canefan17
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 22149
posted
Cliff-notes at bottom
I haven't been on here for quite some time now & it's mostly due to feeling better, working 30 hour weeks, and being in a relationship.
I feel obliged to share this with everyone since this site has helped me dramatically over the years.
I've stayed in contact with Stephen Buhner for the last 2 years and he's really helped me individualize my treatment and work tirelessly at finding, what I call, my breakthrough moment.
He's been researching coinfections in great detail for awhile now. Where his first book generally focused on Borrelia... he made it a point (in his soon to be released book) to get and give information on Bartonella & coinfections.
Anywho... he recommended I try Rhodiola (for adrenals, stress, muscle loss, fatigue, insomnia, poor moods, sexual dysfunction, etc etc)
So I bought a bottle of 250mg Rhodiola on amazon and dove right in (like I always do )
I took a full capsule and wowsers... I was wired and full of energy. And although I got a crap-load of things done that day & did feel better... I knew the dosage was too high and the "wired" feeling wasn't therapeutic (insomnia bad that night)
So I started to work on finding a dose that nourished my body and also gave me energy. Thanks to Keebler I began looking for a supplement that contained Rhodiola in combination with other calming adaptogens (Ashwaghanda, etc)
I found Gaia Herbs Adrenal Health. (I posted link at bottom with supplement facts picture)
The serving size is 2 capsules (and they are liquid filled caps). However, 2 capsules, imo, is way too much for us Lymies. Most of us here are sensitive to high doses and usually do better with baby doses. That was the case for me with this herb.
I poke a hole in the capsule and each morning (on empty stomach) I squeeze 1-3 drops into water & drink. The capsule sits on my counter and I usually get 4 or 5 uses from EACH CAPSULE before using another one (super cheap!!)
Now... what has improved?
Well I've struggled big time with Bartonella and other opportunistic infections for far too long. Needing antibiotics on a daily basis just to keep the bacterias at bay.
I've been on Rhodiola for a little over 2 months now and SO many things in my life have improved. I mentioned working 30 hour weeks. But before using Rhodiola I could only handle 15 hours a week (and it was brutal... often had to find hiding spots at my work to squeeze in a 20 minute nap - really sad)
I had no energy to workout and could barely do 5 pushups (I'm 29 year old former athlete! - 5 pushups?? what!) Now I"m doing squats, 20+ pushups per set, & I've put on 10 lbs of much needed weight/muscle.
My sex drive was non-existent & the last thing on my mind. Now it's up n running & I'm so grateful for that.
I suffered from hypoglycemia on almost a daily basis. Foods would trigger it, lack of sleep, and overworking. Needing to eat every 3 hours, etc. Those ailments have since resolved.
My mood , spirit , and energy have never been better.
Hope I don't sound too much like a damn info commercial
All I can say is give it a try. Use Rhodiola alone or with other adaptogens. But don't give up on it if it doesn't work for you at first. You may just need to find YOUR therapeutic dose. And don't be afraid to use the smallest doses possible when starting.
Once you start turning that key to your rusty engine... it may take a bit for it to kick on so be patient.
Cliff-notes: -Rhodiola per Buhner's new Bart protocol -Adaptogen heals adrenals/immune response -Big time energy boost! -Happy moods and sex drive are back -Find your dose and experiment with it -Life-saver!
dbpei
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 33574
posted
I just got the book, Rhodiola Revolution, by Richard Brown, MD and Patricia Gerbarg, MD (who is also a lyme survivor). Thanks for sharing this valuable information!
Posts: 2386 | From New England | Registered: Aug 2011
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Razzle
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 30398
posted
And if Rhodiola is too stimulating, Ashwaganda by itself may be helpful.
This is on my "to try" list, too. Thanks for your post, it is always good to hear about such successes
-------------------- -Razzle Lyme IgM IGeneX Pos. 18+++, 23-25+, 30++, 31+, 34++, 39 IND, 83-93 IND; IgG IGeneX Neg. 30+, 39 IND; Mayo/CDC Pos. IgM 23+, 39+; IgG Mayo/CDC Neg. band 41+; Bart. (clinical dx; Fry Labs neg. for all coinfections), sx >30 yrs. Posts: 4167 | From WA | Registered: Feb 2011
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glm1111
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 16556
posted
canefan,
Sooo happy to hear you are doing well and feeling better. Interesting that the Holistic Clinic I stayed at back in 83 when I collapsed was totally about adrenal exhaustion and it's role in infections.
They gave me some adrenal support but back then I was bedridden, and totally incapacited for it to work I guess.
Even though my energy is way better, I am at the 95% mark of my healing, I am going to give this a try and see if it will push me into the 100% tile.
Again, I am so happy to hear how much you have improved. Was really worried about you.
Thanks for posting! Stay well,
Gael
-------------------- PARASITES/WORMS ARE NOW RECOGNIZED AS THE NUMBER 1 CO-INFECTION IN LYME DISEASE BY ILADS* Posts: 6418 | From philadelphia pa | Registered: Jul 2008
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Kudzuslipper
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 31915
posted
I love happy posts. Congrats. I hope it keeps getting better and better.
Posts: 1728 | From USA | Registered: May 2011
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Catgirl
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 31149
posted
Right on Canefan! Adrenal fatigue set in shortly after I was bit. I've been trying to fix it ever since. I have been taking stuff with rhodiola in it but perhaps not enough for me. Thanks for posting this. :)
-------------------- --Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together). Posts: 5418 | From earth | Registered: Mar 2011
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posted
Canefan, Congrats and thanks for the great update. I too have Bart and though making progress it is very slow. My mind is much clearer than a year ago but still a long way to go.
I have Rhodiola that I can add back in to my supplements. I noticed iherb has the brand you listed 120 liquid caps for $35.00.
What are you doing for detox? Again thanks for the great update! Just ordered som HMD for me and my sons to detox with and doing lots of DE along with the ABX.
All the Best, MattH
Posts: 607 | From Houston Texas | Registered: Mar 2011
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Tammy N.
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 26835
posted
Canefan, such great news!! So happy for you! Keep it up. Hope you reach 100%. God bless.
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Dekrator48
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18239
posted
Thank you for the detailed information.
I really appreciate that.
I am so happy for your great improvement!!
-------------------- The fibromyalgia I've had for 32 years was an undiagnosed Lyme symptom.
"For I know the plans I have for you", declares the Lord, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future". -Jeremiah 29:11 Posts: 6076 | From Pennsylvania, USA | Registered: Nov 2008
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posted
my warning: took the lowest possible dose at noon with a meal and I was wide awake all night speeding my brains out: it is NOT for everyone, it is an herbal stimulant
Posts: 424 | From Connecticut, USA | Registered: Nov 2003
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posted
So as a long term lymie can someone explain "speeding my brains out" - it is such a foreign term and experience to me!!! Excuse me while I get back to my nap!
All the Best, MattH
Posts: 607 | From Houston Texas | Registered: Mar 2011
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glm1111
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 16556
posted
What was the dose that you took ESG? If it was a full capsule, it probably was too much to start with. Canefan suggests 1-3 drops in water to start.
Gael
-------------------- PARASITES/WORMS ARE NOW RECOGNIZED AS THE NUMBER 1 CO-INFECTION IN LYME DISEASE BY ILADS* Posts: 6418 | From philadelphia pa | Registered: Jul 2008
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RZR
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 20953
posted
Great news!
I have been wondering about you cane....so glad you are doing well!
-------------------- Tick bite May 2009 Diagnosed June 2009 Posts: 2329 | From SouthEast | Registered: Jun 2009
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posted
Yaaaah you go guy. So happy to hear you are doing better. Doing the happy dance for you. Keep us posted on how you r doing.
Posts: 905 | From Santa Cruz,Calif | Registered: Aug 2005
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posted
Thank you so much for sharing your great news!!
So funny that you would post this today, I was just reading all the reviews on Amazon on this very same supplement last night!! It has wonderful reviews on there as well too.
Great to hear that it's working so well for you. Wishing you continued healing Posts: 486 | From USA | Registered: Jan 2012
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annxyzz
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 20404
posted
I am amazed because it sounds lke it is helping your immune system fight the infection . May I ask , do you feel less fluish ? I am better than when I started TX years ago , but still feel fluish everyday .
I read a book about Rhodiola ( amazon ) and its help with depression . A lot of people at iherb and amazon review the cheap NOW brand as a good low price option .
I knew it helped with depression , but doubted it would give much energy to someone with a LYME infection.
Does uour bartonella seem better , or do you just feel somewhat like you are taking a stimulant ? Important question!
-------------------- annxyzz Posts: 1178 | From East Texas | Registered: May 2009
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canefan17
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 22149
posted
annxyzz,
It has a profound effect on the immune system.
(Straight from the book I'm reading) "In rats the plant increased NK cell activity by up to 112% in the stomach & 222% in the spleen.
A research student at I.P. Pavlov St Petersburg State Medical University determined that Rhodiola rosea could destroy pathogenic bacteria in cell cultures as effectively as the abx oxacillin.
In rats with staphylococcus infections of the jaw, the herb worked as well as another abx, bicillin. In fact, it reduced ESR (eryhtrocyte sedimentation rate) - an indicator of inflammation - better than the drug.
It has the great ability to normalize the cellular immune response & speed up cellular repair."
And to answer your question... Absolutely my Bartonella seems more under control. The formula I take doesn't feel stimulating to me (the Gaia Herb Adrenal Health formula is what I take).
In fact, the first week or so on the Gaia formula I found myself very relaxed (stretching, deep yawning, and a feeling of peacefulness)
It works on the parasympathetic and sympathetic nervous system.
I know when something is too stimulating for me because 1) my heart rate increases & 2) I usually get increase twitching activity.
Dark chocolate is too stimulating for me (to give you an idea of how sensitive my body is to stimulants)
The Gaia formula has actually decreased my twitching to pretty much non-existent.
Hope that helped.
Posts: 5394 | From Houston, Tx | Registered: Aug 2009
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dbpei
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 33574
posted
Again, thank you SO MUCH for sharing this incredible information. I know we are all different and what helps some may not help others, but this certainly sounds promising. So happy for you!
Posts: 2386 | From New England | Registered: Aug 2011
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dbpei
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 33574
posted
cane, I just looked up the ingredients on a supplement that I have been taking and learned that it has rhodiola rosea! It is Adrecor by NeuroScience. Below are the ingredients in 3 capsules (I take just 1)...
Proprietary Blend: L-methionine, L-histidine, N-acetyltyrosine, Green Tea leaf extract (70% epigallocatechin gallate), and Rhodiola rosea root extract (standardized to >15% rosavins) 1253 mg
I wonder how much rhodiola rosea is actually in one of these capsules. Maybe I should take 2 - 3 capsules as recommended and see how I feel.
This was recommended to me by a holistic MD (not a LLMD) that tested my neurotransmitters about 6 months into treatment.
Posts: 2386 | From New England | Registered: Aug 2011
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ukcarry
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 18147
posted
Canefan, firstly I must tell you how delighted I am to hear of your great progress and also of the other positive things that are happening to you (such as the relationship). Thank you for telling us .
You have been a great asset to this site, with your enquiring mind and determination to get there, so you will be much missed.
I did try rhodiola some years ago before the Lyme was diagnosed, but it did not do anything for me. However, it was not this product by Gaia, which also has some other good things in it, especially the ashwaganda (which coincidentally I have just started taking as a tea) and holy basil, which I often have as a tea.
Good luck to you, Canefan, Carry
Posts: 1647 | From UK | Registered: Nov 2008
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nefferdun
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 20157
posted
That is really great news. Fall/winter is really hard to stay on the upswing so it is a very good sign that you are doing so well. I got my rhodiola out and started it again. I also started Jiaogulan which is another adaptogen. I am really happy for you.
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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CherylSue
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 13077
posted
Great news Canefan! Thanks for sharing. My lingering symproms are fatigue and stamina. Maybe, this might help.
Posts: 1954 | From Illinois | Registered: Aug 2007
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gigimac
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 33353
posted
Hi Canefan, That is awesome that you found something that helped you. Now I really want to try this.
But first, Is this something that you would have to worry about a herx reaction with?
Posts: 1534 | From Greensboro NC | Registered: Aug 2011
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posted
I'm glad to read this. My LLMD just gave me AdreneVive (contains Rhodiola, Ashwaganda, Skullcap, Eleuthero and a couple of other things) today in hopes to kick my endocrine system back into shape. My adrenal test was not pretty.
I've stopped all my antibiotics for now, just trying to get my endocrine and immune system to start working. Glad to hear these herbs work for others, praying they help me!
-------------------- I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.+++ Diagnosed with Lyme in 2005. Suffered for years before that. Still treating/fighting it. Son diagnosed with Lyme and Babesia in 2007. Son diagnosed with Asperger's in 2011. Posts: 40 | From Maryland | Registered: Jun 2008
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Carol in PA
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 5338
posted
I have taken Rhodiola off and on for several years, for stamina. I noticed that some brands didn't seem to do much.
When it helped, I could notice.
Posts: 6950 | From Lancaster, PA | Registered: Feb 2004
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MannaMe
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 33330
posted
Carol, do you remember which brands were helpful and which ones weren't?
My husband used Rhodiola for awhile a few years ago but didn't notice any difference. Wonder if he would see a difference if he tried another brand?
Posts: 2387 | From USA | Registered: Aug 2011
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Carol in PA
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 5338
posted
MannaMe, The brand I found to be most helpful was Balanceuticals. They have Rhodiola Defence and Rhodiola Power, both available at Amazon.com.
They are expensive now.
Posts: 6950 | From Lancaster, PA | Registered: Feb 2004
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Rivendell
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 19922
posted
I'm taking alcohol-free tinctures of ashwagandha, eleuthero and rhodiola per Buhner's suggestion to me, and I am noticing many wonderful improvements, mostly in my state of mind.
I'm still working with finding the right dosage, but I do believe I am onto something with this combination.
annxyzz
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 20404
posted
Cane, thank you for elaborating . it sounds like the rhodiola is helping your immune system and overall health ! Great news. Maybe some others can try it and see if they can duplicate your results with overall improved health .
-------------------- annxyzz Posts: 1178 | From East Texas | Registered: May 2009
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sparkle7
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 10397
posted
Good to read that you are doing well. It's difficult to be in the prime of your life & living with illness. I hope you continue to be well.
I read about this herb a while ago. I may study it again to see if it will be helpful. Everyone is different & fighting different constallations of symptoms.
Posts: 7772 | From Northeast, again... | Registered: Oct 2006
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gigimac
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 33353
posted
Would Rhodiola cause a herx?
Posts: 1534 | From Greensboro NC | Registered: Aug 2011
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Lymeorsomething
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 16359
posted
Holy Basil, Batman! Good post.
-------------------- "Whatever can go wrong will go wrong." Posts: 2062 | From CT | Registered: Jul 2008
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Kudzuslipper
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 31915
posted
Cane, is this all you are taking? or is it all that is new? I am impressed that 3 drops has done all that for you...so much so I went out and bought some! definitely gonna do your pin system.
Posts: 1728 | From USA | Registered: May 2011
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MannaMe
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 33330
posted
I ordered some of the gaia brand tonight. Hope it helps my husband as much as it did for you!
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Kudzuslipper
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 31915
posted
OMG. 3 drops of rhodiola extract--- I am so *****y today!!! I have energy... but a kind of *****y stressful energy. I will have to try the gaia with the more calming herbs too. Oh wait, I have so many allergies... but 3 drops? how could that harm me?
Posts: 1728 | From USA | Registered: May 2011
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Kudzuslipper
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 31915
posted
Just wanted to share... That I have been using Cane's method for two weeks now. 1-3 drops of the gaia formula before breakfast. I just put it on my finger and lick it. (tastes clovelike, maybe basily) I don't feel anything... But I feel pretty good and have had bait more energy. And I got through the holiday without a crash!
Seems too good to be true...that 3 drops a day could be so useful.
Thanks Cane for sharing.
Posts: 1728 | From USA | Registered: May 2011
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ping
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 6974
posted
Hi canefan. You sound much better than the last time I heard from you. Congratulations on the breakthrough and thanks for the info.
ping
-------------------- ping "We are more than containers for Lyme" Posts: 1302 | From Back in TX again | Registered: Mar 2005
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droid1226
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 34930
posted
Not discounting Canes success, but follow his posts up until he tries rhodiola....He's feeling better on antibiotics, then takes it. I take this everyday and it does give you a bit more energy. I think it may turn the corner for someone who's right on the brink.
posted
Thank you Canefan for this recommendation.I am glad to know you are doing better.
I have gone through a whole bottle at four pills a day per the bottle's instructions.
I have not noticed anything either way, nothing positive and nothing negative.
Can I deduce that I do not have an issue with adrenals if I could take four pills (unlike many people) daily with no improvement?
Unfortunately, I still have the crushing, "take your breathe away" kind of fatigue. Thank you.
Posts: 121 | Registered: Sep 2007
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- J-Dog. Piping in with my take on your question.
Q: Can I deduce that I do not have an issue with adrenals if I could take four pills (unlike many people) daily with no improvement?
No, sorry, I do not think that is what this means. There are just too many variables.
One bottle is not going to turn around years and years of adrenal stress & damage (and for anyone who has had lyme, IMO, there has been some damage that needs lots of TLCare).
Adrenal repair can take many months - if not years when lyme and other heavy "loads" are weighed in. As long as a "heavy load" is carried, the adrenals are going to be stresseed.
It could be that you need a different adrenal support - a full formula - or even Cortef.
Rhodiola, alone, may be a big help to one person but may not even touch what another person needs.
The Wilson book is excellent but it does not address lyme specifically.
The Rhodiola Revolution, book, though, IMO is not adquately "lyme literate" and has words about lyme that are not accurate for all with lyme, and I fear many may misinterpret.
Still, much good information there - and in other books and articles. In that thread above, though, a LL author has a hormone article that may be of help.
Regarding just the adrenal herbs, I get more of a noticeable gentle support with a blend of Ashwaganda, Cordyceps and Eleuthero.
Usually, herbs work better in a formula than they do alone.
Bottom line, if infection(s) still chronic, the adrenals will be continually stressed. Same with all the other stressors that go along with lyme. Sadly, it just takes a long time to work through it all.
Even if one knows they've "officially reached remission" (whatever that may be or however measured), it can still take a long time for adrenal recovery.
A LL ND is most likely the best guide for they have years - and years - of formal study about all this, and being LL, hopefully, they would also be ILADS educated so what else might be left of puzzle pieces to get in the right places. -
[ 02-09-2013, 10:13 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Thank you for sharing
Posts: 711 | From CA | Registered: Dec 2011
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Catgirl
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 31149
posted
J-Dog, I tried the Gaia brand and noticed a little bit of improvement on it. But AdrenaSense (Natural Factors) works much better on me. It has a bit more rhodiola than the Gaia formula. AdrenaSense has 200mg. Plus, it doesn't have an oil base (I have an issue with oils--protomyxzoa). It's much less expensive too.
The Mars Venus link below has a video that explains it well (says it's just as good for men on video). It also has a detoxing herb.
-------------------- --Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together). Posts: 5418 | From earth | Registered: Mar 2011
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i'm late to the party but really gald to see this. i too started the Adrenal health and also bought soem Ashwaganda and i to feel it helps....not ready to say break though.
i had taken Rhodiola for a while and didn't feel it helped as much as Adrenal Health or the Ashwaganda. I;m only two weeks in so we shall see.
Regardless it is great to see a positive post from you as you have been on here almost as long as me.
Dave
-------------------- On my journey to wellness - One day at a time. Posts: 989 | From NJ | Registered: Sep 2008
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I began looking for a supplement that contained Rhodiola in combination with other calming adaptogens (Ashwaghanda, etc)![[group hug]](graemlins/grouphug.gif)
![[Mad]](mad.gif)
![[lol]](graemlins/lol.gif)
, spirit ![[bow]](graemlins/bow.gif)
, and energy ![[woohoo]](graemlins/woohoo.gif)
have never been better.
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