riversinger
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 4851
posted
Lately I've been seeing a number of people mention they are treating Babesia with Flagyl. This is a new one on me, and wonder if anyone can go into more detail.
Any written info on it? Fantastic successes? This would make babesia treatment so much more affordable if it is actually successful. I'd love to take the info to my doctor, who I know has some patients with really tough reactions to Mepron.
posted
Up for some input (hopefully) It sure would give a person some incentive to struggle thru a stretch of flagyl!
Posts: 740 | From BC Canada | Registered: Mar 2003
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minoucat
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Member # 5175
posted
I've been on both flagyl and tinidazole in strong doses (2000 mg/day) for several months at a time, in combo with Rocephin and with doxy. Apparently it did nothing for the Babs; certainly it wasn't a cure for me or my husband. The mepron/zith/artemisinin seems to be the first thing that's touched babs for us.
The flagyl tx was aimed at the cyst form of Bb. I don't know if the reason it failed was because I was still infected with babs.
breathwork
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Member # 567
posted
I have Babesia WA1...rather than microti... I've had it twice from different bites..
First treatment....
6 months mepron and zith...did absolutely nothing.
6 months flagyl and zith....knocked titers down by half.
6 weeks Lariam, starting with huge loading dose...killed off the babs...
Six months pass, then I'm bitten again...I'm a tick magnet.
Second infection, second treatment list...
6 weeks Lariam, starting with huge loading dose (in February)...No change in titre what so ever...
Been on Flagyl and zith ever since...got the all clear...zero titer... on August 1st.
According to Dr. S in San Francisco....treating for babesia is a matter or rotating meds til you get the desired response. The bug, particularly the WA1 strain, is tough to erradicate with one form of treatment sometimes.
Either way, Flagyl certainly took a bite out of Babesia for me with both infections....
Apparently, Flagyl in concert with an antibiotic are used in Europe for babesia infection.
The combination of Flagyl and zith are pretty effective for lyme too, so I think of it as a bargain treatment!
posted
Babesia WA1? Babesia microti? What's the difference, and how can they tell? Do they automatically test for different strains? This is getting confusing!!
Posts: 459 | From Connecticut - just across the river from the Lymes (Old Lyme, Hadlyme, East Lyme, South Lyme & Lyme) | Registered: Oct 2000
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breathwork
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 567
posted
Babesia WA1 is predominantly in the Pacific Northwest region of the US. It has been found elsewhere, but mostly here...
Microti is the strain found mostly in the East.
The standard Babesia test only tests for the microti strain.
The test for WA1 was developed a couple years ago and is done only by the Sonoma County Health Department in California. Yes, Igenex forwards its WA1 tests to the Sonoma County Health Department lab.
Several lyme docs in the bay area treat for babesia based on symptoms rather than based on blood work. If a patient is negative on blood work but still has the symptoms, they treat for babesia anyway.
I was told that there are many strains that we do not test for currently, so treating based on symptoms makes sense to me.
I'm sorry that I haven't posted about my flagyl use here previously....I thought I had..I know of at least eight other patients in my area who use it and are having good results. We all see Dr. S in San Francisco.
riversinger
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 4851
posted
breathwork, thanks for posting. You may have been one of the ones where I saw it mentioned. I guess it just goes to show that there are really no rules when it comes to tick borne infections.
We are all an experiment in progress. I will let my doctor know about this, because I am fairly sure he is not aware, but he highly respects Dr. S.
Though I haven't tested positive for babs, I have had some heart problems that make me wonder, and I have been having heart herxes on Tinidazole and Zithro. I assume Tini would have similar results to Flagyl, so it could be hitting seronegative babs, as well as Lyme.
[This message has been edited by riversinger (edited 19 September 2004).]
riversinger
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Member # 4851
posted
For me, my heart rate gets elevated, running 130bpm even when (trying to) sleep. I also get short of breath, and usually have chest pain.
It stops within a day of stopping the tinidazole, and until I start tini again, I actually feel good afterwards. You know, that rare, unusual term "feeling good?"
They are checking to see if anything else is going on with my heart, but so far nothing is turning up, so we are assuming it is a herx.
quote:Originally posted by riversinger: For me, my heart rate gets elevated, running 130bpm even when (trying to) sleep. I also get short of breath, and usually have chest pain.
I started with this when I first went on clindamycin/Q for babs 4 yrs ago. I still have to take atenolol for the palps and tachycardia. ---------------------
breathwork said, "Several lyme docs in the bay area treat for babesia based on symptoms rather than based on blood work. If a patient is negative on blood work but still has the symptoms, they treat for babesia anyway."
If all LLMD's did this, there would fewer problems with people not recovering from Lyme, since many are walking around with babs and don't know it.
You basically can't get over Lyme if you have babs also and don't get treatment for it.
My bloodwork was "borderline" for babs and I herxed from here to the moon!
riversinger
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 4851
posted
Going by symptoms can be tough, too. the only things I tested positive for were Bb and HME. The symptoms that had me concerned about coinfections are headaches and the heart stuff, which people bring up in referrence to Babs and Bart. But I don't have a lot of the other symptoms that might point me in a specific direction.
So if Zith and Flagyl can treat both, that may be why I am doing so much better on them. Anybody else used Flagyl for Babs?
breathwork
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 567
posted
Sorry to take so long getting back to you...
I was tested for Babesia Microti several times over the first two years of treatment. All negative.
I then went on IV Rocephin for nine months. After nine months I had improved dramtically on the neuro lyme symptoms, but plateaued. That's when the doc suspected babesia....coincidentally it was when the test for the WA1 strain was first available.
I tested off the charts for WA1 at that time. How we treated it over the next year or so is listed above.
I was reinfected last summer with lyme and babesia WA1.
During all of my babesia tests I was on medications for lyme.
The "heart herx" that you describe is how my babesia presents actually...shortness of breath, palpitations and rapid heart rate when lying down, neck pain and headaches that come and go each day....all of it miserable.
All of those symptoms have disipated now that my babesia titer is down.
I've stayed on the zith and flagyl since the negative babs test the first of August. We'll reassess tomorrow when I see my lyme doc.
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