Could this really be the first step to an admission that chronic active Bb infection is possible, by the big-wig powers-that-be?
-------------------- -Razzle Lyme IgM IGeneX Pos. 18+++, 23-25+, 30++, 31+, 34++, 39 IND, 83-93 IND; IgG IGeneX Neg. 30+, 39 IND; Mayo/CDC Pos. IgM 23+, 39+; IgG Mayo/CDC Neg. band 41+; Bart. (clinical dx; Fry Labs neg. for all coinfections), sx >30 yrs. Posts: 4166 | From WA | Registered: Feb 2011
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Ann-OH
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posted
It looks like it is something that should have been tried years ago. they do have a new method. It could be the answer to decent treatment - but you have to be diagnosed first…..
TF
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posted
"The top 27 drug candidates from the 165 hits were confirmed to have higher anti-persister activity than the current frontline antibiotics. Among the top 27 confirmed drug candidates from the 165 hits, daptomycin, clofazimine, carbomycin, sulfa drugs (e.g., sulfamethoxazole), and certain cephalosporins (e.g. cefoperazone) had the highest anti-persister activity."
I found the above quote very interesting because of the lyme and coinfection treatment that I received and because I got RID of lyme, babs, and bart 9 years ago now.
After my doc treated my lyme with high dose amoxi, probinecid and flagyl, he went on to treat my bart for 1 month and then my babs with Bactrim DS for 11 months.
Bactrim hits bart and babs. And, the interesting thing about bactrim is that it contains as one of its 2 ingredients sulfamethoxazole.
Now, sulfamethoxazole is named in this new research article as having top activity against persister lyme bacteria. Persisters are inactive lyme bacteria that cannot be killed by the same meds that kill the active form of lyme. (But, they are not the cyst form.)
So, was I cured because after treating my lyme my doc used Bactrim on me for so long? (He only treated my babs with Bactrim because I could not take Mepron/zith.)
For those who don't remember, recently there was another post about lyme persisters. That thread is here:
poppy
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posted
Cefoperazone (cefobid) is listed here but I have never heard of anyone in the U.S. getting it for lyme. Is it available here? Unfortunately it is IM/IV only, no pills. One side effect is vitamin K deficiency.
And not everyone can do bactrim because of sulfa intolerance. Wasn't that what Charlie in TX was on for so long that damaged his kidneys and ultimately killed him? All because he could not get a lyme doc there and was self treating with drugs from Mexico.
That list of drugs includes some that are not commonly used because they have worse side effects. Hoping they will find more tolerable drugs for persisters.
Posts: 2888 | From USA | Registered: Mar 2004
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Bringing this back up to discuss the best abx for persisters.
Carbomycin seems to be the best oral abx for killing persisters. Unfortunately, hardly any pharmacy sells it, it's molecular weight is 841, and thus doesn't cross the BBB, AFAIK.
The best IV persister abx is daptomycin. It's mass is around 1,600, so it has a hard time getting through the BBB, also.
"Daptomycin does not cross the blood–brain barrier and does not penetrate the cerebrospinal fluid of normal individuals. However, there was a 5% penetration (relative to serum) of daptomycin into the cerebrospinal fluid of rabbits with Streptococcus pneumoniae meningitis, resulting in clearance of the infection in this model."
Has anyone seen the total list of abx that were tested - all 150+?
I'd like to see how the quinolines fared. I don't see any in the top 27 listed.
Posts: 37 | From Florida | Registered: Aug 2009
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Ann-OH
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It looks like you would have to go to the FDA drug library for that.
from the paper's methods and materials: Antibiotics and the FDA drug library Antibiotics, including doxycycline, amoxicillin, metronidazole, clofazimine, and sulfamethoxazole (SMX), were purchased from Sigma and dissolved in appropriate solvents25 to form stock solutions. All antibiotic stocks were filter-sterilized using a 0.2 µm filter. The FDA-approved drugs were assembled according to the Johns Hopkins Clinical Compound Library (JHCCL) version 1.3.26 The FDA drug library was prepared as 10 mM stock solutions in dimethyl sulfoxide and was arrayed in a total of 24 96-well plates, leaving the first and last columns in each plate for controls. Each drug solution in these master plates was diluted with phosphate buffer solution to produce 500 µM pre-diluted plates. The first and last columns in each pre-diluted plate included a blank control, doxycycline control, and amoxicillin control. The pre-diluted drug plates were sealed and stored at −20°C."
posted
I don't think that would give me the results from the study - just an approved list of FDA drugs. The authors of the study should have provided the results for all of the drugs they tested. I bet there is a whole bunch of them that are virtually worthless against the persisters and yet they keep getting prescribed.
Of the ones listed in the study, it seems like metronidazole is a complete waste of time and money, which contradicts the Sapi study, as far as I can tell. I wish they had provided values for minocycline, too. Tetracycline beats doxy in killing persisters.
Even the best persister killer, daptomycin, still left 28% organisms alive. We need better abx.
Posts: 37 | From Florida | Registered: Aug 2009
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Ann-OH
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