Tincup
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5829
posted
QUOTE- "Tai chi mind-body treatment results in similar or greater improvement in symptoms than aerobic exercise, the current most commonly prescribed non-drug treatment, for a variety of outcomes for patients with fibromyalgia.
Longer duration of tai chi showed greater improvement. This mind-body approach may be considered a therapeutic option in the multidisciplinary management of fibromyalgia."
Brussels
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posted
great paper, thank you TC!
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
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Keebler
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posted
- Yes, Thanks a bunch for bringing this to our attention.
As this hits on a tender point / passion point so to speak, so I have some thoughts that I hope will help others avoid some of the misery I pushed upon myself in earlier times.
Very similar to Tai Chi but much easier for those with any vertigo issues is QIGONG. There is some research on that, too.
With Tai Chi, there is a good deal of turning the head and "traveling" sideways. I found this too challenging with vertigo and also takes more energy. So, just to share with others: check out both QiGong and Tai Chi.
There are many different forms of each, some restorative and healing and some more militaristic -- so do explore before just showing up to any class. Be sure the instructor is certified to teach the specific form they teach, too.
The class I took, well, I had to lie down for much of it. Sometimes, sitting can be accommodated, too. The point is that it's better to learn the form from a certified instructor (so that we see and get the feel of the precise movement that will work with the nerve pathways of the body, etc.) even if we have to adapt for our energy levels, etc.
There are entire forms that are also just sitting for those who require such. They also provide excellent medical benefit. -
[ 03-25-2018, 03:33 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- For anyone new to lyme:
Aerobic exercise is not suggested. In fact, most LLMDs strongly advise against it. Exercise, however - as in good movement that works well for a person - is a vital aspect of any protocol, though.
Because of the immune system dysfunction, the dysfunction of the various nervous systems (yes, various) . . . and the dysfunction that so often also occurs with the endocrine / adrenal system . . . well, aerobic exercise can do damage.
[As with the ill effects heat can have on most with lyme . . . just as there are the few rare folks who can not just tolerate heat but do well . . . same, too, for a few regarding more ambitious exercise. If someone does great during and afterwards (really with no "payback"), that's to be considered and discussed with their LLMD. There are always exceptions.]
Other methods of movement are plentiful, though. Each person needs to find what will work for them.
Light weight training of some help, see the thread below for more of that. But focusing now on the QI (Chi) kinds of exercise . . .
I know the point of the article is that even non-aerobic movement can be vital . . . and good for them to bring that up . . . .
As for "aerobic exercise, the current most commonly prescribed non-drug treatment, for a variety of outcomes for patients with fibromyalgia."
That can advice can be very dangerous for many with any kind of chronic illness especially when it involves chronic infections as fibromyalgia so often does since it's often undiagnosed lyme, other tick borne infection or chronic stealth infection like mycoplasma or Cpn.
The people who espouse that aerobic advice are ignorant of many key facts for the population they advise. And this can cause more pain and suffering - and even long term damage in some cases. -
[ 03-25-2018, 03:53 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- For anyone - new to lyme or not - who has any trouble with energy output & the unreasonable demands of payback:
By Dr. Denise Nagel - Huffington Post - Jun 22, 2016
Excerpts:
. . . Calming the mind and calming the body allows healing.
Strengthening the muscles through simple postures and movements prevents falls.
Moving with flow and gentle weight bearing helps balance and can positively impact bone density.
Achieving a relaxed state of the mind reduces stress. These are some of the simple premises that underlie the health benefits of Qigong and Tai Chi. . . .
. . . [the author's] teacher, Dr. Ming Wu, introduces tai chi walking during the first beginning tai chi class because he believes it is much simpler to learn and done properly achieves all of the benefits of a much more complicated tai chi form. . . .
Just one of many healing styles of QiGong, a good place to start: SOARING CRANE
I think, too, it's easier to learn QiGong first and then proceed to Tai Chi. Or start, as the author in article above with Tai Chi Walking.
Google has some great links and YouTube links with a search for: "tai chi walking" -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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posted
Ihaven't been able to get anywhere with fibro sx with tai chi or even exercise. For me, it's a combo of taking turmeric for the inflam, plus tissue work to get the spasms out of the muscles, which I've done by stretching in the pool, and squashing the spasms with my thumb!
Posts: 13116 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
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posted
- Robin,
Glad you shared your experience so that this might be put in better context.
For others who might want to explore, while the benefits can vary person to person - the benefits are often more subtle.
First, I always see "fibromyalgia" as one symptom of lyme - the pain of the fibrous tissues. The toxicity of lyme explains a lot about this as does decreased circulation that comes with lyme / other TBD.
I'm not sure the many benefits I noticed were related to the actual fibro myalgia pain but more so just a lift a bit more toward well being . . . and practical matters such as how to best turn around in my kitchen and handle my body when balance is off
or there's too much activity around me. The way I learned to feel grounded with "chi" at my center was very valuable. For myself, it was much more toward vestibular therapy.
And, when I was able to get out and do this, it was in a secluded and quiet park . . . or in a tutor's nature filled studio close by. That mattered, too, the locale and the people around. Sadly, unable to do that now but still do some on my own.
I also used / use many herbal and nutrient supplement to address the actual tissue pain issues. Still, some of the mood lifting from QiGong was really nice. Kind of like after a yoga class or similar. I think the routines do help with circulation and easing of some tight muscles - yet as part of plan.
I'd never say either QiGong or Tai Chi would be a solo agent for the kinds of change required for serious chronic conditions.
Chronic lyme requires a much stronger stance regarding antioxidants / liver support & the direct treatment of infections, to address the cause. It's all so very complex.
Body work like massage was really the most helpful to relieve pain for me (when I could afford that). I think that massage were available to everyone weekly, many of us would be so much more comfortable in our skin. -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Tincup
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5829
posted
Brussels... You are welcome!
Keebler... Your additional info is much appreciated. Your hard work and time it takes to share all that you do is also appreciated. Thank you!!!
Robin 3957295... Do you know of some way to take the turmeric?
I don't cook much at all (no stove, can't stand that long to do it, and am extremely tired of cooking), so looking for some way to get it in me without taking any more PILLS!
I have a bag of powdered form, but it looks icky to try to eat, like eating dry flour, so any tips would be nice! Thanks!
posted
Hey Ms Tincup - I get the turmeric in bulk at the health food store. Sounds like you have the equivalent there.
I get 00-size empty capsules at the health food store, dip one in the powder and take one in the am and pm. It's very easy to do. I feel it working fairly quickly, re taking down the swollen feeling in my knees.
Do the dipping away from anything you care about, since its yellow color will stain anything. I usually do the dipping over the sink.
Posts: 13116 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
posted
Tincup, I just found out that I can't support much turmeric in powder form... I don't know why, my stomach does not appreciate it.
So I tried the root version, food. In fact, the fresh root tastes, in my opinion, milder and better than powder.
The powder is too dry. The root is like ginger, but less strong than ginger.
I use it as I would use garlic, ginger: I peel it, cut in small pieces and do any food with it: it could be a curry, it could be rice, potatoes, meat, whatever really.
Think of the root as garlic: we use garlic for everything, so we can use turmeric for everything too!! Any veggies can have turmeric as a spice.
I don't love the taste, I prefer garlic, but whatever. It's an alternative.
And turmeric root lasts a long time in the refrigerator. Weeks, really. I put it in a paper box, a bit covered with a plastic bag (not to get too dry in the refrigerator).
As Robin said, though, its yellow color stains easily. In powder form, it flies everywhere.
In root form, it's easier: you just have to be aware to protect your clothes and your cutting board will be yellow too.
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
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