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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » becareful with artemisinin

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Author Topic: becareful with artemisinin
polar blast
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I took art for three days and I had the worst

herx of my life...

I thought that I had done damage to myself and
brain.

The herx made it so I could not think and slurred my words very baddly..all my old

symptoms came back..along with crazy tingling thru the spine..and I felt like I was energized.

the nerves felt raw in the legs and feet and wiered dizzyness..

I went to the neuro and had all tests done...emg..needle in muscle..mri...heart check...all ok..

I am finally starting to feel a little better but I know that I must keep fighting the bug...

on monday I start mepron for babs as my llmd thinks that I may have an underlying babs case..along with zithromax..

he says he does not approve of artemisinin as it is not approved..so mepron here I come...how has everyone else doing with mepron?

If I herxed like mad on art do you think the same will happen with mepron?

I see some improvement in some areas...but still a long way to go..

also when it comes to artemisinin..please dont take it by yourself..some of the doses here would have really hurt me and other people...you need a naturapath or a doc who knows about this..you may have to go to china town doctors who know about it...but to me it is to potent to throw around...
eric

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Lymetoo
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quote:
Originally posted by polar blast:

If I herxed like mad on art do you think the same will happen with mepron?

It's likely to...but no one would know for sure.

Your advice is well taken. And art should be taken with Biaxin or Zith so that resistance does not develop.

Hope that treating the babesia will get you well now~!

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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clairenotes
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Eric,

Please see the information post on November 5, under the topic "arteminisin working or just giving terrible headaches?" There is a lot of good information and advice from the people who replied.

You and I have been struggling with the same issue and my conclusions were the same as yours... this is no simple herb(or perhaps babs is a monster or both).

Good luck on your next protocol.

Claire

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8man12
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I've been doing great on the art. the first 3 days was sweat,that was never ending mixed with chills.Headache from he$$,for 2 weeks,but now im doing great on it.I've lost alot of my neuro symptoms,that i've taken antibiotics for 8 years for.
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tailz
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I had persistent cloudy urine my first several days on art, but since my 1st babs test was negative and it's the only thing that has helped the urinary frequency and burning (IV Rocephin did not), I take it faithfully assuming I have Babesia and truly regret when I don't.

I take Black Walnut and Cloves as well. I think this combination seems to work, whether it's babs I'm killing or something else.

It's possible you just have an especially high load of the bug in your system. I know I do better if I gradually increase my dosage of any new herb.

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polar blast
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my llmd does not think that we should be taking it without medical supervision...
eric

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Lymetoo
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quote:
Originally posted by polar blast:
my llmd does not think that we should be taking it without medical supervision...
eric

or without zithromax or biaxin

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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Michelle M
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quote:
Originally posted by polar blast:
my llmd does not think that we should be taking it without medical supervision...
eric

You got me there Eric. Isn't that what your LLMD is?

So far as I knew, Art/Mepron/Zith is kind of the gold standard in babesia treatment. Like as in the Burrascano Guidelines. Yes, I know it's frightful, I thought I was going to die of a stroke. No kidding. However, I've seen a study somewhere indicating improvement in treatment vs. without it. So if possible, I'd sneak up on it -- anything to get babesia to leave.

Good luck!

Michelle

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HEATHERKISS
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Hello polar,

Mepron, Biaxin and art worked very well for me.

Take it very slow with the Mepron. My husband didn't tolerate it well and took Malorone instead.

--------------------
HEATHER

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5dana8
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Hey Polar

What dosage did you do with the art?

I had to start out very very slow.

It did finally, in combination with the abx & mepron, got rid of my babs.

But I hear ya. The art is a very powerful herb and shouldn't be taken without a naturalpath or LLMD

hang in there
dana

--------------------
5dana8

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charlie
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OK i'm not timid with meds with or without 'supervision' but I had to start out with art real slow...I took the artemesia annua from allergy research first then graduated to artemesinin...even ramping up slowly I had my leg muscles knotted up so badly and my knees and ankles hurting to the point I was on crutches.

Just take it slow and carefully, It won't be a problem.

Dosing yourself with a megablast of art if you've got a bad case of babs is fine if you're into masochism....

Charlie

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polar blast
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my babs load was very high..hence the severe herx on only 700mg within three days..this is a very potent herb..the herx was enough to have me take all sorts of test because of toxicity..all tests are normal including mri..so my main point is dont take this med without supervision..you are a fool if you do...
eric

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Lymetoo
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quote:
Originally posted by polar blast:
my babs load was very high..hence the severe herx on only 700mg within three days..

700mg per day?? that's a lot!!

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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polar blast
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no thats over three days...200 first 300 second 200 third
eric

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charlie
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700 mg/day is a giant wad of misery ready to happen.... the two of us in this household never went beyond 300/400 mg/day.

and it worked. better than mepron.

Charlie


------------------------------------------------------

I eat my peas with honey, I've done it all my life
it makes the peas taste funny
but it keeps them on my knife

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DolphinLady
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Try ramping up slowly. Listen to your body and adjust accordingly.
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sofylyme
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Best quality brands of Art.????
Im sure this has been discussed many times here but since there seems to be quite a bit of interest here and now thought Id ask all of you which brand name you each were comfortable with.

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clairenotes
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Sofylyme,

I used Arteminisin by Allergy Research in pill form. There are other forms, homeopathic, bulk herbs, etc. But not as familiar with those. Might do a search or post new topic for 'favorite forms of arteminisin?' or something to that effect.

Claire

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mag
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hi polar

hope the next protocol helps you

i do take art and can only take about 60 mg a day - more than this will cause major problems for me - similar to what you described- Also when i do art- I take astralagus and red root for supplements.

i have little trust in medicine (even though i am in the medical field)

Our bodies are so different and each of us have
different protozoa loads so do what works for you
take care - get well
mags

Here is an interesting article if you have aaccess to a medical site
Meshnick, S. R., T. E. Taylor, and P. Kamchonwongpaisan. 1996. Artemisinin and the antimalarial endoperoxides: from herbal remedy to targeted chemotherapy. Microbiol. Rev. 60:301-315

Olliaro, P. L., R. K. Haynes, B. Meunier, and Y. Yuthavong. 2001. Possible modes of action of the artemisinin-type compounds. Trends Parasitol. 17:122-126

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danq
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quote:
Originally posted by polar blast:
my llmd does not think that we should be taking it without medical supervision...
eric

That's the way to go if your LLMD will treat without a positive Babs test... but mine didn't want to, and I did. So after adequate research and with caution, I got mine from Allergy Research.

That's what got rid of my fatigue symptoms. I don't think I would have kicked the Lyme without treating for Babesia.

--------------------
 -
Dan

I am not a Lymie but used to be!
and I never was a doctor (so take my advice with a grain of abx)
but I am smarter than the average Duck!

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polar blast
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dan
was the herx very intense..and what dose were you taking?also were you on mepron?I took the rt and it was a very strong herx...
eric

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kumba
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O.k you all have me convinced. I am not going to start taking ART until I am under the supervision of my LLMD. I would have been taking it for my Toxoplasmosis but It will have to wait.
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TheCrimeOfLyme
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I NEVER take more than 100 mg of artemisinin , ever.

Start with one dosing, if thats ENOUGH for you, then thats good enough.

I couldnt imagine more than 100 mg a day for me. It works well at this dosage. Not everyone is the same.

--------------------
You want your life back? Take it.

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charlie
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I'm pretty sure wormwood is artemesia absinthum which is another member of the same plant group as is the herb rosemary. I wouldn't count on any overlapping medicinal effects.

Nobody really knows much about the resistant babs theory, I doubt if the Chinese who use artemesia annua for malaria have ever heard of a macrolide.

I don't buy it but that's just me.....

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AliG
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Hi Polar,

I'm curious, are we going to same LLMD? (in Flemington)

Mine doesn't want me doing the Supps either.

[confused]
Ali

--------------------
Note: I'm NOT a medical professional. The information I share is from my own personal research and experience. Please do not construe anything I share as medical advice, which should only be obtained from a licensed medical practitioner.

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danq
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quote:
Originally posted by polar blast:
dan
was the herx very intense..and what dose were you taking?also were you on mepron?I took the rt and it was a very strong herx...
eric

don't remember... you could do a search on my username (that's danq with a lowercase "Q") and the word "artemisinin". No, no Mepron - I'm not aware of any resistance issue - but resistance development would be more likely I think if lower doses don't effect a cure.

--------------------
 -
Dan

I am not a Lymie but used to be!
and I never was a doctor (so take my advice with a grain of abx)
but I am smarter than the average Duck!

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polar blast
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my llmd is in orange...
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8man12
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__________________________________________________
my llmd does not think that we should be taking it without medical supervision...
eric
__________________________________________________


does he supervise you when you are takeing high doses of antibiotics?

You have to remember this disease kills.

And things that make you better,sometimes make you
deathly ill for a short period of time.

I have learned no pain,no gain.

Maybe ART,isnt for you,but it has helped me tremendously.

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