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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » Considering new temporary antibiotic protocol

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Author Topic: Considering new temporary antibiotic protocol
Blackstone
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Hey guys. Where I'm sitting now I've been off antibiotics for quite some time as the last LLMD I was working with though their time of use was past, and we were doing some experimental things.

Well, I don't think they're working well enough, and I found another LLMD who was more comfortable with an IV regimen. Unfortunately, there have been scheduling conflicts getting my PASport installed, so I was thinking of going back on some oral antibiotics for a little while. The question is, which?

We're really unsure what organisms (if any) are left, and my symptoms are the "standard" fatigue, brain fog, pain and more.

The only "interesting" thing I've been able to note is this macropapular rash that pretty much looks exactly like whitehead pimples, in laymens terms. Some are red "spots" that haven't come to a head yet, some are raised with a whitehead. They don't look like petechae or classic bartonella "scratches", so the LLMDs over the years have really been unsure of what they indicate. Some think they're resultant of some infection, some thing they're just bad acne etc..

While I've never had great skin as a teenager, this body based rash grew in prominence during treatment (I believe it was a Zithromax/Mepron treatment) a few years ago and has stayed in one form or another ever since. It has been getting gradually worse over the last few months or so.

So what I'm looking to do is see if a basic antibiotic combo "hits" the rash, and if any other symptoms are improved or exacerbated(showing a herx) that's fine too.

I've been thinking of the following

Doxy or Minocyline + Tindamax
Zithromax + Tindamax
Biaxin + placquinel

Each of these combination has the potential to "hit" more than one organism.

Diflucan on its own, on the off chance this could be yeast related? Though, there's no other evidence thereof.

Ideas? Thought I'd run this by everyone so I could report on my progress later.

Posts: 685 | From East coast, USA | Registered: Jun 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
lymeberry
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I would try Nystatin or Diflucan to see if it hits the rash or if the rash is fungus related. Diflucan hits Lyme as well. Have you had a scrapping of your rash taken?
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Keebler
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-

A rash can also be a sign that the liver is overwhelmed with toxins.

Are you taking good liver support supplements and getting lots of bulk in your diet?

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Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Blackstone
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I've had no liver problems to speak of (function studies normal) and was taking milk thistle for quite some time. I eat plenty of fiber.

Last time I tried diflucan years ago it didn't do much, but I'll give it another shot. I just wanted to ensure that I wasn't missing anything. Several years ago I had a biopsy taken and sent out to a lab in new england. They actually tried to find lyme or similar pathogens, but nothing came up. Instead, it was just the normal things you'd expect from a folliculitis or acne type rash.

Edit: I'll try some of this just to make sure. Swanson Ultimate Liver Elixer - http://www.swansonvitamins.com/SWU247/ItemDetail

I was ordering other stuff from them anyway.

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Blackstone
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Has anyone ever tried a third-generation cephalosporin or something like Duricef instead of a tetracycline or zithromax, in combination with a cyst-busting drug?

[ 06-26-2009, 09:15 AM: Message edited by: Blackstone ]

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MariaA
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did you see LymeMD's article on combos called 'life after rocephin'?

http://lymemd.blogspot.com/2009/06/life-after-rocephin.html

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Blackstone
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Huh, I must have missed that one. Thanks.

I just wanted to see if my hypothesis about using something close to rocephin, orally, would be viable. I had an inkling it was valuable, in that I'm not as sick as some patients, possibly because I was taking moderate doses of ampicillin after my infection but years before my diagnosis, for acne.

Think I'll add this. Have to get the prescriptions written up.

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sixgoofykids
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What about Omnicef or Ceftin?

Could the pimples be related to parasites? Parasite treatment cleaned mine up.

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Blackstone
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I'm gathering Omnicef would probably be the closest of the three to rocephin. They are both third-generation. Ceftin is second-generation, and Duricef is first generation. Each generation has a slightly different spectrum and usage. Omnicef would probably be a good shot for Lyme anyway.

As far as parasites are concerned, I don't really see any evidence thereof. Typically parasites do not manifest in "normal" skin lesions. They have their own, very identifiable lesions depending on the type of parasite.

I'm guessing your parasite treatment included artemesia and some other antibiotic herbs, right? Or was it prescription? My hypothesis was that they killed something else in the process which may have lead to your acne. Alternately, killing whatever they did allowed your body some relief and to rebalance the endocrine functions that could have caused the acne. I'd be curious to know which treatment you used?

It seems that bad skin (not counting obviously infection induced rashes like the EM, petechiae etc.) is prominent in a percentage of Lyme patients. The jury is still out if it is the result of an organism directly, or if the stress on the body's hormonal make up causes the issue. There seem to be equally supported hypotheses for both.


So Omnicef+Minocycline+Tindamax. Only thing to figure out are doses...

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sixgoofykids
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Mine wasn't really acne, it was more of a rash on my forehead, a rash of individual bumps, if that makes sense. I used Humaworm for parasite treatment. Wasn't really taking much else at the time. I also use triphala and occasionally enula for parasites.

Don't omnicef and mino go after the same form of the borrelia? Maybe Biaxin would be good with the omnicef and tindamax, depending on your symptoms, of course.

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Blackstone
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Ah, well not having seen the rash I can't say what caused it. Humaworm has a lot of the antibiotic/antiprotazoa herbs included, so I'm pretty sure it could have at least some effect on other sorts of organisms (especially the Artemesia). I'm not familiar too much with the inner workings of Triphala, but I know that Enula is part of the Cowden protocol for infection. That could have some effect as well.


I'm trying to account for other sorts of organisms as well that may be responsive to something like the tetracycline class, including things that are hard to test for like one phase of CPN, and some mycoplasma.

If I'm correct at this hour of the morning, Biaxin is in the same family as Zithromax, and I've heard of better success with Zithromax? I'm planning to use Zithromax for another "phase" of the protocol (Zith+Rifampin trial for Bartonella, Zith+Malarial Drug when I can afford it).

Omnicef is primarily to cross the BBB and act like rocephin against standard form Lyme.
Minocycline is also a powerful weapon against standard form lyme, and hits a number of co-infections.
Tindamax I'm planning to use in place of Flagyl for cyst and cell-wall deficient L-form busting of lyme, plus it works against many other organisms that other antibiotics have difficulty with.

I suppose I could substitute Biaxin or Zithromax for the Minocycline for a time.

Thank you for your input.

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Pinelady
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Blackstone it sounds like a viral rash. Could be shingles, herpes, etc, etc. I would get it tested if you have no clue what it is. At least then you will know.

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Blackstone
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Typically (some) herpetic rashes follow nerve pathways and have a very distinct appearance - a tight cluster cluster of raised blisters, red/brown or pale, with no head. I've actually had it biopsied and it found the "normal" stuff you'd find in acne. I even had it tested for lyme (PCR'ed, came up negative) Getting to the underlying cause probably won't come from a biopsy with these types of diseases. In addition, the rash seemed effected by treatment in the past, coming out to its original prominence during antibiotic therapy.

I'll keep an open mind but it would be the most unusual viral presentation I've ever seen.

[ 06-26-2009, 07:35 PM: Message edited by: Blackstone ]

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caat
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>>>>Ceftin is second-generation

But ceftin does cross the bbb. If you do a google search on it you'll see stuff that says ceftin doesn't but that is based on web sites copying generalities about second generation from other web sites which haven't looked closely at the information. If you look closer you'll see that ceftin DOES cross it. It's also cheaper and more readily available I believe. & wasn't over used before the third generation came out.

I used it with tinnadazole after rocephin/flagyl/fluconazole. Worked well, got rid of the lyme.

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