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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » Interested in trying Curcumin....brand/dose please?

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Author Topic: Interested in trying Curcumin....brand/dose please?
CD57
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Could those of you using chime in? I want to try it and see if I notice anything.
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MariaA
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spice turmeric from the store, man. Or turmeric from a supplement vendor in a bottle. I really dont thin there's a huge difference between the 'brands'. You can get literally a pound for $10 (it doesn't taste good, so this isn't my suggestion) and put it into capsules or just start adding it to food.

Where you live, you can even get fresh turmeric, grate it, add it to salads or other stuff. fresh turmeric tastes nothing like dried turmeric and it's a really pleasant flavor. The Asian markets in the South Bay and probably larger health food stores carry it. I always try to eat it when I see it for sale somewhere.

I'm sipping on a coconut milk-turmeric-ginger drink right now (that, made with regular milk instead of coconut, is actually an Indian 'get well' folk remedy).

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MariaA
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also, I don't think you can really take 'too much'. Buhner recommends for liver disease that one take a ball of spice the size of a large marble and swallow it (this tastes like bitter dirt). That's probably 10 capsules' worth.

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Shosty
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I just read in the paper today that turmeric/curcumin is not absorbed well. They have come up with a synthetic form that is better absorbed.

Of course, someone will make money from this claim, but I thought I would pass it on.

Also, turmeric is supposed to kill bacteria, so you may "herx." I was told to use it as an anti-inflammatory for pain, but have hesitated because I heard that some Lyme patients have a bad reaction to it (which, again, may be a herx).

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Abxnomore
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I used Jarrow Curcumin 95, 500mg 3x a day (Tumeric 18:1 Concentrate). When you use the supplement and

if it is a reputable brand you know you are getting the most of the active ingredient vs the fresh as it's standardized.

Dr. Mercola recently wrote about Turmeric
http://organicindia.mercola.com/herbal-supplements/turmeric.aspx

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UnexpectedIlls
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The way to use tumeric and get the absorption is to find a product that HAS contains BIOPERINE... It is an extract of the black pepper fruit and increases the absorption of tumeric. I am going to be using this supplement from Doctors Best.. it has the BIOPERINE in it.

So make sure you find one with this in it. so it gets absorbed in the body. [Smile]

--------------------
"You'll be surprised to know how far you can go from the point you thought it was the end"

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MariaA
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Shosty
If you're talking about the curcumin/alzheimers' article, I wouldn't believe anything they say about the 'natural' form- the article was based on a press release written by the researchers, who are working for a company trying to make a patentable product out of an unpatentable herb. It's their JOB to cast doubt on the efficacy of the real herb.

However, we have tons and tons of evidence that the natural herb does work well (for instance, the often-quoted statistic that there is little Alzheimers' Disease in India, where turmeric is in a lot of food, except in cases where people started switching to a western diet).

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Symptom Free!!! Thank you all!!!!

Find me at Lymefriends, I post under the same name.
diet: http://lymefriends.ning.com/group/healthylowcarbrecipes
Homemade Probiotics thread
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MariaA
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also, you can just put black pepper into your food to get the bioperene.

I don't think turmeric is a magic bullet drug, but it's been really effective for me- when I've just pulled it off the spice rack shelf and eaten a large quantity, it's helped with pain and inflammation and brainfog at times. I'm sure it goes after SOME kinds of inflammation and not others because it doesn't ALWAYS work quite this drastically for me but there is a lot of evidence that it's helpful to consume it daily for liver protective purposes and various kinds of arthritis and other inflammation, and some good evidence that it may provide a protective effect from some nervous system diseases.

--------------------
Symptom Free!!! Thank you all!!!!

Find me at Lymefriends, I post under the same name.
diet: http://lymefriends.ning.com/group/healthylowcarbrecipes
Homemade Probiotics thread
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MariaA
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they claim to be, but people have been treating serious illnesses with just the spice for hundreds of years. Stephen Buhner recommends just the spice in his book on treating Hepatitis C herbally, and it was one of the things he did that cured his own Hepatitis C.

--------------------
Symptom Free!!! Thank you all!!!!

Find me at Lymefriends, I post under the same name.
diet: http://lymefriends.ning.com/group/healthylowcarbrecipes
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UnexpectedIlls
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I will use the supplement only because I have an eating disorder from this stupid illness... so my food options are limited... so I know for the time being using it as a food is not going to work for me...

I hope the supplement helps with inflammation in my brain... [Smile]

FYI-- by eating disorder I do not mean purging... I have completely different disorder.

--------------------
"You'll be surprised to know how far you can go from the point you thought it was the end"

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Nutmeg
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I took curcumin (Pure Encapsulations) for many months, up to 6 capsules a day (3 caps twice a day on a empty stomach).

Then I found out it can erode the esophagus and stomach lining, and I think that's what happened to me.

It didn't seem to help with either pain or inflammation, so while looking for something else to use, my chiropractor muscle-tested me for Meriva, by Thorne Research.

It's a different formulation of curcumin (no bioperine) that is more absorbable and less damaging to the gut because you can take it with food.

It does seem to help. I've been on it a couple of months now. I get it from my chiro, but there are also websites where you can order the Thorne Meriva online.

Take care,
Nutmeg

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Bugg
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For what it's worth, I cut and pasted some excerpts from the Alzheimers website re: curcumin....seems there's still alot of confusion re: bioavailability....

"Sally Frautschy from the Alzheimers Center
UCLA has invented a optimized curcumin called "Longvida" that is being
produced by Verdue Science, Noblesville, IN and it should be on the open
market within a few months. It is currently in clinical trials for AD,
and cancer. Curcumin has shown much promise but has a history of poor
bioavailability. It looks like this new invention may have overcome
this obstacle.

You can obtain it now through Verdue Science or you can wait a few months. Sally and her team also recommend DHA and ALA. The key is to
lower inflammation and reduce the amyloid plaque. Curcumin can do both."

Curcumin and Alzheimer's: Because of the remarkably low incidence of Alzheimer's in India, scientists have zeroed in on curcumin (the bright yellow anti-inflammatory-antioxidant compound found in turmeric, the spice used in curries) as a possible treatment.

Early indications are that curcumin has the potential to help prevent or clear the buildup of amyloid plaques in the brain, which are associated with a higher incidence of the progressive disease. Researchers were heartened by the results of a 2004 study, in which mice fed a curcumin-heavy diet were found to have about 50 percent fewer amyloid plaques than those fed a different diet. Initial human studies have had mixed results, and scientists suspect absorption issues reduced the effectiveness of plain curcumin. However, when combined with fat (the way it's typically used in cooking), curcumin appears to be more available to the body, says Dr. Sally Frautschy, professor of medicine and neurology at the UCLA Alzheimer's Disease Center.

While it may be many years before there are definitive results from this line of research, Frautschy says she encourages Alzheimer's patients to talk to their neurologists about supplementing with curcumin. When asked for dosing advice, Frautschy recommends a curcumin-lipid formulation (she prefers two Longvida, a low-dose capsule developed by researchers from UCLA), plus DHA supplements (two 1-gram capsules of fish oil and two 200mg capsules of a microalgae-derived DHA supplement like Neuromins), along with 600mg of alpha lipoic acid, all taken morning and night.

For prevention, she suggests halving these dosages. Her only caveat: take a break from curcumin if you need to use nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs (NSAIDs) for any reason. People with clotting issues should raise those concerns with their doctor before starting curcumin."

Here's the excerpt from that page regarding Longvida:

1.``Recently, a solid lipid nanoparticle formulation of curcumin has become available.
The formulation was developed in the labs of two professors at UCLA:

Professor Sally A. Frautschy http://alzheimer.neurology.ucla.edu/Frautschy.html
Professor Greg M. Cole http://alzheimer.neurology.ucla.edu/Cole.html

This formulation is described in detail in a patent application, PCT/US07/05829 (WO/2007/103435) http://tinyurl.com/3eaegw

Bioavailable Curcuminoid Formulations for Treating Alzheimer's Disease and Other Age-Related Disorders.

The Regents of the University of California http://tinyurl.com/2bztov have licensed it to:

Verdure Sciences, Inc.
1250 East Conner Street
Noblesville, IN 46060
[email protected]

This formulation has eleven times greater bioavailabiity in the plasma when tested in rodents (see note 1).
Verdure has trademarked this formulation as Curcuminol M3Cx and Longvida. It is available in 500 mg capsules, and these may be obtained by contacting Blake Ebersole @ 317-219-0355 at Verdure. E-mail [email protected]

You can ask him to fax the forms a customer needs to fill-out to obtain the capsules. It is sold in packages of 100 capsules for $59.99. A 400 capsule package is available, too.
Although curcumin has been given in clinical trials in doses as high as 12 grams a day with only minimal toxicity (note 2), I would reason that 4 grams (8 x 500 mg capsules) might be the optimal dose.



Sabinsa's Curcumin C3 Complex
``Pure' curcumin was shown to be less protective than a mixture of curcuminoids, indicating a possible synergism among the curcuminoids..."

Longvida
"This appears to cross the blood brain barrier, which is incredibly important. Curcumin shows a lot of promise in breaking up amyloid beta plaques & tangles, decreasing oxidative stress & apoptosis, and causing neurogenesis & synaptogenesis. It even has the possibility to increase glutathione levels.

But, because it is typically not very absorbable, IT DOES NOT DO MANY OF THESE THINGS WHEN JUST PLAIN OLE TUMERIC IS GIVEN."

It appears that a mixture of curcuminoids works best and either the Longvida or Sabinsa's Curcumin C3 Complex might be good choices.

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coltman
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So where do you buy longvida or sabinsa? - google search only showed the web page with some info
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Healing in Santa Cruz
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I use Designs for health C3 Curcumin complex 1-800-847-8302. I buy it at my Md's Joyce
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Bugg
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I use Jarrow's Curcumin and take it with fat and Omega 3....I get it from Whole Foods...
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MariaA
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you can also get empty capsules and fill them with the bulk spice turmeric if you don't like the flavor of the spice. This makes sense if you're doing the Buhner Protocol or some other powdered-bulk-herb protocol and want to save money by buying herbs in bulk, I probably wouldn't buy a capsule maker just for one herb alone. See the 'herbal links' thread in my signature for sources of encapsulators. I like the Capsule Machine brand rather than the CapMQuick brand and have owned both for various reasons.

then again, turmeric is super expensive in stores in capsule form, and extremely cheap in the powder form. My LLMD told me he thoutht that the bulk form is just as good.

My personal thought on it is that there are thousands of years (?) of experience in India that shows that it's effective when used in food (for instance, low incidence of Alzheimers' among populations that eat traditional foods, which rises if the western diet is introduced) and it's one of the herbs that really does show a very direct visible effect fairly quickly. I think it's very much in the interest of supplement companies to downplay the effectiveness of 'generic' turmeric spice and to try to sell you on some kind of 'superformula'- the product is effective for some conditions such as inflammation and people would probably want to come back for it over and over. But they have to differentiate their product from the cheap stuff that's potentially a competitor.

If in doubt on the 'spice' version's effectiveness, just use more. Note- it doesn't taste all that good if you use too much in your food, in powdered spice form (fresh grated turmeric root tastes great in all kinds of foods but you can't get it in most places. YOu can, however, grow it, look online for info). I do like the 'turmeric in hot milk (or nondairy milk- soy, rice, coconut, almond milk all work well) with a bit of sweetener' drink that Indian grandmothers give kids for colds and flu. I could have that two or three times a day and that's what I'm doing right now.

--------------------
Symptom Free!!! Thank you all!!!!

Find me at Lymefriends, I post under the same name.
diet: http://lymefriends.ning.com/group/healthylowcarbrecipes
Homemade Probiotics thread
Herbal Links Thread

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MarsyNY
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Coltman,

The Sabinsa C3 Curcumin is in quite a few products. Designs for Health is one. I just bought Blue Bonnet Tumeric Root extract which contains the C3 also, $6.50 60 capsules at WF.

If I had done the research earlier I would have bought the Designs for Health with lecithin or the Thorne product with phosphatydlcholine for better absorption.

I would stay away from the biopiperine with stomach issues.
----
Thanks Bugg, I decided to try this because ot the muscles stiffness post and the fact that my Dr. wanted me to try some prednisone!

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laceyj
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How much tumeric is Buhner recommending?
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Bugg
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I read on several autism websites that parents are using a form of curcumin called Enhansa because the manufacturer claims better bioavailability....who knows, though...Jarrow claims this as well...

Interestingly enough, I was reading some of the parents' reports of their children's initial recations on Enhansa (curcumin): small rashes, sometimes spacey/sleepy, feverish..... I, too, had this same reaction when I started Curcumin...Every 5-6 days I get a slight rash on my face, the back of my neck is soooo hot... I took charcoal and it made me feel better...I swear it seems just like a herx...

I can't quite explain it yet but it's making me feel better all-over....especially less pain/stiffness...

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Lauralyme
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Maria can you pass on that coconut milk/tumeric/ginger drink recipe? Sounds yummy

I will chime in on my experience with Tumeric. I fill empty capsules with the spice and I noticed when I stopped(read lazy to fill capsules)taking tumeric my herxes were more severe. So I had obvious proof that it does work in reducing inflammation.

--------------------
Fall down seven times, get up eight
~Japanese proverb

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lymeparfait
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I take the enhanca...works great for me. No issues with stomach and takes my inflamation and pain away temporarily in my knees.
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sutherngrl
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I use tumeric spice sprinkled on foods. It is not bad at all that way. I don't use a lot of it, but can tell that it does indeed help with inflammation.

My concern is, is it okay to take larger doses of it, if you are also taking antibiotics?

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MariaA
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Heat up a cup of milk (or nondairy beverage such as soy milk, rice milk, almond milk, or some kind of watered-down coconut milk). I use the microwave and heat it till it's too hot to drink.

add a teaspoonful of turmeric powder (which doesnt' taste all that god)

grate some ginger into it

sweeten with stevia (or honey or something).

Drink when it cools down a bit.

--------------------
Symptom Free!!! Thank you all!!!!

Find me at Lymefriends, I post under the same name.
diet: http://lymefriends.ning.com/group/healthylowcarbrecipes
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MariaA
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Suthrngirl,

Since it's a liver support herb, you might want to look at a drug interactions checker for both 'turmeric' and 'curcumin' to see if it changes how your antibiotics are metabolized:

http://www.drugs.com/drug_interactions.php

--------------------
Symptom Free!!! Thank you all!!!!

Find me at Lymefriends, I post under the same name.
diet: http://lymefriends.ning.com/group/healthylowcarbrecipes
Homemade Probiotics thread
Herbal Links Thread

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MariaA
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When I looked it up there was nothing about turmeric and liver metabolism (unlike, say, milk thistle) which is very good news for us since we seem to need liver support.
HOwever, there were lots of interactions with aspirin and anticoagulants. They all led to the same 'general' warning. I think this might be helpful for us in the same way that systemic enzymes are helpful- for hypercoagulation and so forth. Interestingly the enzymes seem to help with inflammation too.

quote from above link about drug interactions with turmeric:

Theoretically, turmeric may potentiate the effects of anticoagulants, platelet inhibitors, and thrombolytic agents, possibly increasing the risk of bleeding. In vitro data suggest that turmeric may inhibit platelet-activating factor and platelet aggregation. However, bleeding complications and interactions with hematologic agents have not been reported. Moreover, pharmacologic effects may be highly variable due to inconsistencies in formulation and potency of commercial herbal products. Patients should consult a healthcare provider before taking any herbal or alternative medicine. In patients who have used turmeric extensively prior to receiving anticoagulation, antiplatelet, or thrombolytic therapy, the potential for an interaction should be considered. Clinical and laboratory observation for hematologic complications is recommended. Patients should be advised to promptly report any signs of bleeding to their physician, including pain, swelling, headache, dizziness, weakness, prolonged bleeding from cuts, increased menstrual flow, vaginal bleeding, nosebleeds, bleeding of gums from brushing, unusual bleeding or bruising, red or brown urine, or red or black stools.

--------------------
Symptom Free!!! Thank you all!!!!

Find me at Lymefriends, I post under the same name.
diet: http://lymefriends.ning.com/group/healthylowcarbrecipes
Homemade Probiotics thread
Herbal Links Thread

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Lauralyme
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Thanks Maria [Smile]

--------------------
Fall down seven times, get up eight
~Japanese proverb

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swachsler
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I get it from Vitacost. I read that it's best absorbed on an empty stomach but with oil(?) So, mix some in some olive oil and slurp it down? Dunno.
Is powerful anticancer herb, too, fwiw.
Peace, sister,
s

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