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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » With Candida, why do doctors say no raw, live sauerkraut?

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Author Topic: With Candida, why do doctors say no raw, live sauerkraut?
unsure445
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I am confused. Is it good to eat sauerkraut when candida is an issue or not?

Most practitioners say no.

I have been eating it and I am much worse so I have to wonder. Someone told me you could be making the problem worse by eating the unknown strain of bacteria in the fermented food.

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unsure445

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Brussels
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Many say exactly the opposite. I would go on and try. I do take fermented things AGAINST candida.

Just check and read by yourself and take your own conclusions.

Same about antibiotics. Some say, kill the bad and the good bacteria altogether, you will get well.

Others say the opposite: kill the good bacteria, and you will fall chronically sick.

I don't think medical doctors have a definitive answer for us all. Each body is also different, each candida or fungal infection different.

I just read, and read, and try.

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unsure445
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Thank you Brussels. Great perspective!

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unsure445

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Lymetoo
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Doctors must be afraid that you will GET WELL!

The key is not to do "wild fermentation" until your gut is healed. So .. don't make it in a crock without a starter or a probiotic to add the bacteria.

I make mine in jars with probiotics. It is the best thing I have ever done for my body!!

I am making huge progress and feeling AWESOME!!

-

As for "feeling worse" .. you must be getting a lot of die-off .. the toxins are getting to you. So be sure to clear them and keep your liver clear.

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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Lymetoo
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Here are the basics of how I make mine....

This video will help! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmWiRJxlETY .. 10 min long.

I've been using the second recipe:


Here you go:
______________

Two of Our Favorite Beginners' Recipes

Version 1
3 heads green cabbage, shredded in a food processor
1 bunch kale, chopped by hand
(optional): 2 cups wakame ocean vegetables (measured after soaking), drained, spine removed, and chopped
1 Tbsp. dill weed

Version 2
3 heads green cabbage, shredded in a food processor
6 carrots, large, shredded in a food processor
3 inch piece ginger, peeled and chopped
6 cloves garlic, peeled and chopped

To Make Cultured Vegetables
1. Combine all ingredients in a large bowl

2. Remove several cups of this mixture and put into a blender.

3. Add enough filtered water to make a "brine" the consistency of a thick juice. Blend well and then add brine back into the first mixture. Stir well.

4. Pack mixture down into a glass or stainless steel container. Use your fist, a wooden dowel, or a potato masher to pack veggies tightly.

5. Fill container almost full, but leave about 2 inches of room at the top for veggies to expand.

6. Roll up several cabbage leaves into a tight "log" and place them on top to fill the remaining 2 inch space. Clamp jar closed.

7. Let veggies sit at about a 70 degree room temperature for at least three days. A week is even better. Refrigerate to slow down fermentation. Enjoy!

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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droid1226
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Too and Brussels are right. The total opposite is true. Plus you eliminate most yeast through your bowels which would include using live foods as a tool for regularity.

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http://www.youtube.com/user/droid1226/videos?view=0&flow=grid

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seibertneurolyme
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Refrigerated raw sauerkraut has the good bacteria and also what used to be called vitamin U which is actually glutamine.

Depending on how leaky your gut is and the state of your nervous system sometimes the glutamine can make neuro symptoms and especially seizures worse.

The type you should avoid is sauerkraut made with vinegar.

Bea Seibert

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Lymetoo
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Yes .. no vinegar.

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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unsure445
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Thanks Bea and Lymetoo. Lot's of good information here!

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unsure445

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Lymetoo
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Your health will get better and better on this! [Smile]

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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girl
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A lot of stuff is fermented with vinegar, avoid those. If you use a "starter" you can control what type of bacteria goes into your ferment. This will be a lactobacillus fermentation. It can make you worse before you get better. It can cause gas and diarrhea. Those good bacteria like a clean place in which to live. [Wink]

But hopefully, once you eat a little with every meal and starve the yeast and concentrate on detox as well, all the "good guys" in the cultured vegetables will team up to kill your yeast and create a healthy ecosystem in your gut.

One of the strains in Body Ecology's starter is even resistant to antibiotics so even antibiotics can't kill it. BED starter has 6 hardy strains of beneficial bacteria and yeast. (I sound like a commercial, lol.) [Wink]

Good luck!

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girl
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PS. You are probably worse because you are having die-off (detox). The fermented veggies will do this. It's best to get a RAW sauerkraut that has not been processed as much and does not have salt. Better yet, make your own like Lymetoo! [Wink]
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jlcd1
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Lymetoo what type of probiotic do you use for a starter? Say I have packets of vsl#3 DS. How much of a packet would I use?
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Lymetoo
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I've been using Custom Probiotics. I use one capsule for about 6 small jars. It's 50 billion CFU's per capsule. VSL is WAY more powerful, so go easy.

I've also used "Friendly Force" by Health Force.

I would suggest using only about teaspoon of the VSL. Also, make the "brine" and add the VSL at the very end. Do not run it thru the blender! Just stir it in.

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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girl
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Probiotic will work for a starter but if you buy one with beneficial yeast in it too, then the good yeast can 'group together' and attack the bad yeast in your gut. I like Body Ecology's culture starter. It is very hardy. Once you make a batch of cultured veggies using this, you can take the last part of your batch (a cup or so) to create the next batch so you do not have to keep using new starter packets each time.
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Chipster
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Lymetoo and girl,

Why no vinegar? Is it because of the acidity of it?

Chipster

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girl
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Body Ecology says:

"Nowadays, traditionally fermented foods like sauerkraut and pickles swim in white vinegar on supermarket shelves. White vinegar may give the right kind of sour tang, but not the many health benefits that we receive from friendly bacteria." - See more at: http://fermentedfoods.bodyecology.com/#sthash.FYSvjKGX.dpuf

"White vinegar that is readily available at most supermarkets is refined and therefore, acid forming. This means that using white vinegar can create an acidic condition in your blood, setting the stage for illness and disease."

Also, white vinegar can be a hidden source of gluten.

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Chipster
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hi girl,

thanks for the info.

chipster

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girl
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You're welcome! Cultured vegetables can be an "acquired taste" so don't fret if you don't like them initially. I used to cringe at the thought and not only did I start to like and enjoy them, I now love them! If you want to try and incorporate these into your diet you could always start with some from the health food store or somewhere like www.rejuvenativefoods.com
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unsure445
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I will get the Body Ecology starter.

Thank you all for your wisdom and thoughtful responses!

--------------------
unsure445

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girl
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"Like!" [Wink]
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Lymetoo
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Believe me, gang. I did NOT like cultured vegetables at first. I've never liked sour foods. I don't even like pickles very much .. but I digress!

Now I can actually drink the liquid and I look forward to eating the CV. The results are amazing and I was willing to do anything to get my health back.

I am doing SO WELL! [Smile]

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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Chipster
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Since typically the only thing I can really make is bacon and eggs on Saturday morning, I am not sure about cooking this up.

Will have to maybe talk to one of gals in the family to see if they would be willing.

Chipster

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girl
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.... or "uncooking" it up! [Wink] Is YUMMY with eggs and bacon by the way.
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surprise
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Chipster,
Look for Bubbies sauerkraut in your finer grocery stores:
http://www.bubbies.com/prod_sauerkraut.shtml

I will not ferment in my kitchen (at this point, never say never)
But this pre- made glass container Bubbie product is actually quite good, no vinegar, etc.

--------------------
Lyme positive PCR blood, and
positive Bartonella henselae Igenex, 2011.
low positive Fry biofilm test, 2012.
Update 7/16- After extensive treatments,
doing okay!

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surprise
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P.S.
Wish I could claim eating this daily fixed my gut problems or improved gut issues, but honestly, it didn't for me.

--------------------
Lyme positive PCR blood, and
positive Bartonella henselae Igenex, 2011.
low positive Fry biofilm test, 2012.
Update 7/16- After extensive treatments,
doing okay!

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Brussels
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Lymetutu!!

Great you enjoy that acid taste of fermented veggies! Me too!!!!! Yesterday I just did a fast sauerkraut, and hubby and I ate half of a cabbage AT ONCE!!!!!

It was massive in the amount, but very delicious!!!

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Lymetoo
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Chipster.. see the video I posted above on how to make them. Very simple.

Surprise, I make them in jars and there is no smell in my house. It's not like making it in a crock.

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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girl
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Suprise, you should try a RAW sauerkraut. Bubbies it not raw. Here's a good one.

http://www.rejuvenative.com/

I like Bubbies "okay".. It's a good "starter sauerkraut" to introduce yourself to the taste, but in my opinion, it's just not potent like some of the others.

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surprise
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Thank you! I had no idea, thanks for the link, I will try again--

--------------------
Lyme positive PCR blood, and
positive Bartonella henselae Igenex, 2011.
low positive Fry biofilm test, 2012.
Update 7/16- After extensive treatments,
doing okay!

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Lymetoo
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Comments I read today from others on the candida journey....
-

"But, I must say that I have been taking probiotics in capsules form for a couple years(since way before I joined this group and discovered BED). I never had ANY results from oral probiotic caps...I even took double the dose for a long time. My success started with making my own CV's! Hope this is encouraging news for anyone who reads my comment."

... "I have heard that from many ppl. From what I read that probiotics only make it down your tract so far unlike cultured veggies that actually travel down your digestive tract therefore bringing the good bacteria deep down when probiotic caps wont make it."

-

I have the same thing to be true! Woohoo! [Smile]

[ 02-21-2014, 07:48 PM: Message edited by: Lymetoo ]

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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gigimac
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are the fermented foods something you should do after you finished abx treatment or during?
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Lymetoo
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Before, during and after!! [Big Grin]

Wish I had KNOWN!

Someone told me that one serving of sauerkraut equals 1/2 bottle of probiotics. In some cases it would be more like a whole bottle!

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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MichaelTampa
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quote:
Originally posted by girl:
Suprise, you should try a RAW sauerkraut. Bubbies it not raw. Here's a good one.

http://www.rejuvenative.com/

I like Bubbies "okay".. It's a good "starter sauerkraut" to introduce yourself to the taste, but in my opinion, it's just not potent like some of the others.

Bubbies sells some products that are pasteurized, but their kosher dill pickles and sauerkraut (and maybe a couple other items) are raw.
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Lymetoo
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Thanks, Michael!

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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jwick25
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Wow....this sounds like a really successful way to go. I'm going to have to try this. [Smile]

Just started Fluconazole, and really want to knock this out of my system. I miss feeling better.

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Lymetoo
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And believe me, you don't want to be on fluconazole long term!

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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Marnie
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Candida biofilms and....

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15216946


Which would explain why my daughter has an "allergic" reaction to ASA (as she had the same when she took SIX virgin coconut capsules (not the THREE recommended).

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Lymetoo
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Probiotics can help you lose weight!

http://fitness.mercola.com/sites/fitness/archive/2014/01/17/probiotics-weight-management.aspx

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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Beverly
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Wow, interesting posts. I think this is something I probably need to do. All the abx for all the years kills all the good bacteria, it's hard for the gut to recover.

--------------------
God Bless You! Everything..is just my opinion.

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Lymetoo
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quote:
Originally posted by Beverly:
All the abx for all the years kills all the good bacteria, it's hard for the gut to recover.

-
Very much so!

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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Lymetoo
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5 Reasons Your Digestive System is Not Working Properly:

http://www.naturalnews.com/044034_digestion_enzyme_deficiency_IBS.html#ixzz2uHUp2gLs

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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lundeliz
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Can anyone tell me if the way my mother makes sauerkraut has any probiotic value at all? I love it. It's delicious! She shreds the cabbage, then packs it in canning jars. She pours hot water with salt over the cabbage and seals the jars. In a few weeks it is ready and is yummy and sour. We all love it but does it have any value?
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Lymetoo
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It should. Let me see if I can find out for you. I make mine without heat or salt, but let me ask someone for you. Good question that I have also had because I have a friend who used to make hers that way.

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--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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lundeliz
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Thanks Lymetoo, I would really love to know.
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pointermom
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I love Frank's Kraut. It has no vinegar, but I don't know if it's any good as a probiotic. Anybody familiar with it?

--------------------
One day closer to being cured.....

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Lymetoo
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Still waiting on a reply, lundeliz.

pointer.. is that the one in the bag from the grocery store?

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Dave6002
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lundeliz, it sounds like Kimchi. I used salts but not hot water. Hot water will kill bacteria on the top but not bottom. The probiotics are resistant to heat 50C? So it does have probiotics value but may have different strains or species than Tutu's
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pointermom
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yes, it comes in bags and in cans. I like the "sweet Bavarian style"

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One day closer to being cured.....

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Lymetoo
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Pointer, I don't think anything in a can or bag would contain live cultures.

Especially not in a can.

Dave .. but if the kraut does ferment after the hot water .. by sitting out, then it should contain some live bacteria.

I can't find anyone who knows for sure, but I have one more source of info.

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Lymetoo
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quote:
Originally posted by lundeliz:
Can anyone tell me if the way my mother makes sauerkraut has any probiotic value at all? I love it. It's delicious! She shreds the cabbage, then packs it in canning jars. She pours hot water with salt over the cabbage and seals the jars. In a few weeks it is ready and is yummy and sour. We all love it but does it have any value?

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liz.. Someone I've contacted says they aren't sure. They asked, "Does it have bubbles when it ferments, and how long do you let them ferment?"

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lundeliz
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Thanks for trying to find out for me, Lymetoo. I'm not sure about the bubbles. Do the bubbles mean it's good? I think my mother said it takes maybe a month to be ready. Well, anyway, I'll keep eating it cause I love it! Thanks again.
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