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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » Difficulty detoxing?

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Author Topic: Difficulty detoxing?
beck
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I have a family member who does not detox well at all, resulting in very bad herx reactions.

I am wondering if anyone else has had difficulty detoxing and what have they done about it.

What are best and most powerful detox methods?

I know you cannot get better without detoxing, so this is something we have to find a solution for.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

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Robin123
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They could do the www.23andme.com saliva test and have the results analyzed by www.geneticgenie.com - that will show any genetic detox difficulties. Then you need to work with a medical practitioner who understands how to boost the weaker pathways.

I'm a difficult detoxer. The test results are going help guide my medical care with a knowledgeable LLMD.

What I can do is detox in a far infrared sauna tent - you can find them on eBay for a little under $200. You sit in it until you sweat - takes me about 1/2 hour. Then shower off warm and cool. I also take a small scoop of takesumi activated charcoal to help with internal detoxing.

By doing the sauna, my chemical sensitivity has lessened. It works by sweating out toxins through the skin.

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ping
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Straightening out systemic detox problems can be very difficult, especially the older one gets. The links and testing given above are a good start; at least you know what you're up against. Methylation, or other. Most TBD patients have these systemic problems, unfortunately.

--------------------
ping
"We are more than containers for Lyme"

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beck
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Thank you so much for the suggestions.

We know the patient has MTHFR, the C677T single gene mutation.

We have been working with an endocrinologist and the patient has been taking different supplements to try to work around that, but it does not seem to be enough.

We will test them to see if there are any other genetic detox problems.

Hopefully that will give us a few answers.

They have been taking the parsley and bubur drops from Nutrigenix, as well as Lymphomyosot and Viscomforce.

Does anyone know how good these are?

Thanks!

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springshowers
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Make sure your not just at a peak toxic level
I found that I had to engage in 4 x the detoxing and back off treating for about four months and then it was like I unclogged a drain plugged tub,

Ever since I now can take meds and anti biotics so easily when before I could barely tolerate any at a

This proves to me it was my toxic load
I also thought I was doing enough.
I had to spend literally most my waking hours detoxing in done form and pushing to get toxins out. M
Best thing I ever did.

Don't ever think your doing enough detox if your not
Tolerating antibiotics due to severe or quick herx

Also I would do all detox only prior to trying treating if possible.
It took me awhile to realize this and my before and after reactions to same meds proved that it was my body toxic load.

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dogmom2
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Is there a way to tell your body is at peak toxic level?
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birdie67
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Great advise springshowers!!
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beck
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I agree springshowers. It might be better to stop treatment and just detox for a while.

Thanks for the advice.

Just out of curiosity, can you have a herx reaction to detoxing?

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springshowers
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Yes !!!

What I did was started with things like coffee enrmas and measuring water intake and dry body brushing
And gentle baths and Ionic foot baths.
Things that were stimulating the flow out and I added one at a time to monitor myself. I rifed only organ supports and detox channels.
I mean I was doing those daily up to 4 to 8 times a day.
Then I added more powerful detox baths and heat induced infa red saunas. All the while doing elimination diet.
Minus all dairy. Minus all meats. Minus all grains. Minus all sugars. 10 to 20 grams of fat. No preservatives and no packaged prepared foods. No junk and no fast food.
The diet even induced herx once I passed a certain line so go in steps. Its a huge detox support like no other.

I found you had to make it like a full time job but well worth it !
I started a detox support thread back then.
People all added there ideas and modalities and supplements.

Adding things like clay or charchol are good but if your doing a great diet it's not needed until you start treating by adding killing treatments. If you even need it. You have to monitor your reactions and gauge that when you get there.

For now I would rate diet 100 x higher than the internal absorbing things if you stop treating bugs for now.

I am sure I am forgetting some things I did when I was full on full time but the key was to do it ongoing and multiple times a day and build up monitoring yourself.

If your thin. Then the diet may need meal protein shakes to keep intake high enough. If not losing fat is also detoxing as toxins hide and live in fat cells.
I gained 50 lbs first year I got sick and then another 15 when my back went bad.
I've lost the 50 and as it dropped it was a big change too in my toxin level.

The first stage was about three months long where biggest herxing happened. Then next three months it was less herxing. By next three months it was clearing out and flowing. And then I just kept fine tuning and I now don't have to do such intensive detox regimen to keep it going but I do do coffee enrmas and dry body scrubs and my diet is extra clean !

I do every so often give a push of like 30 days as there can be a fine line where you think your doing enough but you give one more inch and then there comes to change.

Like the diet. I thought I was doing great and I didn't see it doing much. I had to keep pushing and eliminating and being consistent and then bam the results showed up.

Its a big commitment and you have to be quite serious.

It's reminds me of those who get on diets and its so hard to actually do it.

I won't lie. It's not easy. I was sick a good number of years prior too. This may not apply to everyone.

It just was my case.
If I met anyone though and was asked to give advise this would be number one for sure !!

You can slow down after you clear yourself but if you have chronic Lyme you can't stop the lifestyle in my opinion.

You may want to search for the detox support thread
I believe I named it exactly that.

I wish you well and I know that feeling of detox being such an issue.

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Pebbles
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That's great advice SpringShowers. Thank you!!!

I am going right now to search for that thread.

I have been working with an ND the past couple of months for yeast, he is actually the one who diagnosed me as still having Lyme.

Summer months are particularly hard on me because of the heat, so my last visit I told him this is basically what I wanted to do.

I am soooo super sensitive to everything and sometimes it will backfire on me if I go overboard on any anti fungal treatments.

So I want to spend the whole summer just detoxing. My diet is good already, but I cut back even more on the carbs and I herxed just from that.

I feel like I am doing the right thing, so I am glad to hear that it helped you.

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springshowers
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Very good. !
Yes fine tuning diet can even herx you as it can start starving biofilms etc.

Hey check out my new coffee enema post.

If you struggle with yeast and also want to detox.
I would not skip using coffee enemas and probiotic enema inserts and also build up to enema series or multiples a day - if you going for a strong detox pulse -

See the link in the thread which gives a long list of recipes

I think your doing the right thing and a summer is when I like doing a stronger three month push.

But I also stick with things ongoing inbetween just not needed near as much.

Good luck and let is know how or goes !

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Mystery
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Springshowers, what are your opinions on detox baths, similar to this one: http://healthylivinghowto.com/1/post/2012/01/detoxification-part-i-healing-waters.html for people who want to detox but don't have the money to get saunas and things like that?
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springshowers
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Mystery.
Yes to baths.
There are many recipe ideas for detox baths Online as well.

The only comment I have is I used real salt and not Epsom
Salt as my doctor told me to avoid magnesium because of my biofilm loads. .

This has been debated many times so do your research on the subject.

I have put towels at the crack of door on the floor and heating bathroom with stream along with bath to get hot as possible.

You also can and should do a natural bristle dry brush to the skin prior to the bath which opens pours and stimulates lymphs. I do this before showers daily.

The exact technique you can find online.

Also the detox support thread has links to various techniques
And ideas .

The bath is one of the basic and best home use detox
Treatments used which is outer modality.

When I was in a more aggressive detox mode I did 4 baths a day.. That's when recepies come to be helpful as you can rotate things you might add like vinegar and baking soda and salts and essential oils and peroxide and various things but also a basic hot bath can be enough and starting at just getting a hot bath and being able to tolerate it is a great start.

You may have to start Basic and shorter baths and not as hot and track the response and work from a personal journal forward.

I used all either free or very cheap detoxing methods for home.
I used my daughters mini tramp for example for rebounding and lymph drainages and did those inbetween baths and other treatments.

I did go a bit crazy for a few months doing near non stop detoxing work. Some things help you through herx from another. You really have to try things and figure out how to incorporate and time things .

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Pebbles
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Springshowers......can I ask how your health is today?

The Detox Support Thread was 4 years ago now. So I was wondering how all that detox has impacted your health and how you are feeling now.

I know you said that after all the detox you were able to handle the treatments better, so I wanted to know how well you were today?

Thanks

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springshowers
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Hi

In the last four years due to family loss and relocation and because I have been feeling so much better.

I returned as I decided to get serious about the rebuilding of the damage and also figuring out the how to resolve my last symptom I have not been able to resolve fully.

But I had a list of about 50 symptoms and was severely ill and bedridden at the time of 4 years back.

They are all either 100 percent gone or 90 percent gone.
I was on narcotics and lived in severe severe pain and over these four years have decreased and now I am off them.

I do keep on board a quite low dose anti parasitic regimen and anti biofilm to maintain and to try to help with this last fatigue that I have not been able to completely resolve. I would say I have gotten 50 percent of it in last 4 years and it was my first symptom and my last to resolve. But at my peak I had two long pages of symptoms and I was ready to end it all.

I treated a list of about 8 co infections and I have had a list of 8 others that have been old activated infections of various types.
I was loaded! It did take a few years to find the lyme as when I first got ill they found so many other infections they thought they knew what was going on. After treating those and not getting better we found the lyme and co infections.

Anyway I was quite a severe and difficult case.
I know not all people have the bigger issues of detox or the toxin load like I did but when I made this post I saw a group of others that were like me. WE all were posting that we could not tolerate any of the meds and anti invectives and that when we tried to "push through" as we were told it was just a herx we never saw that improvement we were told would happen. Even getting ongoing worse as we tried that approach trying to be strong and be good patients.

Upon being bedridden I was able to just have my laptop and read and research and I decided I have to do something drastic as I was just giving up and nobody could help me. I had seen HMD and NMDs even who tried everything on me and I was stuck and sick they would say they had never seen anyone so bad or not respond to there treatments and they would send me off with a pat on my leg saying they were so sorry. Of course conventional doctors mostly said see a psychiatrist or they just were not educated enough of my needs etc.

Anyway. For those people that might be in my situation I wanted to share my experience.

I still visualize that I was a tub filled with murky muddy dirty water so bad it was sludge that could not drain and would just get worse and thicker and infected and gross. I would go to the ER with High White Blood Cell counts and passed out needing ambulances due to me having such toxicity and not realizing how bad I was. The doctors never could figure it out and would release me after days and I had to figure it out on my own. The emergency situations really got me thinking and researching esp as doctors seem so dumbfounded and had no answers. I realized I am so loaded that my body is just one big toxin swamp and only I can do something about it myself.

To support this theory I had to give a huge push of the detox and it did take months of building up and hard work but I was able to take the sludge and start filtering it and cleaning it and it started to get thinner and clearer and I kept doing this faster than it could regenerate or continue to exist this way. And one day I swear it was like the clog undid itself. I could feel the flow and change so distinctively. I kept up the hard work and then I started trying the treatments again and over this 4 years has been life changing all due to the detox regimen. And I then was reacting and treating like many others here who actually can take meds and track changes and make incremental progress. That alone was so huge and I have been so happy about it.

It was a profound change for me.
Others many not be in this situation.
But Many may be or are or are to a lesser degree.

You have to take your own body and evaluate where you are.
How long you have been ill. How you respond to medications and killing of the infections. How you do with detox at all. How you feel.
Your history. Your infectious load. Your detox abilities.
So many things.

WE all would be on a different level of things but even the best of the people with this disease need to use detox to support the body during treatments.

For me I was probably on the extreme end.

But if it changed me that much I think I needed to share it with others who might also be in my situation or even somewhat in it.


I hope that helps.
PS What I have left I have pinned down to the vascular issues this disease took a toll on me and settled hard in my veins exactly between my brain and heart. I have pinned it down to where its happening and though imaging and testing using laser treatments I know the exact spots I am struggling with. My doctor does believe my fatigue left is due to the vein issues and blood flow issues and so that is what I am concentrating on and the rebuilding and regenerating of my body on a cellular level to be healing itself.

I am so glad so many can learn to catch this disease early. It did not work that way of me so I have some damage to nerves and heart and lungs and this disease has weakened me. Also like a water system of pipes the longer there is things running through them and not being cleaned out the harder and thinking the build up and it can take longer to clear than if it is a newer system.

So I am slower to reverse I think that many but there are many of us who are in my situation of having to unravel this thing from a state where we had it for years undiagnosed and also had the detox issues on top of it all.

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Pebbles
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springshowers.....thank you so much for that post. That helps tremendously. I know I am doing the right thing now by just focusing on detoxing.

It's hard to think that way because you think you are going to lose progress or backslide by not treating the bugs. But this makes so much sense to me.

I have been sick now for 15 years. I was "lucky" and caught my lyme with a bullseye pretty early, but I was hit very hard and not given adequate treatment.

After a few years I saw Dr. H and I was treated by him for different co-infections too. I was one of those people that never really made much progress with antibiotics.

After being treated my entire second pregnancy I felt much better, but then started to feel bad again, so I thought that my remaining problems were yeast.

I have been trying to self treat yeast for about 5 years now and can only tolerate very minute amounts of anti fungals.

I finally saw an ND a few months ago to help and he says he can't figure me out....LOL. I told him on my last visit that I wanted to take a break from everything and just focus on detoxing.

I really feel this will help and I am so glad I came across your post.

Thanks again!!

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