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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » pain , what to do about joint and other pain

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Author Topic: pain , what to do about joint and other pain
LisaK
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so I just finished a treatment for bartonella (herbals) and now that I am done I have terrible pain in every joint and it seems like in every inch of my bones, plus I have no strength.

so.... is this die off? maybe?

I don't like all this pain. anyone have any ideas on best way to help it or cover it up or get rid of pain?

it is 24/7 and I can't sleep well or sit well or anything.

I know I shouldn't take acetaminophen or ibuprofen, but is there another option that really works? without begin too harmful

I searched here but the search didn't find anything specific

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Be thankful in all things- even difficult times and sickness and trials - because there is something GOOD to be seen

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Razzle
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Some LLMD's recommend Alkaseltzer Gold for herxing.

Nonpharmaceutical options for pain:

Homeopathic Arnica (pellets dissolved under the tongue) helps with pain, bruising, shock/trauma.

Homeopathic Ruta (for joint pain worse from movement).

Homeopathic Hypericum (for nerve pain).

Stinging nettles - Buhner recommends 1200mg/day for joint pain.

Heating pad or electric blanket...or soak in a warm Epsom salt bath.

Detoxing can help.

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-Razzle
Lyme IgM IGeneX Pos. 18+++, 23-25+, 30++, 31+, 34++, 39 IND, 83-93 IND; IgG IGeneX Neg. 30+, 39 IND; Mayo/CDC Pos. IgM 23+, 39+; IgG Mayo/CDC Neg. band 41+; Bart. (clinical dx; Fry Labs neg. for all coinfections), sx >30 yrs.

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LisaK
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ok Razzle, sounds like good place to try. thanks a bunch

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Be thankful in all things- even difficult times and sickness and trials - because there is something GOOD to be seen

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Robin123
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Turmeric powder works to reduce my joint pain pretty quickly. I get it in bulk at the healthfood store and put it in capsules.
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LisaK
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I have been hearing a lot about tumeric. is it the spice you get to put on food? same thing, but just put it in capsules, Robin?

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Be thankful in all things- even difficult times and sickness and trials - because there is something GOOD to be seen

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lymeinhell
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New Chapter makes a fantastic supplement called Zyflamend that is for inflammation and associated pain. It does contain tumeric and lots of other anti-inflammatories. I swear by this stuff!! I used to give it to my elderly dogs, and I've seen more than 1 veterinarian recommend it for dogs.

You can pretty much find it everywhere now. Take 2 with food, and if things don't improve, take 2 more every couple hours.

http://www.newchapter.com/zyflamend/zyflamend-whole-body#supplement-facts

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Julie
_ _ ___ _ _
lymeinhell

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LisaK
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Thanks lymeinhell. that sounds great

Carol, is Excedrin aspirin?

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Be thankful in all things- even difficult times and sickness and trials - because there is something GOOD to be seen

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LisaK
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I think this pain is my RMSF. I think since all my previous treatments worked, and by the pattern that follows each, I would say that the last linguring symptoms are from that (mostly)- joint pain, abdominal pain, heart irregularities.

this gives me hope that with my RMSF treatment this might all go away. I sure hope so.

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Be thankful in all things- even difficult times and sickness and trials - because there is something GOOD to be seen

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lymeinhell
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LisaK, do not combine Zyflamend with aspirin or Excedrin. Use one or the other.

Heart irregularities (high blood pressure or irregular bp, tacchyiacardia, palpitations) often times is severe magnesium deficiency. And no amount of antibiotics will fix that. A year of taking oral did nothing for mine, and it was not till I did several magnesium IV's and started weekly magnesium IM injections did my heart palpitations and blood pressure all over the map (despite being on a beta blocker) finally go back to normal.

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Julie
_ _ ___ _ _
lymeinhell

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LisaK
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lymeinhell, my heart troubles seem to coincide with my menstrual cycle. is that weird?

like the week before it is wild and scary, then right after it goes away to once or twice a day with a couple missed beats. !

I tell the drs over the years but they never comment so I figure they have no idea....

I do take mag, but have not been faithful as I don't always remember. I don't know if I saw a difference with that or not. my brain is damaged I think. poo

I did take arnica last night and today, and I must say that I slept very well and had reduced pain today! I am impressed. of course there is the chance that it's just easing up on its own.

I will continue with arnica since that is all I have here until I hit the store possibly this weekend

thanks everyone!!!

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Be thankful in all things- even difficult times and sickness and trials - because there is something GOOD to be seen

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Carol in PA
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LisaK, if you are taking magnesium, you may also want to take D3.

The magnesium won't absorb properly if your Vitamin D level is too low.

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LisaK
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I am supposed to take that too. I wish I could just get a machine that automatically injects me with everything I am supposed to take! I keep forgetting!!!

Thanks for the reminder!

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Be thankful in all things- even difficult times and sickness and trials - because there is something GOOD to be seen

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Robin123
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by LisaK:
[QB] I have been hearing a lot about tumeric. is it the spice you get to put on food? same thing, but just put it in capsules, Robin?

...................................................

Yep. Very simple to do.

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lymeinhell
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Lisa, I had EXACTLY the same experience. Every 28 days. I'd wake up and my pulse would be 124+. In addition to head pain (which turned out to be a muscle spazm), and high BP.

That last time sent me running to the LLMD. Who then gave me my first (but not last) IV of magnesium. I'd had refused up to that point I guess because of the stigma of IV... not sure why... Tiny needle in the back of my hand, 20 minutes, and tada I felt completely NORMAL. So that was the first of several IV's, and the beginning of my weekly IM injections of magnesium. Best thing I ever did.

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Julie
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lymeinhell

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LisaK
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hmm IV mag.... interesting!

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Be thankful in all things- even difficult times and sickness and trials - because there is something GOOD to be seen

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Robin123
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Want to add mention of teasel root tincture - it too can treat joint pain. For me, it only worked for around two months, so I switched to turmeric.
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LisaK
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I went to the store- there was tumeric powdered in a one pound bag for $12.

and there was some in capsules in a jar of about 60 I think for $30. I think they were 500mg.

Which way is best? the lady at store said it is a different potency in the capsules, but she didn't really know for sure as she was guessing.

can I just get the ground spice in a bag?

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Be thankful in all things- even difficult times and sickness and trials - because there is something GOOD to be seen

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Ellen101
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Turmeric did not work for me an zyflamend increased my pain. Cutting out all gluten, soy, dairy, starches and grains worked wonders.
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LisaK
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I don't eat soy, very rarely eat cow dairy or wheat, but I do eat spelt and sometimes other grains.

Carol, I will check that out but what I want to know is - is the stuff in expensive pill form the same as the bulk spice? will I need to take more of the bulk bag kind? is there stronger potency in the already made pills?

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Be thankful in all things- even difficult times and sickness and trials - because there is something GOOD to be seen

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mattnapa
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Curcumin is the concentrated form
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Marnie
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The natural "big-gun" anti-inflammatories look to be berberine (Glycox) and Zyflamend.

Most people do not experience MORE PAIN with Zyflamend.

I wonder if you (Ellen) are allergic to any one of the (many) components?

Rosemary is tough for me.

BTW...

Several studies show that rosemary inhibits foodborne pathogens like

***Listeria monocytogenes,***

B. cereus, and S. aureus

Rosemary is generally considered safe when taken in recommended doses.

However, there have been occasional reports of allergic reactions.

People with high blood pressure, ulcers,

***Crohn's disease, or ulcerative colitis***

should not take rosemary.

http://umm.edu/health/medical/altmed/herb/rosemary

Google: Berberine Crohn's Disease and Berberine ulcerative colitis

The product is Glycox and it is available on Amazon. From what I've read, 500mg TID looks to be safe. Length of time - # of days? PERHAPS 20 days.

Glycox is an anti-inflammatory too and works in MULTIPLE ways besides that.

You may tolerate it better and

it may heal your "gut"...more specifically help the endothelial cells that line the intestine.

Mg is an anti-inflammatory, anti-histamine and inhibits HMG CoA reductase (works like statin drugs).

Problem is...getting sufficient amts. BACK into the cells where it binds to ATP as Mg-ATP.

Excess Mg in the blood stream is usually eliminated within 2 hours - the kidneys regulate the blood level of Mg.

Testing for Mg levels is difficult because most of it is in soft tissues, not in the blood stream.

Some additional reading about Mg:

http://drsircus.com/medicine/magnesium/inflammation-and-systemic-stress

Mg IS available in "ionic" form that can be applied to the skin. We DO absorb things thru our skin.

It would also be curious to do an experiment: to Almond massage oil, add a few drops of clove oil and apply to achy areas. Clove oil is a CB2 agonist.

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