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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » I do sound like protomyxzoa - Questions to get a handle on this

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Author Topic: I do sound like protomyxzoa - Questions to get a handle on this
Cattail
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After just reading up for a few hours on protomyxzoa, I do believe I MAY have it. The big thing is my ongoing eye issues and lack of bottom of feet pain coming back, but all the symptoms I THINK are bart are back and more that are new and point to protomyxzoa.

I would like to ask a few questions so I can start immediately on trying to decifer whether or not I do have it. Please help if you can. I am getting very sick this week and I am alone, almost unable to work.

1. What fats CAN you eat? Is coconut oil ok?
I am very thin and already eat next to
nothing because of yeast.

2. What treatment can I start on my own, over
the counter(specifically)? I cannot
take salt/c because it upsets my auto-
nomic nervous system condition.

3. What would be the ideal full treatemt for
protomyxzoa?


Thank you. My eyes are so painful and scary looking since starting Diflucan. I have got to try and alleviate some of this now. It almost feels like an infection is brewing around the inside of my eye sockets.

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Catgirl
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Fats are a no no. They bring on the herx. They basically help proto grow, so it produces tons of biofilm, which in turn protects all your other co infections, so progress is slow, backsliding, etc.

I am thin too. I had to find some balance. I can't eat much meat. I have to make more casserole types of food with just a little meat in them (chili). Even then, it's chicken or white meat turkey. You can't cook with oil either, but if you do, just a very small amount. We are all different, so you will find what works for you.

Parasite herbs or meds and the diet help me with proto. Diflucan does too (pulse). It is very important to keep an eye on your yeast as well. Yeast mixed with proto creates a horrible herx. The best word to describe my herxes (if I blow it with yeast and fats) is: horrific.

We all present differently. Some babs like symptoms flare on me when I eat too much fat or meat. I can only eat a little, so I mix it with lots of grains and greens. Lots of grains, veggies and beans. Basically a vegan diet REALLY helps!

Also, if you're having an issue with diflucan, try the yeast herbs instead. It's possible diflucan is just not working with all that you're taking. There are lots of good formulations out there: Candibactrim BR, OregaResp, Undecyn, Berberine, OLE, etc.

There are a few posts on protomyxzoa here. I don't have time to hunt right now, but I think Mlg posted a good one with Dr. C's protocol for proto.

--------------------
--Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together).

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Catgirl
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Found it. :)

http://protomyxzoa.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Protomyxzoa_rheumatica.pdf

http://flash.lymenet.org/scripts/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=125310;p=0#000009
http://flash.lymenet.org/scripts/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=118389;p=0

--------------------
--Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together).

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hadlyme
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No oils, that includes coconut oil.
Diflucan is good to take!
I've been in treatment for the protozoan for years. I see that dr. that found this.

Diflucan, zith and malarone are what I pulse. Lastly was told by my llmd to do the malarone more than any of the others.

I have gone to a gluten free diet lately for an experiment and I feel better on gluten free with the little low fat.

Each of us has our own 'low fat'... find what works for you. Don't just look at what others are doing. Do what is right for your body and weight.

I do eat some meat... can't do total veggie.
If you do whole foods, fruits, veggies and some meats, you should be ok with what you eat.

Get some artemisinin or however you spell it. It would be close to the malarone rx.

That and the lower fat, whole foods, and it's basically the treatment right now.

Try and get some exercise. Hard to do sometimes, but the more you can try, the better you can feel with more oxygen in your system.

--------------------
Lyme, Babs, Fry Bug..... Whatever it is, may a treatment be discovered to make us all whole again!

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Cattail
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Thanks guys. Hadlyme, what does the Artemisinin do exactly? Thank you.
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mlg
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A lot of the same meds to treat babs.
Zihro+Mepron or Malarone
Herbs pulse crypto and artemisinin
Biofilm busters (heparin/interface/garlic/colloidal silver)
Detox(infrared sauna, etc.)
Also Alinia, Albenza, Ivermectin, with a base of something like zithromax. Discuss with your doctor.

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lymeboy
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I'm having a tough time understanding how we can remain healthy without ANY fats. I know the diet is helping a lot of you out, and I'm not trying to tell you it's wrong. There is just a lot of evidence for the fact that we NEED fats in our diet. Avocados and coconuts are superfoods. It's hard to imagine life without it...I'm hungry all of the time as it is without Gluten. W/out fats? Ugh!
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nefferdun
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Protomyxzoa multiplies 100 times faster with lipids. The only way to control it is to starve it. You have to keep your fats to 15 grams a day or less. You count EVERYTHING. You don't guess, you measure and count.

1/2 cup of oatmeal has 2.5 grams, 1 TB oil has 15 grams, 1 cup of nuts have 75+ grams, 1 cup of pumpkin seeds have 12 grams, 1 cup of brown rice has 2 grams, 1 cup of most beans have 1 gram. COUNT.

You can take supplemental oil, if you want. I take 1 gram of phosphytidylcholine but I count it. When I go over 15 grams symptoms return.

I eat vegetarian. I don't eat cheese very often. 1/3 cup of low fat mozzarella has 6 grams. Other cheeses are much higher. Sometimes I get non fat cheese. I also eat egg whites sometimes - no fat. An egg yolk has 4.5 grams. I am not lactose or gluten intolerant so I eat skim milk and some wheat. Everything is whole food - nothing processed or refined.

I am very healthy on this diet. I got into remission on this diet. I just saw a NP a few days ago and she said I look extremely healthy and my skin looks good. You don't need the fat.

As for what you can buy over the counter to treat it - get ivermectin at the horse feed store. Measure it according to your body weight but start slow.

Artemisinin does not do anything. Herbs are useless. EDTA helps degrade biofilm but it is not absorbed orally so you need IV. You can try LipoPhos EDTA but it is $20 a bottle and you take half the bottle at once. It tastes horrible.

You can also try Artemisinin Essentials which has Liposomal aretimisinin andEDTA. It is expensive too and I don't notice anything on it.

You can try other herbal wormers like mimosa pudica but they aren't going to do much. I would try those after getting into remission.

PR can cause thyroid problems and if you have lost a lot of weight it is possible you have Hashimoto's and are having hyper flares. I did and lost 20 pounds. Start Low Dose Naltrexone after you begin treatment for PR. If you begin LDN too soon, it will cause too much herxing. I eat a lot on this diet and I am at my ideal weight.

Another alternative for yeast is grapefruit seed extract.

--------------------
old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot

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TNT
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nefferdun...

Can PR make the adam's apple hurt? I have this alot now, and have lost alot of weight, and am still losing (mass and muscle). My thyroid labs are always good.

I did two full bottles of alinia. Fry test before and after showed definite improvement in PR, but worsening of cocci.

I felt fine taking alinia, but towards the end of the second bottle I remember feeling more aggression and agitation. Then I did the stupid thing of taking Flagyl after this. Really messed me up.

About a year after this I had a Fry test done that showed no presence of biofilm or PR. But didn't have PCR done. It did show a few cocci left. Is it possible that in spite of the clear smear I still have a bad case of PR? I'm worse off now than when I showed high loads of PR, biofilm, and cocci.

Also, does PR cause you to not have much appetite? I ask because you say you eat alot which would suggest a good appetite. I usually don't feel like eating much.

thanks

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hadlyme
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Thyroid does get out of whack with the proto, but it get's out of whack with lyme and company too.

Labs on thyroid have to be diag. with symptoms, not just numbers.

I've been off and on with Armour for my hypothyroid every few years. I can't loose weight if my life depended on it. Haven't heard of Adams apple hurting with proto...? but we are all different with symptoms.

Most of the bab's symptoms are what proto would give you. I had always thought I had babs symptoms more than lyme. Now I know the protozoan was my 'bugger' all along.

As with any of these bug diseases.... we all react differently to any drug or eating/diets. Find what works for your body and mind. What works for me might not be what works for you.

Any malaria type of meds, natural or rx would be my choice if you want to treat this on ones' own.

Lymeboy, we're not saying NO fats.... just lower. As I said... start out slowly and take fats away each week. Dr. F, my dr, has some patients on diet low fat eating only for treatment. You can herx on this lower fat eating at first, so go slow in the beginning.

PR cause one to not have much appetite? I wish. I eat pretty good and have an appetite. [Smile]
There is no list of symptoms from Dr. F himself. Other lists out there are from other dr.s that are trying to treat the protozoan.
Please beware of where these lists and treatments are coming from if they aren't coming from the dr. that found this bugger. Not saying they are wrong or right... just be aware of who is saying what about the protozoan per their experience.
t

--------------------
Lyme, Babs, Fry Bug..... Whatever it is, may a treatment be discovered to make us all whole again!

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lymeboy
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I'm not sure if I have Proto or not. I have BAAAAD teeth problems. There are no amalgams left in my mouth for almost 3 years now. I have what I think are BArt symptoms - irritability, confusion, depression. I also get headaches. behind the eyes AND on top of the head.

But eating fat doesn't seem to worsen things. In fact, eating a steak usually makes me feel great. I feel stronger, and have a lot more stamina and energy. I don't seem to feel much of a change in sx unless I eat candy (which I don't). I do feel a bit weaker when I eat only veggies and beans. I've tried lowfat and I am constantly distracted with being hungry. I also get very fatigued. Perhaps I'm not doing it right. It seems expensive to have a varied lowfat diet. Money is definitely an issue for me.
I'm game for trying everything at this point. I'm going to continue with Parasite Tx and move on to salt-c in a month or so. If low-fat will help me, I will do it. I'm just wondering (out loud) how much it will cost me and if I'll even be able to pull it off. I get pretty hungry.

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Cattail
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Well, thank goodness, today my symptoms have calmed slightly after two long soaks in epsom salts, lots of lemons, and Alkaselzer Gold.

I still have symptoms though that I did not have before the Diflucan. They are very painful swollen glands under ears, frontal headache (also have already top of head headache), stiff and achy neck in back, under top eyebrows on brow bone especially close to nose feels bruised badly to touch, more swollen eyelids (both more than before), very rumbley eyes and nose area, and of course pain behind upper eys, towards nose more.

Do any of you think that this could possibly be a detox issue? Someone had mentioned on here a few times about histamine release. The eye issues got worse before when I started new abx and Diflucan and not herxing a t all at that time.

Eye issues now are very swollen and dark lids, painful behind upper eyelids, itching bottom inside eyes, rumbling eyes, burning eyes and upper eyelids, scratching badly under top lids(feels like something in the eye all day).

This all started off all med with one watery eye that would water all day long back in January then progressed from there. I had Bart in my eyes before but with more mild and less symptoms.

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nefferdun
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I believe if you suspect you might have PR, then you should get the PCR test. If you don't have it, great. If you do, then you know what you need to do. The diet is strict but it is so effective at controlling PR, not following it is condemning yourself to misery.

I was in remission for about 6 months with diet alone. Truthfully, I go into denial just like the next person, and that is what happened. I was not keeping track of the grams, allowing myself a little more than the 15 grams and paying for it.

F has reported that when a person fasts for 12 days the PR becomes undetectable in the blood, but when that person begins to eat a normal diet again, PR is back in just 2-3 days. If you want to get into remission and stay there, you need to follow the diet.

Many people, including myself, cheat on it. They say it is ok, but actually it isn't. Every single person that is not sticking to the recommended diet is not off drugs and in remission. I know drinking skim milk is not good or baking with egg whites. I just do it anyway and then take the ivermectin as needed.

The problem is, what you eat is a habit. When you allow yourself something, you feel you can't live without it so you tend to keep on eating it. It would be a lot better when you begin the diet, to take it seriously and do it exactly the way you are supposed to. I would not "ease into it". You don't ease off of french fires or potato chips. You ban them.

I think another downfall for me is the spray cans of oil that is supposed to have zero fat. If you check the side of the can, zero fat is for a spray lasting one third of a second! How do you manage that? If you are like me and coat the bottom of the pan, then how much are you really getting? It is better to measure 1 ts of coconut oil so you know there is 5 grams of fat in whatever you are sautéing (and hopefully making for more than one person.)

This diet is very cheap, not expensive. It would be expensive if you were buying the processed meat substitutes but those are not really that healthy. They are mainly soy and/or gluten and many people have issues with one or both of those foods.

You can buy organic beans for less than $2 a pound. One cup of dried beans will make a whole pan of beans. You can either soak them over night or put them in water and bring them to a boil, then turn the heat off and let them soak for an hour before cooking.

If you use a pressure cooker, it takes about 35 minutes to cook them. You can have a meal for about ten cents. If you buy canned beans it is more convenient but a lot more expensive. A can of organic beans is nearly two dollars and you are lucky to get 2 cups of beans in it.

To get all the amino acids, you need to mix whole grains with legumes. I love beans or lentils with rice. You can learn to make curries and stir "fries". If you learn to use spice, it changes things up and makes it more interesting. Soup, chili, spaghetti and shepherds pie can all be made with beans and lentils. There are some great loaves too. All of these are very cheap meals.

There are lots of beans - lava, black, chick pea, pinto, northern, kidney, white kidney, white beans.. . . There are lots of different kinds of rice too - brown basmati, jasmine, green, red, short grain brown, long grain brown, and forbidden Chinese black rice. There is quinoa, barley, corn, millet - so many things to try.

Mushrooms add a LOT of interest and are fairly cheap. I love large grilled portabello mushrooms but the smaller cremini ones are cheaper and the same thing. You can use these instead of meat in spaghetti. There is quinoa spaghetti noodles.

No reason to say you can't do it.

--------------------
old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot

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Catgirl
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I'm glad you're feeling better today!

Swollen glands are parasites on me. Headaches, especially behind the eyes are proto. Stiff achy neck in back is either parasites, babs or proto. All are parasites. I've had pain under my eyebrows too. It felt like they were bruised, but no bruises. Pain behind eyes goes with a proto herx.

I would do what Nefferdun said and change your diet. It is by far the easiest test you can do to tell. I wouldn't even bother with the blood test (JMO). All tests are fallible. For evidence to be in one tiny vile of blood is a flawed format. Look at testing our co infections (flawed). I guess it is helpful if it does show it, but symptoms mean more than anything (just my opinion).

As far as you feeling better after the detoxing stuff, that speaks volumes. I would suspect your abx or diflucan or combination thereof to be part of your issue as well. Lyme is so complex, it's never just one thing. I'm no doc, but for you I'd say proto, parasites, and one or more of your meds is causing it. You might want to get tested for gene mutations too.

Hang in there! [Smile]

--------------------
--Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together).

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Cattail
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Oh yes you guys, after work yesterday I went out and got my new fat free / low fat diet foods. I have already begun. I plan on trying the Ivermectin paste just after I stop the Diflucan. I am currently taking Grapefruit seed Extract and Olive Leak Extract and have been for weeks.

I can't believe Catgirl that you had all my symptoms and they were parasites. Wow, I am so glad you guys are here and are sharing this so candidly, I need that. This is very difficult for me as I have zero support in my life. I never felt this bad from Lyme and Bart, never.

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nefferdun
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Stick with it for at least two months. Do it right. It is whole foods, low fat vegan. Avoid magnesium, calcium and iron, all of which are used to build biofilm Meat of any kind is rich in iron and arginine.

I don't wish this infection on anyone but I do hope for everyone's recover.

--------------------
old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot

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Cattail
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Thank you for all your help. It means more to me than you know, everyone's does.
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