posted
Anyone have edema in legs? I have it and it seems to be getting worse. My physical therapist showed us how to wrap them at night and I try to do it every night. If I forget, the pain is much worse in the am.
I have not had much luck with compression stockings, although I have not yet tried the knee high ones. My knees are really swollen so the stockings roll down.
She also showed me how to flex my ankles. She does light therapy on my legs and it does seem to help the swelling. I try to elevate my legs sometimes, but it tends to hurt my back. And if I am on my feet too long the swelling gets worse.
Acupuncture helps a lot, but I can't afford it. I do it myself sometimes, but I am not that good at it. I also take Epson salts baths.
Any ideas???
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nefferdun
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Have you treated bartonella? My swelling got better when I treated it. It is not completely gone but I don't think the bart is either. The swelling I had was on one side of my leg above the ankle. It was not typical swelling like edema because it did not leave an indentation when you pressed it.
If it is edema, it could also mean you need to detox more and take something to help your circulation. Try to elevate your legs and take a few walks during the day.
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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posted
Good ideas. I think I will dig out the foot bath. I read that you soak in very hot Epson salts water for 8 minutes, get your feet very red. Then you pull on cold wet socks and then put warm wool socks over that. I plan to try it.
I am not sure I am being treated for baronella. What did you take for it? I take Flagyl/Ketek.
No, there is no indentation. I plan to buy the knee high stockings and some newer wraps. I am told to get my legs wrapped every night. There are special kits for that available online, if anyone wants to PM me.
I must also get back into my daily walk! My friend said I need a dog to get me moving. I'm not sure I'm ready for that....not yet.
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GiGi
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I got rid of very severe swelling in my ankles and lower leg with the intervention of CCSVI when the venous blockages were removed. Within few days all gone. I do take vasculex and aesculus, boluoke to aid circulation. Lyme symptoms were gone for years, but biofilm remained with various silent pathogens that were testable for a day or two after the intervention. Quick addition of abx, etc. took care of it within a few days.
Yes, Bartonella tested energetically briefly, as did viruses, some metals and fungi, all hanging up for years in biofilm.
Before intervention, I had added some Boluoke, but thinner blood still flowing through the same narrow openings increased blood pressure. After intervention, blood pressure returning to almost normal. Think physics: pressure increases with stronger blood flow through narrow channels before CCSVI intervention.
Biofilm is a big hindrance and you need to work at it any way you can.
Bartonella also lives in the tonsils,as do a number of the other infections.
Both left and right jugulars were blocked by biofilm. It left me no choice but to have the intervention.
Intervention should not be done until the majority of infections have been cleared/reduced, as Dr.K. stressed.
You must aid detoxing of heavy metals which is a big part of the problem. Infections settle with the metals.
Untreated parasites also harbor toxic metals and infections and thus more and more biofilm.
Lyme Disease is a disease of the endothelium, i.e. the vascular system.
Take care.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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Haley
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Gigi - Have you posted your experience with CCSVI? I would be interested in reading it. I am going to look into this.
Would you say that you felt 10%, 30%, 50% better after this procedure?
Posts: 2232 | From USA | Registered: Aug 2009
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nefferdun
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Ketek and flagyl won't affect bartonella much. The primary drugs used are Levaquin, Rifampin or Bactrim DS (the last two with Biaxin or Zithromax).
According to Dr. S' book on bartonella swelling that appears to be edema but does not leave an indentation when you press it, it actually bart. It can get really bad. Look for other symptoms of bart. Do your shins ache, feet hurt, muscle twitching, irritation, depersonaization, neuro symptoms out of proportion to physical symptoms. . . ?
Other skin symptoms include the classic stretch marks and streaks but less obvious are crusty moles, pea size brown marks (like liver/age spots), loss of pigmentation, marble size nodules under the skin on the outside your thighs and upper arms that hurt when pressed (otherwise you do not feel them) and papules.
Soaking, wrapping, taking diuretics, etc will not do a thing to reduce the swelling if it is bart.
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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nefferdun
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Ketek and flagyl won't affect bartonella much. The primary drugs used are Levaquin, Rifampin or Bactrim DS (the last two with Biaxin or Zithromax).
According to Dr. S' book on bartonella swelling that appears to be edema but does not leave an indentation when you press it, it actually bart. It can get really bad. Look for other symptoms of bart. Do your shins ache, feet hurt, muscle twitching, irritation, depersonaization, neuro symptoms out of proportion to physical symptoms. . . ?
Other skin symptoms include the classic stretch marks and streaks but less obvious are crusty moles, pea size brown marks (like liver/age spots), loss of pigmentation, marble size nodules under the skin on the outside your thighs and upper arms that hurt when pressed (otherwise you do not feel them) and papules.
Soaking, wrapping, taking diuretics, etc will not do a thing to reduce the swelling if it is bart.
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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GiGi
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Haley, I have been symptom-free from Lyme for many years. I have still been detoxing heavy metals, but without any bad symptoms. When recently my lower legs/ankles started to swell, a problem I never had in all my long life, I knew I had to do something. I also had a totally new symptom --- my blood pressure went up sky-high, and changing abnormally low to high by the hour. Not a comfortable situation.
Ultrasound revealed that I had severe CCSVI and I decided to do the Venoplasty with www.cmilv.com in Las Vegas where one of the 2-3 best Siemens equipment is for this treatment. You will find the results of this in my post above. Betterhealthguy.com has a lengthy article on it, and I am thrilled having done it.
The major problem with CCSVI is the limited blood flow into and out of the brain. Much gets hung up in the neck and shoulder area. Detoxing the brain which is necessary to stay or get healthy is very difficult if the blood cannot flow as necessary.
Please read my post above. Per Dr. K. who is paying a lot of attention to CCSVI, finding it in almost every Lyme patient, says that the intervention should not be done until the number of pathogens is reduced.
Notice that even symptmfree I still had some hanging around in the biofilm and they promptly were testable after the CCSVI intervention. I tested energetically for several of the different infections. So we know for certain that the bugs are hiding/resting/ in the biofilm. And of course, the more biofilm created, the worse it gets.
We have to deal with the biofilm. I am still detoxing, but I feel marvelous.
Take care.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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Haley
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Thanks Gigi. Very helpful.
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posted
So two big take aways for me are that the lower leg swelling may be caused by Bart. I have been taking Serrapentase to knock down the swelling and that helps a lot but does not get rid of it.
Second I have been looking into CCVSI and am concerned it is still too early to have it done. There is a chance of restenosis if as Dr K says the underlying issues are not mostly healed. I am doing much better than 6 months ago but neuro symptoms and fatigue are the big issues right now.
This is a great thread, thanks for the input.
All the Best,
MattH
Posts: 607 | From Houston Texas | Registered: Mar 2011
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quote:Originally posted by nefferdun: According to Dr. S' book on bartonella swelling that appears to be edema but does not leave an indentation when you press it, it actually bart.
Could you pls PM me which book of Dr. S's you are referencing?
Posts: 396 | From EAPennsylvania | Registered: Dec 2007
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posted
Wow, Gigi, this is an amazing amount of stuff to absorb! I do recall years ago that my aunt had her leg veins repaired, but I thought it was purely cosmetic.
My SPECT scan shows the limited flow of blood to my brain. I also have had to have my sinuses operated on twice. Edema seems to be everywhere!No one has ever succeeded in placing a PIC line because my veins are so small.
We are looking for a new LLMD. I think using Flagyl/Ketek without support for inflammation is ridiculous. It was my pain doc who sent me for IMT (Integrative Manual Therapy) and that helps with detoxing remarkably well. If I could get to San Francisco more often I would see an old acupuncturist there who is very good and a whiz with herbal therapies. He told me that I would need acupuncture to handle the toxicity and he is right....but too far away and too expensive.
Gigi, I will look into CCSVI. Thank you for suggesting it. I also need to get treated for Bart...I do have all the symptoms. The Flagyl has improved my speech and my brain quite a lot. But I am so very tired, toxic and miserable. It is hard to work out what to do when you feel this bad and when you have limited resources.
Any suggestions from anyone for Bay Area physicians would be welcome if you PM me.
I am slowly switching to gluten free diet and that seems to be important. Now I have to learn how to bake GF bread! I am also thinking of learning to juice. But I have no energy so it may be a pipe dream for now.
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ukcarry
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I've had quite a bit of oedema over the years with Lyme.
I've noticed that it tends to get worse when I also have a greater yeast/allergic problem.
Serrapeptase has sometimes helped this.
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GiGi
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I wish people would quit riding the bartonella boat. I know for certain that everything, all the co-infections are hiding in the biofilm plus the parasites, plus the toxic metals. Yes, bartonella is more difficult to treat, but so are bb and babs in hiding and the contaminating toxic metals, pesticides, etc.
I know because once I had the venous system opened up with the venoplasty, I suddenly within the hour, tested for every infection (I had at least seven of them in my early Lyme years in 1998) plus for viruses, plus toxic metals. The only thing that didn't come up was pesticides and insecticides that I also detoxed intensely years ago.
Dr. K. treated me a day after the venoplasty with antibiotic that tested well including flagyl, plus antivirals, plus anti-metals, and every agent that addresses circulation, i.e. capsuled Heparin, Vasculex, Aesculus, etc. Microcilica. I do my own DMPS injection, I am doing GcMAF, and I am starting Homeo K. Anything that tested positive, lasted less than a week and hardly anything but toxic metals tests now. When a few metals fall, fungi will test positive for a day or two; then a herpes virus for a day or two, and all gets calm.
Every one of these is part of Lyme Disease, and blaming all on bartonella is sort of strange, because they all hurt in a similar way ---- neurotoxins are neurotoxins and feel like neurotoxins. Sweating can be caused by babs and everything else including hormone imbalances as the metals get knocked loose.
You have to treat everything, and that is why the Lyme Cocktail is so perfect.
After a couple of years of Allergie Immun, I have absolutely no allergic dysregulations. I can eat literally everything. If you have a gluten problem, it is a wide ranging problem that being gluten-free alone I do not think will fix. Many times it is a substance, a chemical, contained in grain or anything grown the body has forgotten how to regulate. AI will repair that, even if it takes a few months.
I am still dumping metals and I think I am finally down to Hg2 which is the methyl mercury which is probably the one that comes from the deepest levels. I don't test for Hg1 (the organic mercury as it is installed in the teeth) and I don't test for lead any longer at this time. So I think I am down to the very bottom of the barrel possibly along with some nickel. The detox is very easy and I hardly feel anything, only know by my energetic testing what is happening every requiring microsilica and DMPS ever so often. I use a tensor to test myself and can really direct my treatment myself. If I need confirmation that I am headed in the right direction, I occasional ask for it from AR or AD who practice together.
Talk about feeling good ---- it is so hard to explain when you have dealt with the metal body and Lyme for so long. I am absolutely convinced that it is the Lyme and co-infections that give us this last push into the world of misery, but the toxic metals gradually eroding my feeling like a healthy normal person were the major culprit. It is almost impossible for me to describe that wonderful feeling that moves in and the many hours that are now surfacing where metals do no longer and bugs do no longer upset my life.
My husband was two days away from our appointment doing CCSVI and I feel very sad he did not live to experience it. He definitely died because his brain could no longer clear the toxins and over the years the blood circulation into all of his body, feet and hands, got less and less and finally ceased.
I feel terribly lonely and sometimes lost, but I am grateful that my husband no longer suffers and is at peace.
Do all you can to treat the biofilm. Do everything in the book to eliminate taking more in. It has been discussed here for years.
Here are some points about CCSVI Dr. K. discussed at the recent seminar in NY. We know that it is a problem, a big problem, but as with Lyme, etc. we have not been able to find the perfect solution:
"Stenoses leads to abnormal hemodynamics.
Abnormal flow leads to endothelial damage.
Vessel wall breakdown leads to local iron accumulation.
Abnormal vessel wall with increased vesciles allows leakage of T calls and iron into surrounding tissue.
Iron acts as an inflammatory agent exacerbating other effects of loss of vessel wall shear stress.
Further breakdown of the microvascular system follows creating a pathology opposite to flow.
Ischemic areas lose cerebral blood volume also from shunting of blood and atrophy of vessels."
I wish I could help you all. I know it is not primarily Lyme, that was a secondary event for me, even though worse than anything that went before. But all started with toxic metals, root canals, and environmental toxins which gradually also eroded my emotional equilibrium.
Learn about the "Five Levels of Healing". It takes fixing all of them to really succeed.
Take care.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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If the comment was directed to me about the bart train here is a bit of an explanation. When we first gain enough knowledge to think we have Lyme most of us did not know about co-infections. All I knew was I had a list of every increasing symptoms and after 5 different doctors was still not getting any better or relief.
After 9 months of treatment, help from this forum and the slow improvement I can separate my symptoms better. Yes, I am attacking biofilm. I have inquired about CCVSI and think you and Dr K are right that you need to get your infections under control before having that done. That treatment may be key to my short term memory issues!
I see both a LLMD and an ND. My ND muscle tested me and said I as positive for Bart. That may be what is slowing my recovery and I certainly have many of the symptoms.
I read and respect your thoughts and advice and appreciate your significant contribution.
Thanks again for your posts and All the Best, MattH
Posts: 607 | From Houston Texas | Registered: Mar 2011
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