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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » butter milk & kefir

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Author Topic: butter milk & kefir
5dana8
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Couldn't you make your own kefir easily at home

with butter-milk, yogart and sprinkle some probiotics in it?

Not sure if you would ferment this in fridge or not?

I know kefir topic has been done alot but thought this may be an easier idea for those of us who are too tired and confused with kefir recipes.

Any reply's would be greatly appreciated

Thanks [Smile]
dana

--------------------
5dana8

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Mo
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I know some people make their own yoghurt, I think GiGi has posted on it (?)

As far as Kefir, to get the real benefits you just need some real (live) grains..
which are not in stores.

Once you have those, it's pretty easy to culture this most potent probiotic!
I do this instead of yoghurt.

I don't take capsules anymore, kefir, kombucha, and/or Apple Cider Vinegar (and GiGi's sauerkraut) are much better probiotics and they serve as food/nutrition as well.

http://users.sa.chariot.net.au/~dna/kefirpage.html

Mo

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5dana8
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Thanks Mo for the webb site.

So it's all about fermenting the grains.

I am so comfused of late and can't read much of where on the site to get a simple recipe to make kifer

say an alzheimer's patient could follow.LOL

I am going to have to do some digging to get a simple recipe that my simple mind can follow.

But it looked like an excellent site and I saved it on my fav list. For when the fog lifts [Smile]

Take care
blessings
dana

--------------------
5dana8

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gael1111
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Dana,

In the meantime you can purchase kefir at wholefoods. I buy plain not sweet no fos. Great probiotic.

Good Luck


Gael

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pomegranite
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it is also very easy to naturally and wildly ferment cabbage to make saurkraut which is totally loaded with probiotics and vitamins. Costs about 50 cents for cabbage salt and water.

Pomegranite

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dontlikeliver
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Dana,

You get the grains, which are like a dry powder in a small sachet, sprinke it in luke-warm milk, then whisk it up and let sit for about 24 hours at room temperature. Fermentation happens in the warm (not fridge).

I still use probiotics also.

DLL

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5dana8
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Thanks pomegranite [Smile]
My body can't digest saurkraut just yet. I did read GiGi's post on it a while back and it is a great way to replace some flora.

Dontlikeliver [Smile]
Thanks for the info on how to ferment the grains at room temp!
Do you add anything else to your's other than the grains ,like yogart?

Gael1111 [Smile]
Thanks for your information on where to purchase it at whole foods. I hope this is an online service...I have to check. My healthfood store went out of business a while back, and now I purchase everything on line.

I have been trying to eat more salads as a natural way of geting unprocessed fod into my system.

my system is has very little flora left
becuase dispite being on a very stick anti-yeast diet and taking tons of probiotics I still have yeast problems.

12 years of being on abx will do that to me and now I have been working really hard on replenishing.

Take care
and thanks again.
dana

--------------------
5dana8

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5dana8
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Does any one know if drinking buttermilk

along with kefir and yogart

could help in replacing flora?
(of cours along with tons of probiotics)

I have read that buttermilk was an old timey remedy.

Thanks [Smile]

--------------------
5dana8

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Mo
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If you check out Dom's site I posted up there somewhere..

That's the real Kefir, the one with the most probiotics.

That is only made with real grains, not powdered or dried or store bought (tho there is a woman on ebay who cultures them with goat's milk, and last I tried, her grains were excellent)

Made with real grains is the only way to get 'medicinal' benefits IMO. When you drikn REAL kefir, you see immediate results.
My children started sleeping through the night and had immediate improvement in BM's that was amazing.
They won't go a day without it, on their own accord.
Eastern Europeans have this in their house and drink it every day for breakfast. The Caucus mountain folk have used it for a thousand years. There is no comparison to real kefir. Anything used for hundreds of years has merit, IMO.
You would have to eat pounds of yoghurt or commercial kefir and take tons of probiotic capsules to get the results from a few ounces of this stuff.
All the 'science' is on Dom's site as ro the exact bacterial makeup.

I have live grains, but only enough to mail a batch off to someone every two weeks or so.

Once you get your own grains, they will keep propogating, and you will never need new ones again (if you care for them properly, which is easy) .. and you can then share them as they grow.

There is also a Yahoo list called
REAL Kefir Making (RKM) where you can post for grains.

Everyone shares them for free, just the cost of postage.

Mo

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Lymetoo
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So even if you buy PLAIN kefir in the store, which has 12 grams of sugar, it's OK for yeast?? I try not to ingest anything with that much sugar content and I avoid dairy.

Reassure me here!! [Wink]

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--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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Mo
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I'll give my simple unserstanding, and then some info I based it on..

Basically (and again, I can ONLY speak for live, real kefir, not the store stuff - and this info below is re: real kefir ONLY as well)

The grains, the probiotic clusters..
'eat' the milk and they grow.. digesting it sort of, thereby eating much of the sugar, and turning it into something far more digestable for us.

The other aspect is that the bactreria in real kefir is the kind that makes War on bad Candida overgrowth and other bad bacteria in the entire digestive tract. This is amazing for digestion and thereby, immune function.
There are 'good yeasts' that also take care of balancing the 'bad' ones.
Yeast is not bad, just certain species, and even those only when they are out of control.

The explaination to what I am saying is appended directly below, and then at the bottom I am linking the nutritional make-up of real Kefir, aside from the the bacterial..

Mo

*******************************


Typical Microflora Isolated from Batches of Kefir Grains Divided into Four Genus Groups

LACTOBACILLI
Lactobacillus acidophilus
Lb. brevis
Lb. casei
Lb. casei subsp. rhamnosus
Lb. casei subsp. pseudoplantarum
Lb. paracasei subsp. paracasei
Lb. cellobiosus
Lb. delbrueckii subsp. bulgaricus
Lb. delbrueckii subsp. lactis
Lb. fructivorans
Lb. helveticus subsp. lactis
Lb. hilgardii
Lb. kefiri
Lb. kefiranofaciens [reclassified as Lb. kefiranofaciens subsp. kefirgranum subsp. nov] *
Lb. kefirgranum sp. nov **
Lb. parakefir sp. nov **
Lb. lactis
Lb. plantarum

STREPTOCOCCI/LACTOCOCCI
Lactococci lactis subsp. lactis
Lc. lactis var. diacetylactis
Lc. lactis subsp. cremoris
Streptococci salivarius subsp. thermophilus
S. lactis
Enterococcus durans
Leuconostoc cremoris
L. mesenteroides

YEASTS
Candida kefir
C. pseudotropicalis [can utilize lactose]
C. rancens
C. tenuis
Debaryomyces hansenii *** [can utilize lactose]
Kluyveromyces lactis [can utilize lactose]
K.. marxianus var. marxianus [can utilize lactose]
K.. bulgaricus
K.. fragilis / marxianus
Saccharomyces subsp. torulopsis holmii
S. carlsbergensis
S. unisporus
Zygosaccharomyces rouxii ***
ACETOBACTER
Acetobacter aceti
A. rasens


Units Count of Microbes in Gram Stained Kefir Grains

Bacilli [single cells, pair, chains]
Streptococci [pair, chains]
Yeast [single cells]
The Means Range
Bacilli 66, 62-69%
Streptococci 16, 11- 12%
Yeast 18, 16- 20% [10]

Evolution Cycle [sequence] among Genus Group of Organisms of Kefir During the Culture Cycle

Lactococci > Lactobacilli > Leuconostoc > Yeast > Acetobacter

Microbial Composition of Kefir at End of Fermentation [cfu/ml] ****

Lactococci : 1,000,000,000
Leuconostocs : 100,000,000
Lactobacilli : 5,000,000
Acetobacter : 100,000
Yeast : 1,000,000

Reference:

Encyclopaedia of Food Science, Food Technology and Nutrition [1993] [pp. 1804-1808] Edited by R Macrae, RK Robinson, MJ Sadler.

* Vancanneyt M, Mengaud J, et. al. [2004]. Reclassification of Lactobacillus kefirgranum Takizawa et al. 1994 as Lactobacillus kefiranofaciens subsp. kefirgranum subsp. nov. and emended description of L. kefiranofaciens Fujisawa et al. 1988. Int J Syst Evol Microbiol. 2004 Mar;54(Pt 2):551-6.

** International Journal of Systematic Bacteriology 44 (3) 435-439 [1994]
*** T Loretana, JF Mosterta and BC Viljoen [2003] Microbial flora associated with South African household kefir. S. Afr. J. Sci. Vol. 99 No. 1/2

**** Rea, MC, Lennartsson T, et. al.[1996] Irish kefir-like grains; their structure, microbial compositoin and fermentation kenetics. J. of Applied Bacteriology 81 [1] 83-94

List of Bacterial Names with Standing in Nomenclature - Genus Lactobacillus


END NOTES : Candida albicans has never been isolated from kefir grains, for conditions make it impossible for this particular opportunistic yeast to flourish. Certain yeasts of kefir include Candida as part of the nomenclature [name]. These yeasts are not opportunistic yeasts such is the case with C. albicans, but instead are classified as Generally Regarded As Safe [GRAS]. Such yeasts may in fact have the potential to keep C. albicans in check in the host.

References:

10. Molska, I. ; Kocon, J. ; Zmarlicki, S. [1980] Electron microscopy studies on structures and microflora of kefir grains. Acta Alimentaria Polonica. 6 (3) 145-154 [Dep. of Food Tech., Warsaw Agric. Univ. Warsaw, Poland].

11. Toba, T.; Arihara, K.; Adachi, S. [1990] Distribution of microorganisms with particular reference to encapsulated bacteria in kefir grains. International Journal of Food microbiology. 10 (3/4) 219-224. [Lab. Of Anim. Products Tech., Fac. Of Agric., Tohoku Univ., Tsutsumidori-Amamiyamachi 1-1, Aobaku, Sendai 981, Japan].

12. Microorganisms in Processing of Dairy Products pp. 284.

13. Encyclopaedia of food science, food technology, and nutrition. [1993] pp. 1804-1808. Edited by R Macrae, RK Robinson, MJ Sadler.

14. Rosi, J. [1978] Kefir micro-organisms: yeasts. Scienza e Tecnica Lattiero-Casearia 29 [2] pp. 59-67.

15. Garrote, Graciela L., et. al. [2001] Chemical and microbiological characterisation of kefir grains. Journal of dairy research vol 68, No. 4, pp. 639-652.

16 Sedova, NN. [1974] Detection and quantitive determination of Shigella sonnei in milk and milk products. Voprosy Pitaniya No. 4, pp. 42-45.


****************************

Composition of Kefir:

http://users.sa.chariot.net.au/~dna/kefir-composition.htm

This link has the nutritional make-up in the end product.
Kefir tastes a little like buttermilk, but has allot more 'good guys' in it.

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burnbitter
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quote:
Originally posted by 5dana8:
Does any one know if drinking buttermilk

along with kefir and yogart

could help in replacing flora?
(of cours along with tons of probiotics)

I have read that buttermilk was an old timey remedy.

Thanks [Smile]

I have a friend who had a bad yeast infection which was undiagnosed for years...
he swears by buttermilk, thought the pills were a waste of time and yougurt wasn't quite as good.

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WildCondor
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I drink kefir every day, 6-8 ounces, blueberry is really good. I also like the plain. I LOVE the Greek yogurt Fage, and the Australian brand wallaby, I rotate all my brans and love them all except for the yucky sugary ones. Activia is good too.
Going to go have some now! [Big Grin]

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dontlikeliver
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Hi Dana,

No, I do not add yogurt, because essentially Kefir IS yogurt.

The only thing I do is when it is fermented and chilled in the fridge afterwards, I add a little bit of decaf coffee and stevia and it is like a coffee shake.

I can't buy it any other way in the UK, they do not sell it in any stores ready made of flavored.

DLL

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5dana8
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Thanks for all your replys guys! [Smile]

I went searching all of my on line sites like vitacost ect..( No healthfood stores around here any more)

I tryed the whole food place but they don't sell online
and the site given above is for selling grains only.

Because I just wanted to try some manufactured kefir before I got into fermenting my own

and can't find an on line place to by a sample.

anyone know where?

Thanks! [Smile]

--------------------
5dana8

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5dana8
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Thanks don'tlike liver [Smile]

Is the kerfir you make and drink clear then?.

Some of the ones pictured looked like a milk base? [Smile]

--------------------
5dana8

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dontlikeliver
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No, it's not clear. It looks, tastes like yogurt pretty much, but thinner.

You make it with milk, so it's milk colored.

DLL

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Lymetoo
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Dana, are you sure your grocery store doesn't sell Kefir? I live in a small town and ours sells it.

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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5dana8
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Hey Lymetoo

I wish. They don't have it here at any grocery stores.

That is why I am trying to find it on line

Thanks for the suggestion though [Smile]

--------------------
5dana8

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Lymetoo
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If you figure out how to make it, let me know! [and vice versa!]

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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Lymetoo
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Dana, Go to www.mercola.com and type in "kefir" in the search. You can order the starter powder. DLL says to mix it in milk. I THINK I'm capable of doing that! [Roll Eyes]

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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5dana8
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Thanks lymetoo [Smile]

I just ordered a started kit

and will let you know if there is any trick to this.

Take care [Smile]

--------------------
5dana8

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Lymetoo
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quote:
Originally posted by 5dana8:


I just ordered a started kit

[/QB]

I did too! Hope it works!!

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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