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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » PARASITE WARRIORS SUPPORT THREAD (Page 29)

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Author Topic: PARASITE WARRIORS SUPPORT THREAD
dbpei
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Thank you for all of this good information. I had forgotten how beneficial DE could be. I have some stashed away from Perma Guard and reading this makes me want to start using it again.
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Catgirl
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quote:
Originally posted by Mvdr:
Hello, all. I am about a year into treatment for Lyme and feeling about 70% on a fairly regular basis now. I stopped all pharma. treatments in Sept. as I just couldn't take it anymore. I switched to a Naturpathic Dr. who I believe has saved my life. He is not an LLND but a gifted healer.

I did Diatomaceous Earth (sp?) for 3 1/2 mos. which he says got rid of the parasites. I also do crushed raw garlic with honey, bee pollen, coconut oil and lemon juice about every 3 days.

In your opinions, should I be continuing to treat for parasites? The thought of them really freaks me out! Thank you.

ABSOLUTELY, keep treating. I know the thought of parasites freaks people out (it did me). Now it's like a science experiment for me.

DE gets the small stuff but was not enough for me. I used everything I could get my hands on (herbs, salt/c, etc). I kept working on parasites and a year later a worm finally came out. A whole year of treating! That's how hard it is for some people to get them out. My doc said that for people with babs, parasites don't let go easily. I can vouch for that.

I kept working on them and the more I did, the more worms finally started to come out. Now I pass them practically everyday. I just passed an 8 inch worm the other day. These things grow in us unnoticed. That is their only defense, to go unnoticed. It's okay though, they are part of nature and IMO everyone and everything has them.

The key is to knock them back, just like we do for lyme and co infections, not to mention our pets. I have more energy now than I did when I started treating, and I know it's because of treating parasites.

Mvdr, you might consider trying some herbs too, like humaworm or parastroy. Also salt/c. Combining salt/c and herbs helped me get worms out. I'm talking big worms, and they are still coming.

--------------------
--Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together).

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gz
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I'm a week into my first experience with Parastroy after a couple rounds of parasite meds. Doing a little salt/c with it too. I've been seeing what I am horrified to think of as being rather long round worms come out of me now, well over a foot long. I only see them exit like this with water enemas.

Often I feel like there is something that needs to come out, but never quite ready too. Thinking now it's because that something has been a worm or two that runs up into my bowels some distance and isn't fully down yet. Ugh.

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Catgirl
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Right on Gz! I know they are gross, but at least you are getting them out of you which is all good. They can't take the herbs and salt/c. Coffee enemas get more worms out of me than anything, plus they detox the liver and make me feel much better.

Keep up the good work! Now is the time they are reproducing (before the full moon).

--------------------
--Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together).

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gz
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Coffee enemas are great. Since I've begun them I have a much clearer picture of how important detoxing is to the rest of tx. I have been feeling so much better with them. They make me pass a lot of stuff too, but I usually can't see what it is.

I did a good bit of salt/c with the meds, but didn't notice anything like I'm having now. The herbs have a definite place in parasite tx for me.

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Mvdr
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Thank you all. I will definitely be trying your suggestions. Be well!
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Catgirl
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Gz, I know, I can't say enough about them (coffee enemas)! You can use a wooden skewer to examine stuff, that way you will have a better idea of what comes out. I rarely saw anything before doing this.

--------------------
--Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together).

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Catgirl
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quote:
Originally posted by Wayne:
Mvdr, congratulations on your significant improvements. I take diatomacious earth regularly, not only for parasites, but for the nutrient value as well.

Thought you all might find this snippet interesting. It came from a website that has some of the best information I've found on Diatomaceous Earth. It describes how it simple it is to take, and how it can be so helpful for our health (and is relatively cheap). It mentions that because DE shreds parasites and their eggs, it's seldom they will be noticed in our stools. But a lot of people do report feeling better after having taking it for 2-3 months.

http://howtousediatomaceousearth.com/uses/human-uses/worms-and-parasites/
............................

Bone Strength
A small amount of Diatomaceous Earth gets absorbed into the blood stream as silica. The benefits of silica are many. In today’s grains, there is actually a shortage of silica.Years ago, the silica found in our foodstuffs was adequate, but with today’s hybrids and depleted soils, only about 1/3 of the silica needed is supplied in our food. DE is a simple and inexpensive way to get the silica your body needs.

Silica is the absolute most important nutrient for bone strength. Silica not only aids with calcium absorption, but it is also essential for the collagen matrix that gives the bones the majority of their strength. In addition the piezoelectric effect of silica is what allows mineralization of the collagen matrix. In other words, without sufficient silica all of the calcium, magnesium, phosphorus….. will not do anything for the bones. Silica can help prevent visual problems from aging due to loss of flexibility of the lens of the eye. It is great for tendonitis and other similar problems due to the strengthening and anti-inflammatory properties of silica. Silica also links together glucosamine molecules to form chondroitin molecules for the production of cartilage. these are a few of the beneficial properties of silica.

Really good info Wayne!

--------------------
--Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together).

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Xelaetaks
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Anyone here try fenbendazole? It seems like it could be broad spectrum. If so has it helped you and is it easy on the body compRed to other stuff?

Thanks

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gz
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I haven't used fenbendazole, but albendazole which is in the same family. For me, all of the antiparasitic pharms I have used only made me feel better. The albendazole did seem a little "rough" in that I got a bit of bloating and gas from it, but it's not intolerable and herbs and artemisinin are bad for that too.
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Xelaetaks
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Albendazold did give me some help when I first took it a while ago. It is something I use sometimes since it is systemic. Only issue with it is it seems to cause liver area pain on it and I think it's not cause of enzymes or something like that but rather it may bother something like flukes but it isn't effective enough on its own to kill them, it does seem to help some things though.
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Lymedin2010
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Man suffers from headaches for years, doctors find tapeworm moving in brain.

http://fox6now.com/2015/01/20/man-suffers-from-headaches-for-years-doctors-find-tapeworm-moving-in-brain/

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glm1111
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Thanks for posting Lymedin. Amazing that most doctors are not aware of how parasites can cause so much illness. The CDC recently came out with a report that 60 million people in the US alone are infected with parasites.

Gael

--------------------
PARASITES/WORMS ARE NOW
RECOGNIZED AS THE NUMBER 1 CO-INFECTION IN LYME DISEASE BY ILADS*

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Lymedin2010
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"Profound Improvement Experienced with Parasite Treatment

These theories aren’t just academic. In fact, many Lyme sufferers are noticing huge improvements when using various anti-worm protocols.


But it is important to be very clear here: Most of the well-known and often-used anti-parasite cleanses and herbal preparations are not capable of eradicating the parasites involved in Lyme disease. Keep reading to discover new solutions which offer much greater efficacy."


PARASITES AND WORMS: THE NEW LYME DISEASE CO-INFECTION?

http://www.publichealthalert.org/parasites-and-worms-the-new-lyme-disease-co-infection.html

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gz
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As I completed a 3rd round of parasite meds, I noticed less of the worm strings being expelled from my eyes, even had a few days with no worms at all! (There's usually at least a half dozen between both eyes.)

I'm a week back on herbs with a little salt/c and seeing the usual amount of worms coming from my eyes again. I find myself looking forward to each round of the parasite meds. I think parasite herbs are really good for the things in my gut.

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Catgirl
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Awesome piece Lymedin2010! It's so obvious to me that parasites hold people back.

Gz, good for you for not giving up. You are not alone, worms and lyme love the eyes. Parasite meds really helped my eyes (floaters).

--------------------
--Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together).

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lpkayak
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Bringing this up for golf...they need help with lung worm

--------------------
Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself.

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glm1111
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[Smile]

--------------------
PARASITES/WORMS ARE NOW
RECOGNIZED AS THE NUMBER 1 CO-INFECTION IN LYME DISEASE BY ILADS*

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lpkayak
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Hi guys. Long time no see. Something happened to me and its gross but i hope good news

I have been txing with buhner tea for about a month and feeling alot better

I have gradualy been adding cinnamon, ginger,nutmeg and cloves torecipes. In pretty high amounts

I Made a soup that came out kinda bland so i doctored it up with garlic, bay leaves and cloves. About a tablespoon cloves and there us about 16 servings of soup

The second and third day i had the soup i ended up having bouts of explosive diahrea. And the toilet bowl is full of little white worms in mucous. Also seseme shaped seed things i often get are coming out of my skin like crazy. And i am coughing up little white worms in mucous

The worms all loik very similar. Small, stringy, white

Once i had some thing like them but mush longer

The ones i cough up are different...they are more thick and shaped sorta like a (

Anyway...does any of this make sense to you experts? Can such a small amount of cloves do so much?

--------------------
Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself.

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glm1111
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Cloves are excellent for purging worms and eggs. So Happy you are seeing some results. Keep up with ALL of the spice you are consuming as they are antiparasitic. Ticks carry many different parasites and are keeping us in a chronic state of illness.
Soup sounds tasty Ip! [Big Grin]

Gael

--------------------
PARASITES/WORMS ARE NOW
RECOGNIZED AS THE NUMBER 1 CO-INFECTION IN LYME DISEASE BY ILADS*

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Atta
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I've done herbal tinctures of wormwood, black walnut, etc. from my homeopath along with the rife and am now on the Hulda Clark maintenance once a week for parasites. I know they are no where close to being out of me. But...my kidneys are taking a hit even with taking the herbs once a week.

Has anyone else had problems with their kidneys while on a parasite cleanse and what did you do to keep them healthy? I'd love to continue but I'm concerned I'm damaging them too much and I"m already on the Hulda Clark kidney tea to support and obviously still quite toxic.

Also, any feedback from anyone else who's done Hulda Clark-did you like her protocol?

Thanks!

--------------------
I am my own Atta Girl
Rife as of 06 06 12
Homeopathic treatment
Mostly raw diet-real organic foods
Meditation
Yoga
Acupuncture

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glm1111
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Bringing this back up for Jessig

--------------------
PARASITES/WORMS ARE NOW
RECOGNIZED AS THE NUMBER 1 CO-INFECTION IN LYME DISEASE BY ILADS*

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Catgirl
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Atta, coffee enemas help detox the liver and kidneys fast. I feel so much better, they are so worth it. That is how I am able to take the herbs everyday. Now is the time to hit parasites as the full moon is coming up.

Another great bonus about coffee enemas is they get the worms out. Whenever I do a coffee enema, the next day I see a worm. No coffee enema, no worm.

--------------------
--Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together).

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gz
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Some needed updates...

Last week I finished up another round of parasite meds. I seem to be loaded with ascaris. I flushed out some very distinct specimens, worthy of preservation [Big Grin] . Once a huge tangled ball of them [Eek!]

There were visible red lines in many of them. Was this a primitive circulatory system? nerve cord? No... it was their intestine I was seeing.

According to everything I have read about ascaris, they free float in the intestines and absorb nutrients, not the hosts blood. Seeing freshly flushed out worms with bright red intestines makes me ponder otherwise.

Parasiteinfo.com says about ascaris, "Up to approximately one hundred roundworm worms can infect a single human host." I totally disagree with that statement!

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Catgirl
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Fascinating (their intestines)! Good work Gz! I've passed nests of worms before too. Gross but imagine how many people have them and don't even know it.

--------------------
--Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together).

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gz
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With this last round of meds, I have also saw a bunch of cresent shaped/"C" shaped things, about the size of a pencil eraser diameter or smaller. Any clue what they could be? Maybe I don't want to know ha ha.

I have also been passing large ropes of stuff. There is a definite pattern for me related to the process of how they leave my body. Whether this is ropeworm/mucoid plaque/other intestinal sludge, I believe it plays a huge role in my getting better.

One of the things I notice in the days before I start passing ropes is that I pass enormous amounts of small parasites. It's like every critter from lymephotos brought their friends to the shindig in my toiletbowl. This follows a period of having had intestinal discomfort.

Sometimes I have felt instantly amazing, almost euphoric, after passing these ropes. Other times I don't get relief, because there are others still in process of moving out at the same time.

I believe these masses of ropes are likely to contain biofilm and colonies of parasites and microorganisms. While I think it is normal for humans to have parasites, I think if someone has stealth infections, addressing parasites can be a critical element in eliminating biofilm mass that protects these infections.

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Catgirl
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I know what you mean about feeling better after passing rope worms. I think it's getting rid of all their toxins. They release a ton. I've been working on them for over a year, and still passing them.

I agree, I think it is normal for everyone and everything to have parasites, but not massive infections like we have. They hold people back, and I believe most don't even know they have them.

Bart and proto make lots of biofilm (tons more with proto), and it protects these guys for sure. Are you doing coffee enemas too? Sometimes that is all I need to get them out.

--------------------
--Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together).

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gz
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Keep on fighting the good fight [Smile] . I do coffee enemas every day. I pass a lot of ropes with that alone. I notice when I get into the second week of parasite pharms I get symptoms there is a lot of stuff letting go at once. This last round was pretty intense with the amount of ropes.

It makes sense for us to have tons of parasites. It is the immune system that keeps them in check. If things like lyme and coinfections are proliferating while depressing the immune system, parasites are going to have a heyday as well.

I suspect I have proto, have the symptoms of it. I seem to have two distinct sets of symptoms that I thought were all babs, thinking one might be proto, unless it's two different babs or something else entirely.

I've read about people passing ropes for years. Anything that lives in our intestines makes a lot of biofilm. Freaks me out seeing so many huge things as ascaris worms. Just think of how much biofilm a single worm is capable of secreting. The cozy cement that keeps all the critters together.

I am starting to have a few normal hours a few times a week. I am hoping it's the beginnings of getting better. I know for sure I wouldn't be feeling it if I wasn't addressing the parasite/BIOFILM in the gut issue.

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Maya12
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I have a question. Can vitamin c only and no salt kill parasites?

I started taking vit c recently and am now passing them but no salt.

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Xelaetaks
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Anyone have link to order easy to use enema? Also can disposable enema be worth using?

Thanks

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Catgirl
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Maya, whatever works for you great! Vit c alone never made me pass worms though.

Xelaetaks, I never cared much for the disposable ones (can't really control the amount of air that gets in you), but I do like this one (think it was $15):

http://www.walgreens.com/store/c/walgreens-combination-douche,-enema-and-water-bottle-system/ID=prod17207-product

--------------------
--Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together).

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gz
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I use the red bag enema combo. If a local walmart carries it, you can get it for less than $5.

I think if the vitamin c is clearing the bowels it could make a lot more stuff come out visible, as opposed to more digested.

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gz
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The worm strings I get in my eyes stayed gone about 2.5 weeks this time. The crawling sensations are starting to come back too. They take longer to return with each med round I do.

I found some info saying the worm strings in the eyes are a form of candida. If this is the case, the fact that they clear with parasite tx gives a lot of support to the "russian doll" principle.

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Catgirl
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Gz, I hear you. Amazing how parasite meds help with the eyes.

Been passing worms all weekend (full moon). I forgot to take a binder one day though and felt bad all day. I'm usually okay if I take humaworm (has psyllium in it) but I didn't take humaworm this time and wham. Thankfully a coffee enema pulled me out of it.

The week after the full moon is still a very active time for them too.

--------------------
--Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together).

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Atta
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Thanks Catgirl!

I was doing coffee enemas for a while but stopped because it was affecting the kidneys but that was a while back before I even started with a kidney cleanse.

I've since stopped my Hulda Clark parasite herbs which were also really hurting my kidneys and since then have felt a lot of kidney improvement. So I think I will give it another go...maybe after a colonic which I have been doing recently and am pretty sure I've had some fragments of ropeworm in the toilet afterwards..

Right now for parasites, candida, and apparently lyme and cos by the way I am herxing, I am using Cold pressed Coriander oil and Cold Pressed Black Cumin seed oil.

Holy Moly, four weeks in I am experiencing rotating joint pain, muscle fatigue, emotional swings, hot/cold flashes, exhaustion....So I know I'm killing and not properly detoxing...I think it's time to try those coffee enemas again [Smile]

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slayadragon
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I have been working sporadically to try to kill a very large tapeworm in my small intestine.

These seem much more difficult to get than other kinds of worms (a good many of which I released a long time ago), in large part because they sequester heavy metals and then release them. That has made me really sick if I have gone too fast, so this has been a long process.

The other issue that I have is that my intestines are pretty stuck together with adhesions. I actually wonder if the tapeworm toxins causes the adhesions. But in any case, this makes the issue more difficult since it seems to provide some protection to the tapeworm (keeping it from being moved out of the system).

Recently I have been using a variety of typical parasite herbs in high doses. Also some of a product called "Rascal," which has pumpkin seeds and is supposed to be specifically for tapeworms.

What I feel like when I take doses of herbs is that the parasite goes into almost rigor mortis. I get a stabbing feeling and a feeling of that section of the abdomen feeling stiff and hard.

Once in a while, I can feel the tapeworm crawl to a different part of my small intestine. Right now, it is toward the top. Like right under my stomach.

I feel less sick from the toxins than I used to, so that part is good. But I have heard of so few success stories of people successfully killing tapeworms (as opposed to other worms) that I am discouraged.

I do feel that the worm is much smaller than it used to be, and I have expelled a whole bunch of stuff over time. But it seems really stubborn.

I do water enemas and coffee enemas, and herbal laxatives of various sorts. And I have been adding some fiber (such as acacia fiber), and gone back to trying bentonite. And I eat enormous amounts of fermented foods (and almost nothing else).

What else should I be trying if I want to be aggressive at this point?

It sounds like one suggestion in Salt-C, which I've never really pursued before.

I've taken a lot of DE over time, and it seems to irritate this thing too.

What about ozone? I only have a little water purifying machine, but I am wondering about drinking the water or using it in enemas. It's been a while since I've done that. Or maybe an expensive machine would work better.

Other thoughts?

Thanks much......

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Catgirl
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The adhesions might just be more worms. I have passed tons of worms, so imagine how they can get grow, move and block things. It's also never just one worm.

I also get the stabbing feelings in my abdomen too when I hit them hard. I can also feel movement. Are you sure it's just a tapeworm? I know that rope worms at a certain stage can propel themselves (gas) which might feel like movement (they actually are moving through intestines).

You might want to meet with a Dr. K practitioner for tape worm treatment.

The only other thing I can suggest is to mix salt/c with herbs (not at the same time). Salt really does give the herbs that extra push to help them let go and exit. Also, I've mixed a couple of different parasite products before (helps). These things adapt, so I have to change it up.

Hopefully someone with ozone experience can give you some input for parasites.

There are probably more things (equipment), but my brain is zoning out right now. Hang in there!

[ 04-25-2015, 01:38 PM: Message edited by: Catgirl ]

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S13
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So i just passed a rope worm this morning. I did an MMS enema yesterday, so i guess its doing something.

My LLMD actually sugested going after rope worms having been to some seminars (from klinghardt i guess). He mentioned the Gubarev prototol. Gubarev enemas are based on milk/salt or eucalyptus leaves/oil and there are some other types as well. Has anyone have experience with this?

How to get the freaking things out?? What diet is best? I think avoiding sugar and carbs is the minimum (already doing that), but are there other suggestions? I think ive read somewhere that even B vitamin supplements feed these parasites...

Could i have finally found the source of my relentless brain fog, nausea, belching, indigestion, twitching? I always figured it was bartonella, cause symtoms seem to decrease with rifampin (but never go away). But now i understand rifampin actually hits a lot of parasites as well. Hmmm stuff to think about...

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gz
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Wow, congrats on passing ropes. I hope you are feeling better from it!

I've done the Gubarev enema protocol a couple of times. There are some pretty good threads over at curezone about it, here is one of them:

http://www.curezone.org/forums/am.asp?i=2118556

I found the enema series helpful. If you try it I highly recommend starting out with a smaller quantity of eucalyptus oil than is recommended. It can be incredibly irritating, as I discovered.

The eucalyptus enema was instantly systemic. It cleared my sinuses far better than any type of inhalation could have. I feel like I had body odor from it for less than a day, not sure if it was some kind of detox reaction or other or if it was just how I was perceiving smell. I have seen people talk about getting ropes out with just regular eucalyptus enemas.

I do daily coffee enemas for detox and I pass lots of ropes with those alone, even before I tried the Gubarev protocol. Since I began coffee enemas I have done multiple rounds of parasite meds, which also moves the ropes out.

I think low sugar/carbs is best, most pathogens and parasites need your dietary glucose to survive/thrive. I didn't know about the B vitamins, thanks for mentioning that! Taking enzymes on an empty stomach seems to help get more stuff out also.

When I began treating parasites, I saw a reduction/disappearance in many of the symptoms you mention. Many I thought were from bart. Parasites provide cover for bartonella and other pathogens in addition to producing lots of biofilm. When I first started treating parasites I had intense bartonella flares.

Treating parasites has been the biggest single factor in the improvements I have been experiencing. I feel like it's probably difficult for most people to get better without addressing them.

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S13
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Thank you! I was a bit skeptic about the whole rope worm idea, but having seen them i know they are real. Whether or not they are actually worms remains to be seen of course. Perhaps it has more to do with mucous colonies of microscopic parasites. Anyway next time ill throw some of it under the microscope and try to make a giemsa stain to see what bacteria it holds.

A year a go i was also convinced there were parasites involved with my illness, but ivermectin and alinia didnt seem to help. Well, ivermectin does help with babesia night sweats tbh, but thats it. I was a bit disappointed at the time.
Perhaps i need to look more in to the albendazole/mebendazole treatment, or even pyrantel and praziquantel (biltricide). I did try albenza for 2 weeks, and got some reaction out of it, so perhaps it needs more time, or different combination with other antiparasitics? Also my diet at the time wasnt great, lots of carbs, so i may have been feeding them more then i was killing them?

I actually bought some milk and salt today so i can try the gubarev enema. Im not sure if this type is less effective than the eucalyptus enema? Anyway, i feel its good to alternate between the MMS enemas and the gubarev enemas (which is done only once every 4 days).

What im wondering is if people get cured by doing those enemas? It seems like it only hits the large intestine, so more worms will continue to poor downstream from the small intestine i think?

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gz
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Re the antiparasitics and ropeworms, albendazole was a heavy hitter for me for moving the ropes. I used it in two week courses paired with another parasite med, often not seeing much the first week but then passing tons of stuff the next week and longer.

I've also had some good results with pyrantel/iver. I think too it's just what's ready and there to let go when you start nudging with treatments.

I don't think the milk/salt enema is less effective than the eucalyptus, but it has a different function.

Anything you put into your colon can be systemically absorbed straight to the bloodstream. Medications, nutrition, alcohol, toxins, water, anything. One way coffee and other types of enemas are effective is they can stimulate the liver to dump its bile to the intestines, which can effectively clear the liver and allow you to catch toxins for binding. I saw liver flukes after my second coffee enema.

The intestine is often a hangout for adult stages of parasites large enough for us to see, while microscopic ones and larval stages are there and travel throughout the body too. Enticing them to leave interrupts the life cycle, hopefully decreasing numbers over time.

I agree that this is probably some type of colony of a bunch of stuff. Before I pass a rope I feel very ill with GI discomfort, and expel tons of small parasite looking stuff. I see a distinct pattern with rope expulsion. It will be interesting to see what you find under magnification!

I began treating parasites on a hunch, and I never imagined I would get the visual confirmations I have gotten! I treat my lyme with abx, but feel like everything could come back if I allowed too many protective parasites to remain in the gut/body and my immune system couldn't kick them. If we are immune suppressed and can't kick TBD's without help, we probably need help with the other parasites too.

Also if we have parasites and biofilm interfering with our gut function, then getting that stuff cleared out so the gut can heal should help the immune system overall, which should make it easier to treat TBD's.

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S13
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Perhaps these parasites are a result of an immune system that gets stuck in the Th1 response?

Th1 is the proinflammatory side of the immune system which primarily goes after intracellular infections (like lyme and bacterial co-infections).

Th2 is associated with extracellular antigen expression and is normally needed for things like helminth infections.

The immune system can only go either way. It cant do both Th1 and Th2 at the same time.

So what if all these people who are initially not sick, keeping their parasitic worm infections under control with a Th2 shifted immune system, and then lyme comes a long? The chronic lyme infection forces the immune system to shift to Th1, and so all parasitic worm infections can now feast and grow out of control. Their toxins (and heavy metal build up) keep the immune system functioning poorly, so the lyme infection will never be resolved. And if the lyme is not resolved then neither will the parasitic infection. Thats a clear deadlock situation if you ask me!
Just food for thought.

We have to break the vicious cycle. And perhaps treating the parasites and heavy metals which keep immune function poorly is a better way to go than to keep hammering at the bacterial lyme&co infections?

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Catgirl
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quote:
Originally posted by gz:


I began treating parasites on a hunch, and I never imagined I would get the visual confirmations I have gotten! I treat my lyme with abx, but feel like everything could come back if I allowed too many protective parasites to remain in the gut/body and my immune system couldn't kick them. If we are immune suppressed and can't kick TBD's without help, we probably need help with the other parasites too.

Also if we have parasites and biofilm interfering with our gut function, then getting that stuff cleared out so the gut can heal should help the immune system overall, which should make it easier to treat TBD's.

Right on Gz (completely agree)! Parasites hold people back, period. So happy you are getting good results!

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Catgirl
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S13 or anyone else, I think parasites are simply part of nature and everyone and everything has them. Their eggs are in the air, on our food, etc. IMO, it's normal to have them for the recycling process in nature. Lyme patients need to knock them back, as they are just one more thing for our bodies to deal with.

As far as ropes go, humaworm and para cleaner gets them out of me, as well as coffee enemas. These worms took forever for me to find and get them out. LOTS and LOTS of work. So (for new people or anyone unfamiliar) just taking a product or med and seeing nothing means nothing.

Keep trying, and you will see something come out, even if it's not rope worms, other parasites/eggs will show up. For people with babs or proto, the worms hold on, big time.

I've taken and mixed different products along with salt/c. Adding salt c in works. Rotating products or adding an additional one works as well. These things adapt, so just like treating lyme and company, rotating stuff helps.

Another thing about rope worms, they have the unique ability to avoid detection by autolysis (sp?) which means the minute they know the are not in the right place (colon) or dying, they release an enzyme to dissolve themselves so their host does not detect them and treat further. This protects their clan. I know it sounds nuts, but it's quite real and makes perfect sense in nature.

I once saw them after a coffee enema, but forgot to flush. I came back to clean up about an hour later, lifted the toiled lid and they were like jelly, sort of like egg white consistency. I think most would think what they were seeing was biofilm or yeast. Not the case. I think it's fascinating that they can do this.

The more I treat, the better I feel. Keep treating (don't give up)!

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TNT
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quote:
Originally posted by S13:
Anyway next time ill throw some of it under the microscope and try to make a giemsa stain to see what bacteria it holds.

I would be very interested in learning and seeing what you find. Definitely post it in the microscopy thread, too.
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TNT
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Also, S13,

Thanks for the clear Th1 and Th2 explanation! That would line up well with my experience, that's for sure.

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S13
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Sure, no problem. If you want to know more there is a good website explaining the Th balance:
http://selfhacked.com/2014/06/16/supplements-foods-exercise-right-type-th1-vs-th2-dominance/


So i made some picture today of the Rope worm. It can get a bit graphical, so i hope im not ruining this thread [Wink]

So here is a loose piece about 5cm long:
 -
Click for larger image.

Under the microscope, 400x mag, this is what it lookes like:
 -
You can see its made from some kind of cellular material, but very irregular. The brown stuff are probably pieces of food that got stuck in the slime. You can also see the slime actually shaping or curving the cellular-like material. The cellular material is roughly the same size as a white or red blood cell, so in the range of ~5-10um diameter.

So the next image shows an edge of the "worm", and has been stained with a Giemsa solution:
 -
Interesting is that there is almost no visible staining of bacterial, protozoal, or cellular material. Except for the small blue dot that is probably a couple of bacteria clumped together. This kind of struck me when i was looking under the microscope. There was hardly any moving bacteria in this slime! Perhaps it has something to do with the fact these "worms" originate from the small intestine which is supposed to be sterile. So as the slime grows, no bacteria are embedded.

So for these rope worms i made a few observations:
- There is some kind of cellular like material, hold together with slimy substance, but it is very chaotic (totally unlike normal multicellular organisms)
- There are no white blood cells involved, no red bloodcells and im pretty sure no other human cells because of a lack of DNA staining from the giemsa solution
- Perhaps these are not cells at all, perhaps they are parasitic eggs of some kind (a harder shell like structure could perhaps keep the staining material away from the internal DNA)

So in my opionion it has little to do with an actual worm, and possibly more with parasitic colonies. But again, pure speculation!


I also took some samples of normal feces to check for any irregularities. And there is this one structure that strikes me as "remarkable" (im no expert at reading poo, but this stood out for me):
 -
So its actually these small worm like creatures. They are quite large, about 50um - 100um in length is my best guess. Still invisible to the naked eye, but large for a microscope. There are 5 of these worms in the picture. On the bottom 2 are joined side by side.

Close up of the 2 side by side worms:
 -

And another one:
 -

As you can see, these worms have a pretty regular structure, multicellular, much unlike the larger rope worms.
The thing which looks like a long coil spring is actually plant based material, so thats from what i ate before.

But these small worms, im not sure about them? Does anyone recognize them? Maybe they have something to do with the rope worms, maybe they dont.
Perhaps a kind of strongyloide in its earlier phases?
I sure hope i have finally found the parasite that is keeping me sick!

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GretaM
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Great post S13. I love the lab stuff.
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S13
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Ok, ive been looking around some more. Mabye the small "worms" in the feces ive posted above are actually plant hairs.
https://www.google.nl/search?q=plant+hair+microscope&safe=off&biw=1430&bih=884&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=gB4-VbLGCdDnaI6hgPgG&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAQ
There are lots of different plant hairs so its difficult to identify or confirm its actually plant hair. But in that case there are no worms in my feces.

There is something else ive seen in my blood a long time a go:
 -
Could be an artifact, contamination, or a parasite. It is clearly being attacked by white blood cells. You can see them sticking on all the sides of the "worm".

So maybe this is the parasite im looking for?

Another manual time lapse of live blood shows growth of an unknown worm like creature. In the image below they are very small, maybe 20-30um long. The bigger worm in the blood above is much bigger, over 300um long. But perhaps these smaller parasites are young larva that hatch and eventually will grow to these bigger worms? Who will know?
Anyway the time lapse that shows the growth:
 -
This was captured by pure luck btw, and i dont see them very often. Maybe the parasites (and/or eggs?) cycle in and out of the blood?

More mysteries!! Yay! [Smile]

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S13
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Wow im actually starting to suspect i have systemic Trichinosis! Given my reaction to albendazole, my muscular problems, puffy red eyes (bags), strange rashes, nausea. Ive always said that my muscles feel toxified, like something is poisoning them from within. Perhaps its the Trichinella cysts that invade the muscle tissue.

Systemic trichinosis can cause a lot of neurological problems as well from what ive read. And its very tricky to treat (perhaps thats why my short course of albenza showed some improvement, but no cure)

Great.

Anyone suggestions for treating this stuff? Longer term albendazole? Rotation antiparasitic herbs? Iver and alinia did not help at all.

I may look in to getting a muscle biopsy to verify this worm infestation.

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anverss
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I have been treated for more than a year for lyme (bor., myco). But haven't made any real progress. My biggest issues are severe weight loss, psychological problems, bloating and fatigue. Is it possible that parasites or worms can cause the severe weight loss?

I have been taking wormwood for 2 months now and saw some roundworms in my stool.

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Welcome anverss!

I think it is possible that parasites can cause severe weight loss. I also believe lyme fits in there as well. Check out the symptoms of parasites below.

Great you found roundworms! Wormwood will help, but unless you are hitting them with the big 3 all at once: wormwood, black walnut hulls and cloves, you won't really do much. The eggs will still live, and the bugs will still thrive.

Now is a great time to hit them before the full moon.

https://humaworm.com/formula.html

https://humaworm.com/symptoms.html

https://humaworm.com/deworming.html

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S13
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quote:
Originally posted by anverss:
I have been treated for more than a year for lyme (bor., myco). But haven't made any real progress. My biggest issues are severe weight loss, psychological problems, bloating and fatigue. Is it possible that parasites or worms can cause the severe weight loss?

I have been taking wormwood for 2 months now and saw some roundworms in my stool.

Severe weight loss is one of my problems as well. And belching, nausea, psychological problems, fatigue, twitching, shortness of breath, toxic restless muscle sensation, excessive transpiration, pounding heart, etc.

A trial with 4 days of water fasting was quite remarkable actually. I had to be careful with being underweight already, but i really felt a lot was dying when i fasted. They say water fasting can be very beneficial for killing parasites. It was a horrible experience btw and I was only able to fast for 4 days, before i gave up due to extreme increase in symptoms. Lost 6 pounds, but strangely also gained them back in the 3 days after the water fast. Doctor said i looked better afterwards then i had in a long time. In hindsight the fast was too short to actually kill all of the bad guys, so a week after the fast i had lost the gains i had made.
But i must have killed some of them, thats for sure.

Maybe i will do some more short water fasting in the future. Albendazole now seems to be hitting it in some way, but i doubt it will be sufficient to actually kill it all (especially if some of them are encysted)

I will also do a new trial with Giemsa blood smears and live blood analysis at different times of the day (especially at night, like 3am, 5am, 7am or something like that). Perhaps they will show up in more significant numbers that way. Ive always wondered why my nausea was so bad at 5-6am in the morning. Maybe the parasites have a night time schedule or something...

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S13
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Ok ive captured another nematode like worm in my blood:

 -
Darkfield overview

 -
Bright field close up of the head (for nematodes i think the small end is the head, the large end is the rear, but this seems to differ with species)
The red stuff are red bloodcells, which are approx 7um in diameter. So the nematode is about 250-300um long. Just small enough to be invisible by the naked eye.

It has a lot of the same features as the previous blood worm i posted. Including the narrow channel inside the worm. This could be part of the digestive or reproductive system of the nematode.

Am i seeing these worms more now that im taking albendazole? All of the worm samples ive found so far are dead. But perhaps dead is the only time they float freely throughout the blood? Alive they could be hatching on to the inside of the blood vessels? Or hiding in tissue?

More challenge testing to come...

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S13
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Ive posted a video on youtube that shows the possible nematode getting attacked by 2 white blood cells:

https://youtu.be/sKI-qiWZ4ek

The WBC's are the greenish globs that move rapidly (well its time lapse so in reality they move really slow). The WBC's try to encapsulate the nematode but there are just too few wbc's in this live blood sample to accomplish this.

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S13
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Ive found another video by a dark field microscopist that also shows these nematodes in the blood of a human patient:

https://youtu.be/oRFTG35PdsU

Looks very similar to what im seeing in my own blood.

She mentions the possibility of it being a variant of strongyloides. But tbh i think this is just a guessing game. There are probably lots of undiscovered pathogenic nematodes out there, causing different symptoms. But treating them seems a must for me, since a nematode caused Th2 shift will severely block your chances of getting rid of Borrelia (which requires a Th1 pro-inflammatory immune reaction )

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TNT
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Here is a pretty amazing shot of eosinophils attacking a nematode (definitely looks like a time-lapse):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fw_I21RnBWg

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S13
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Awesome video TNT!

Im really starting to feel more and more confident this parasitic nematode link is very important in lyme disease, and often overlooked. Especially by the more mainstream LLMDs.

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sebreg
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hi s13, that is pretty amazing that you were able to find that organism in your blood!

Sorry if I missed this but how often do you take the albendazole? my guess is taking a long course of multiple meds is probably the best route. Have you looked into triclabendazole, fenbendazole, mebendazole, praziquantel etc? But it's great that you have found at least one med that helps you.

Are you familiar with ICU's protocols?
http://www.curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=1921385

I think doing blood smears from different points of the day is a very good idea, some parasites have more nocturnal activity, I guess it just depends on the organism.

I'm currently on ivermectin and albenza, once a week. Treating for protomyxzoa. The herxing has been brutal, specially with the ivermectin, but now getting under control as I've started taking montelukast, must be some sort of crazy histamine action going on. I honestly can't believe how helpful the montelukast has been. I don't fully understand the mechanics of what is going on but combo of ivermectin and albenza are working well.

I'd be very curious to know what % of healthy people have parasites vs people with chronic conditions. No doubt we have coexisted with this stuff for thousands of years, and have yet to catalogue the full array of these tricky and often very well-hidden camaflouged organisms. I wonder if a weakened immune system allows parasitic infections the opportunity to springboard into worse symptomatic displays in people, especially those of us with chronic health issues. Wouldn't be surprised if there are multiple factors at work.

Good luck to you in your treatments! keep us posted

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S13
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Hey sebreg,
I was amazed too. You almost never read about these things, and that is a big problem i think. I also feel these parasites could easily be missed with microscopy, if one is not actively taking parasite killers. When alive these nematodes dont seem to float around in the blood. Its only when they die is when you get a chance to observe them.

I know about the parasite protocols yes. I have taken albendazole now for 5 days, an planning to do at least 2 weeks, 2x400mg/day. Alinia was not very helpful, ivermectin seems to cause more disturbance of the parasite somehow (more weight loss)

Ive still got praziquantel, Pyrantel and DEC (Diethylcarbamazine) to try.
I will probably do a rotation first to find out what hits it and what not. DEC is not often used, but Bryan Rosner was very positive about it in his book:
http://lymebook.com/ivermectin-albendazole-diethylcarbamazine-alinia-mimosa-pudica

For herbals im looking at Mimosa pudica and liposomal artemisinin, but i will try those later as well. I had some reaction before with artemisinin so maybe it could be helpful with my new eradication program.

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sebreg
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oh yeah, DEC, I'm very curious about, I've come across it before. Can it sometimes have weird side effects with the eyes?

Lipo artemisinin seems to be a pretty good one for me. Pyrantel seems to work too but it upsets my stomach. Haven't tried praz or alinia but I've been meaning to.

I think I'm going to keep doing the ivermectin/albenza combo for a while and see how far that takes me. I think I can knock this thing pretty far back with this combo. I may try pyrantel again down the line, and test out alinia and praz at some point to see if they cause any herx.

With my doc I'm doing the albenza once a week, I'm fine with that, if you take it everyday for a while you can start losing your hair and I'm way too vain to allow for such a possibility [Wink]

Where would you order mimosa pudica from? it seems rather hard to find.

Thanks for the Rosner link, def heard a bit about him but hadn't really read much of his stuff. The link is very informative and helpful.

It sucks being such a guinea pig but when you've been sick long enough you are willing to try a lot of things!

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anverss
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Added Enula to my protocol. This seems to do a lot again. Starting with ivermectin,... and enemas in a couple of weeks. But I am a bit scared this will be to much. I am already underweight

Isn't Rosner a fraud?

S13 maybe we can speak in dutch?

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S13
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Ive got the mimosa from Biopure.eu. Not sure if its effective or not.

Im not sure about the truth of Rosner's stories, but he seems to line up his parasite protocol with Klinghardt's, and he is one of the few that mentions DEC.

Anverss, enula has some good antiparasitic properties as well. So if it works for you, keep using it! Sure we can talk in dutch if you like, just PM me.

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Catgirl
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Anverss, good you added Enula as it helps some people with worms. Iver has been a good med for me. Hands down though, coffee enemas have been the best at getting worms out, and now would be the best time to do them (before and after full moon).

Since you are underweight, you might try doing the enemas every other day. I do them every day now, but I managed to put some weight on eating desserts --it took more yeast killers and probiotics, but I managed to gain some weight.

As far as treating, I was underweight and treated hard core. These things are eating our food/nutrients, which may be part of the reason why some people are underweight (too many parasites).

No, Rosner is not a fraud, he's the real deal.

http://lymebook.com/ivermectin-albendazole-diethylcarbamazine-alinia-mimosa-pudica

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--Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together).

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gz
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Catgirl, very interesting about the autolysis. Another reason we don't see the critters by the time they leave.

S13, awesome microscopy pictures. Thank you so much for posting!! I think nematodes are probably a big issue for many. Filarials carried by ticks farm and harbor Bb. Filarials are easily spread by mosquito bites. I think anyone with Bb should be treat for filarials as well.

So far I still favor using pharma antiparasitics for myself. I've not herxed from them, just had measureable improvement. Often if I don't see results with a certain med, it shows itself to be effective another time. I think timing has a lot to do with it, whether we can control it or not.

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S13
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gz, no problem! Im happy to be able to add something to the community [Wink]

Ive got another picture, showing a dead nematode in my own blood. This time with a hybrid form of darkfield and brightfield microscopy, so you get a bit of depth perception:
 -
So again, the red objects are red blood cells (just to give a size comparison).
If only i could figure out what the exact species of this nematode is? Any suggestions?

Also, since microfilaria are just the larval stage of the nematode, i wonder where the adult female lives inside the body? The adults are usually much bigger. I would think the digestive tract? That would actually seem logical given my malabsorption, nausea, weight loss, belching and other GI related problems. I would hate to think the adults could be in the abdominal cavity, cause once there they can never be eradicated. Drugs just dont go there...

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gz
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Worrisome to ponder, but if we had normally functioning immune systems the worms might not be issue. Perhaps the approach with salt/c could be useful for everything unreachable.

I think filarials can be found various places in the body. If we can't reach them, hopefully we are hitting them at another point in the life cycle. I definitely have them throughout my body, I cycle back onto the meds for a couple weeks when the skin-crawling sensations resume.

I've been able to sleep since I began tx'ing parasites. The insomnia used to be horrific. I still get some sleep issues with bart/lyme, but that is completely manageable compared to what the worms were doing to me!

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sebreg
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thanks as always for sharing s13, these are amazing photos! but you don't think meds could hit the adults? even with systemic anti-parastics?

I assume that is one reason multi-drug protocol is good is because with the right combo each drug hits different life stages of the parasite.

Glad to hear you are sleeping better GZ! how long have you been treating parasites?

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S13
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Well, this is what i read from wikipedia about filariasis:

quote:
The recommended treatment for people outside the United States is albendazole (a broad-spectrum anthelmintic) combined with ivermectin.[4][5] A combination of diethylcarbamazine and albendazole is also effective.[4] All of these treatments are microfilaricides; they have no effect on the adult worms.
Though some sites report DEC can kill some of the adult species.
But we need a way to kill all adults, otherwise the microfilaria just keep coming. And its the adults that probably cause the malnutrition by consuming vast amounts of food we eat, not the larva. But that is my interpretation.

So if regular antihelmintics dont do the job, what can we use? Salt/C? Water fasting? Are there perhaps herbs strong enough (artemisinin/mimosa/wormwood/garlic etc)?

I personally think salt/c only works on the intestine (the body is way to big and strictly regulated when it comes to NA/CL, so it will never cause osmotic shock from the bloodstream). But if the adults are located in the intestine it might just work.

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sebreg
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oh yes, I think I've seen some studies on this stuff. Now are we talking about lymphatic filariasis?

From what I've understood, even if you can't kill the adults, by dosing once or twice a year you can basically get and keep microfilaria levels to very low near 0 levels and really level out the disease. Which sure, you want to be rid of this thing, but this is the next best thing no?!

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S13
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The best next thing is better than nothing. But with lyme perhaps the adults can cause such a severe Th2 immune system shift, that you become unable to fight off the intracellular borrelia/bartonella/babesia. For that you really need a good Th1 response. Any helmintic infection will just prevent that imo.
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sebreg
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gotcha, yes this gets tricky I see. tough to figure out a good strategy when dealing with multiple pathogens, I don't know enough about the immune system responses with these illnesses, I need to read up on that as I've seen people bring it up quite often.

You doing ok on the albenzadole? how long have you been treating for lyme/etc?

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S13
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yeah im doing ok for now. Ive been treating for 2.5years now. I was healthy until summer of 2012 when i was bitten by a tick and became ill very fast (literally overnight).
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redpiragrl
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Hello, I am new. I want to ask if it is possible that my 1 year old could have gotten a parasite after being bitten by a tick? Thanks
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sebreg
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Hi redpiragrl. I'm sorry to hear that, is your baby exhibiting any symptoms? How long ago was she bitten? I'm certainly no expert but ticks do carry parasites. If you are worried maybe other members can suggest best course of action in terms of what kind of doctors you could visit, hopefully some llmds in your area.

S13: you've improved with treating the lyme? hopefully treating for parasites can get you to the next level if you aren't already there!

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