotics when you have a picc line or central line. Apparently they can cause your your line to become blocked due to a fungus forming in your blood. These are the two probiotics my LLNP has instructed me to take!
I will call her next week to ask about this. I have been searching for scholarly articles on this and have not been able to find. Do you know anything about this?
Posts: 2386 | From New England | Registered: Aug 2011
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posted
I know nothing. Why wouldn't the probiotics help prevent a fungus?
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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dbpei
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Member # 33574
posted
You would think so. I believe it has something to do with this particular probiotic causing the picc line to become blocked if particles of it enter the line from contamination.
I always wash my hands thoroughly before doing my infusions, so I probably do not have to worry. But when it comes to anything to do with picc line, I am extra cautious.
Hopefully I (or someone on Lymenet) will be able to find the literature on this.
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Rumigirl
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posted
I don't think there is a problem at all. I've had a port for 6+ years and have taken both probiotics all along---or at least most of the time. My doctors have recommended them. I've never heard or read that there is a problem.
As we know, taking probiotics is essential when taking abx. ANd Saccharomyces boulardii is also essential.
I believe that your LLNP is correct!
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sammy
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posted
Please take your probiotics...
But...
Wash your hands carefully always before handling your PICC Line.
You should also keep the line covered at all times to prevent bacteria, viruses, dust, etc... from getting lodged into the end of your end cap.
Use a clean cut tall sock, or you can buy pre made covers, or tubular stocking that can act as a cover over the whole PICC line.
What is best, if you can get them from your infusion co, are alcohol imbedded cover caps (brand names like Swab Caps & Curos caps) that snap on and protect the injection end cap of the PICC.
So, back to answer your question again more directly. There have been studies done that included ICU patients with central lines who were given powdered S. Boulardii.
They found a slight increased risk In blood stream infections associated with the powder S.Boulardii.
Now, don't get scared. They hypothesized that the increased infection risk came from airborne spores from the powder being administered.
They also suspected direct contamination due to the nurses handling the powder then not washing hands or not changing gloves and proceeding directly on to administering IV medications.
So in the end, the studies have not been shown to directly connect the use of S.Boulardii or any probiotic to be detrimental.
In fact, they have proven benefit in the recovery and survival of patients!!!
**Take away points: -wash your hands after taking probiotics. -wash hands before touching PICC line - S.Boulardii capsules and VSL capsules may likely be safer -Probiotics have shown benefit in health and survival of ICU patients! That's great news for us
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dbpei
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posted
Thanks so much for this good info, Rumigirl and Sammy.
I am vigilant about clean hands and protecting picc line with covers and swab caps and probably over-do the alcohol swabs and washing hands. But I am super anxious about infection going to my heart with picc line, so am very careful.
I will definitely continue with probiotics and good hygiene with regard to picc line. I feel better after reading above.
Posts: 2386 | From New England | Registered: Aug 2011
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sammy
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Dbpei, I'm glad to hear that you are meticulous with cleanliness when handling your PICC line. Many people do not understand how utterly important it is!
Sometimes (often) i cringe in fear when I read that people have PICC lines or ports and are so casual with the use and care of them. How their very lives are at risk by even having the PICC or port!!!
I wish that I could put some kind of instructions/ guidelines out here to help people better care fore their lines themselves. Or make sure that their nurse is doing what she/ he is supposed to do in sterile procedures. Knowledge is power!
The Infusion for Lymies or whatever it is called, is greatly lacking and severely misguides people. Again, teaches you to be too casual. Not proper technique at all! People please don't refer to it.
Just ask questions here instead. No matter how silly or small you think they are. We have the life experience, some of us like me have the medical experience to really help out!
I've also had PICC lines fore 2 years for before getting my Port in 2012. Each PICC lasted over a year with good care. (I got the Port since I have poor veins due to Ehlers Danlos Syndrome and need IVIG infusions for my CVID immunodeficiency every other week.) I was told that with good care, a Port can last up to 10 years! So that is my goal.
That may seem a bit off topic but care of the Central line, PICC, or Port is always iimportant. Above we were referring to the of risk of sepsis/ life threatening blood infection with the use of probiotics. The answer was, as usual, multifaceted but thankfully clear cut.
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dbpei
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posted
Thanks so much Sammy. I hope your IVIG therapy helps you to get well!
There is a very helpful (closed) group on Facebook called PICC Line Club 2. There are a few nurses in the group that provide good information. Focus is on care of the picc line or port and problems that arise with them - but the focus is not on the medical conditions that cause us to have the lines.
The group has been a God send for me. Probably not for everyone, but by joining, it helped me to determine better dressing and care of my picc line due to allergic reactions in the past. The posts often alleviate (although sometimes raise!) my anxiety and experienced members are quick to provide help and answers.
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Rumigirl
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A word of warning, which you may have already gleaned: When you have your nurse, or a family member or friend, change your PICC dressing, ALWAYS watch like a hawk that they are doing absolutely
everything that they should be doing, and nothing that they shouldn't be doing (after learning the ropes). Too many nurses are too lax and will skip what is essential, or take short cuts, etc.
You can't afford to let that happen! Never be afraid to watch, to speak up, the step in yourself, when need be. Your life depends on it.
It has horrified me when I had friends who wouldn't speak up and just let it go, putting their life in danger!
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dbpei
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Member # 33574
posted
You are so right about that, Rumigirl! Finding a competent nurse to do dressing changes is huge - especially when you have to find your own nurse after insurance will not cover IV ABX treatment.
I have gone through many and it is so scary when you see them doing things the wrong way and putting you at risk. I have had to speak up on more than one occasion and have moved on to other nurses because of this.
A friend of mine just shared one of the articles that better explains the danger of using sacro b while having a picc line. Some of the LLMD's advise against taking sacro b while with a picc line for this reason. I want to pass it on to others so you can discuss with your LLMD and make the best decision for yourself.
posted
I was taking those same 2 probiotics while on my picc line for 4 months and didn't have a problem. My LLMD was the one who instructed me to take them. I wouldn't worry.
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bluelyme
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I saw mold in my house , totally freaked to do any more infusions ...crap...
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