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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » To shot or not, The flu season is here

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Author Topic: To shot or not, The flu season is here
Yankeedorie
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Hi, I am in holistic treatment for Lyme now for 2 years after a dormancy of 16 years. I see Doc.P in Ct. here come Jan. to start antibiotic war within my self and hope I can survive. The holistic road is not impacting as I wished. I have been reading a lot of posts and frankly nervous because I am on meds for anxiety , depression and sleep. The antibiotics have such horrible sides Im more worried. Guess Doc. P and I will need to work it out.
So, do I get a flu shot , do I get a swine flu shot? Last year I took a flu shot and was sick for 3 weeks. Dr. holistic told me do not get the shot.
Thanks for your input.
J

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sixgoofykids
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No way would I ever get a flu shot. Google Dr. Mercola H1N1. He has a lot of articles on it.

--------------------
sixgoofykids.blogspot.com

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Starfall1969
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I agree with sixgoofykids; I would avoid the shots.

I won't get them myself either, nor am I allowing my kids to get them.

Just heard too many negatives on both vaccines.

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Yankeedorie
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Earlier in my life I got the flu and it was the most horrible sickness I have had. It lasted a good 8 weeks. My GP said with the shot 2 weeks , with out 8-10 weeks.
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Abxnomore
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This is just my opinion but I don't believe in flu shots and especially not this H1N1 flu shot that has been rushed thru.

If you get a flu shot you will be forcing your body to produce antibodies while you are already debilitated from Lyme and your immune system is all ready working overtime. Doesn't make sense to me.

Follow all the sensible rules to avoid getting the flu, including eating a healthy diet and take natual immune boosters, such as Maitake D fraction and anti virals as a preventative, many of which may kill off some ketes as well, such as olive leaf extract, oil of oregano, monolaurin, BioPure freeze dried garlic to name a few.

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DaveNJ
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i had mine last year and this year....i have to disagree with everyone summation on this topic. The shot may in fact make your immune system react and slightly set you back(i had no effecT0...but not getting the shot as an immuno compromised indivudal make syou at target for the flu to atcually kill you. look at who norally dies for the flu...the elderly or those who are immunocompromised.

Anyway...my two cents....not even a blip with the shot the past two years and it was recommended by my ILADS doctor.

Dave

--------------------
On my journey to wellness - One day at a time.

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Yankeedorie
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Thanks for your thoughts. I am on them and more presently but the 1st cold of the season hit last month and still have it. Lastly my wife works at the hospital and Iv got a high schooler so the front door and back door are wide open.
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Melodymaker
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Since my immune system is already struggling with the Lyme, I absolutely am not getting any flu shots and introducing yet another pathogen to my system.

Also, historically, often the shot they give yearly for the flu isn't even the strain that goes around. so it's worthless.

I've also read that during the swine flu epidemic in earlier years, the shot killed more people than the actual flu. Now they've given the drug companies immunity from being sued regarding the shots. Not doing it for sure.

--------------------
Wishing You Showers Of Blessings!
Lyme since Fall 1983 = Diagnosed Summer 2008
IV Rocephin 7 weeks Stopped due to drug fever
Now doxycycline
"For I know the plans I have for you...plans to give you hope and a future." Jeremiah 29:11

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imagine2
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I definitely will not get the H1N1 shot. It has a substance in it that is reported to cause MS.

The swine flu shot in the '70s caused Guillian Barre
in more than just a few people.

I did, however, get the regular flu shot last week but ONLY because my compounding pharmacy carries only mercury-free shots. He has refused to carry and give anyone the H1N1 shot.

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Yankeedorie
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Right! sometimes two hands are harder to work with than one. The GP says yes , holistic says no no.
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JamesNYC
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Getting either flu isn't going to help me. It isn't going to make my immune system happy. The pain and debilitation of being sick with flu weakens the body's ability to fight other infections and can allow other viruses like herpes, EBV to reemerge.

I don't need the flu, I'm getting a flu shot. I've had them for years, even while under abx tx and have had no problems.

I have watched friends who don't get shots miss a week or more of work and suffer, when they do get the flu.

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Yankeedorie
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Suffer , Die a dozen deaths is closer . This is what I am looking for , a good 2 sided debate.
Thanks for your thoughts.

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Dekrator48
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My LLMD told me not to get any more immunizations.

He said it puts too much stress on the immune system and can cause the lyme to become worse.

--------------------
The fibromyalgia I've had for 32 years was an undiagnosed Lyme symptom.

"For I know the plans I have for you", declares the Lord, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future". -Jeremiah 29:11

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Yankeedorie
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I agree with this school of thought.
Having said that what does the full blown flu invite my lyme to do. As I stated , I got the flu shot last year and was sicker than not but did not got the flu. In my present bla condition I really feel if I get flu I will loose it

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Truthfinder
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At least consider homeopathic prevention and/or treatment. Homeopaths lost FAR, FAR fewer patients in the 1918 flu epidemic than conventional doctors. (I'd have to look up the stats.) And the same can be said of most epidemics and pandemics in the last 200 years.

Sorry to sound like a broken record but I don't like seeing people think they have no viable alternative to vaccination or Tamiflu.

I bumped up my INFLUENZINUM thread if anyone is interested. Also, info on Oscillococcinum is in that thread, too.

--------------------
Tracy
.... Prayers for the Lyme Community - every day at 6 p.m. Pacific Time and 9 p.m. Eastern Time just take a few moments to say a prayer wherever you are.

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Yankeedorie
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Hi Tracy, I am in treatment with a holistic MD here on the CT side of LI Sound . I am taking most all the recommended stuff and more , he says the flu shot is a no no. I am not good at this , we are supposed to do our own doctoring around with this lyme disease. They say a Doctor who treats him or herself has a fool for a patient. I feel thats all I have left outside this community I just found, to be my own doctor
Thanks again to all of you.
J

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JamesNYC
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Perfect timing.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/12/opinion/12offit.html?_r=1&adxnnl=1&adxnnlx=1255363363-bwJ/JZZ%20%20MPPtQXs/qZLWw&pagewanted=print


New York Times
October 12, 2009
OP-ED CONTRIBUTOR
Nothing to Fear but the Flu Itself

By PAUL A. OFFIT
Philadelphia

PUBLIC health officials are now battling not only a fast-spreading influenza virus but also unfounded fears about the vaccine that can prevent it.

Since April, more than a million Americans have caught H1N1 flu, more than 10,000 have been hospitalized, and about 1,000 have died, including 76 children. And it's only the beginning of October. Yet, in a new survey, 41 percent of adults said they will not get vaccinated.

The good news is that for the first time in more than 50 years we've made a vaccine against a pandemic strain of influenza before the onset of winter, when lower temperatures and humidity allow the virus to spread more easily.

Distributing this vaccine to those who need it most -- pregnant women, health care workers, children older than six months and people with compromised immunity -- will be difficult enough.

But the task is made harder by the various myths, spread on TV talk shows and Web sites, suggesting that Americans have more to fear from the vaccine than from the deadly disease it prevents. Here are some of those myths, and why they're wrong:

SWINE FLU VACCINE IS UNSAFE The H1N1 virus revealed itself too late for it to be included in this year's seasonal flu vaccine. But the H1N1-specific vaccine was manufactured in the same way as the regular vaccine: The shot form is made by growing the virus in hen's eggs, purifying it and then treating it with a chemical that inactivates it. This technology has been used to make influenza vaccines for 60 years, and it has an excellent safety record. The nasal spray form is made by adapting the virus to temperatures below those typically found in the body. This allows it to reproduce in the relatively cool lining of the nose, but not in the lungs where it could cause harm. This technology has been used safely for more than 30 years. FluMist, a seasonal flu vaccine used since 2003, is made the same way.

THE VACCINE IS UNTESTED The H1N1 vaccine has already been given to thousands of volunteers to determine whether it could protect them from the virus and to make sure that it caused no adverse reactions. Only then did the Food and Drug Administration license it.

THE VACCINE CONTAINS A DANGEROUS ADJUVANT Some vaccines, like the hepatitis B and human papillomavirus vaccines, have substances called adjuvants, which are added to enhance the immune response, so that smaller quantities of vaccine can be given. Some people fear that the H1N1 vaccine contains, in particular, squalene, an adjuvant that, while included in other vaccines in Europe and Canada, has never been used in routine vaccines in the United States. But the H1N1 vaccine available in the United States has no adjuvant of any kind.

THE VACCINE HAS A DANGEROUS PRESERVATIVE Thimerosal, a preservative containing ethyl mercury that has been in vaccines since the 1930s, is used to prevent inadvertent bacterial and fungal contamination of multi-dose vials. H1N1 vaccine distributed in multi-dose vials will contain about 25 micrograms of ethyl mercury per dose. The issue of thimerosal received public attention in 1999 when the American Academy of Pediatrics and the United States Public Health Service took the precautionary step of asking that thimerosal be removed from single-dose vials of all vaccines. This was done in such a precipitous and frightening manner that it gave rise to the notion that thimerosal had led to autism or mercury poisoning. It hadn't.

In fact, subsequent studies found that infants could safely receive eight times as much mercury as is contained in the H1N1 vaccine. But the public's perception of thimerosal was damaged. This year, enough thimerosal-free vaccine is available to inoculate children under age 6, but that does not mean doses with thimerosal are unsafe.

New myths will inevitably arise as some of the millions of people who are inoculated against H1N1 flu suffer unrelated illnesses. Health officials will keep a close eye out for any real problems. One can only hope that the American public will understand that subsequence isn't necessarily consequence, and not be scared away from a vaccine that can save lives.

Paul A. Offit, the chief of the infectious diseases division of the Children's Hospital of Philadelphia, is the author of ``Autism's False Prophets: Bad Science, Risky Medicine and the Search for a Cure.''

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Lymetoo
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NOPE

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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Keebler
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-

Notice the above article said they may have enough thimerosal-free vaccine for children under the age of six, that does not mean that the thimerosal-free vaccine will be in every clinic and one must ASK specifically for that - and it may not be given since the CDC says it is safe. It is not. There are many, many studies and medical reports that say thimerosal is not at all safe.

Will some people do fine with the vaccine? Sure. Many will. But many will not.

Aside from the thimerosal in most vaccines, which CAN cause severe neurological damage (contrary to the NYT article above) . . .

ANYONE with CFS or lyme should NOT get a flu shot. CFS and lyme patients ALL have mitochondrial dysfunction. There are many reasons not to get the flu shot but one of the top ones is that it can be devastating for patients with mitochrondial dysfunction.

I'll be back with the citation to validate that.

-----

As well, adrenal support is one of the very best protectors for those of us (all) who have adrenal problems due to lyme.
-

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Keebler
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-


http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/10/06/Why-You-Should-NOT-Vaccinate-Your-Children-Against-the-Flu-This-Season.aspx

Do NOT Let Your Child Get Flu Vaccine -- 9 Reasons Why
Posted by: Dr. Mercola
October 06 2009

Kent Holtolf, MD

3:24 Video

- explaining how flu vaccines can devastate patients with mitochondrial dysfunction such as CFS patients. He does not include lyme patients but all lyme patients also have mitochondrial dysfunction. It is a result of lyme.

----

I have had several vaccines in past years and I truly have never recovered from the severe neurological problems the shots caused.
-

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Yankeedorie
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O my is this getting interesting!
I am glad I am having a good day so far other wise I would be in need of another pill.
The fear is real and I hope there are a lot of folks what read this post.
Heres my take so far.
If I take the shot of this vaccine I know I will become ill for some time to some degree.
If I do not I have a 50/50 chance of not getting the flu and will not have taken the risk of what certainly will make me ill.
I am leaning at not.
So now to the regular flu . Do we have the same risk with this one. This was the flu what made me decide when in remission never to miss the vaccine as I was so sick when healthy , not as I am now.

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Keebler
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-
Yankeedorie,

I see you are new here. Welcome.

I thought I would mention that, in future posts it will help most of us if you break up your text. Many here have neuro lyme with inner ear stuff also causing the eyes to spasm. With more white space and short paragraphs, you'll get more replies.

Something like this:
---------------
Yankeedorie writes:

O my is this getting interesting!

I am glad I am having a good day so far other wise I would be in need of another pill. The fear is real and I hope there are a lot of folks what read this post.

Heres my take so far.

If I take the shot of this vaccine I know I will become ill for some time to some degree.

If I do not I have a 50/50 chance of not getting the flu and will not have taken the risk of what certainly will make me ill. I am leaning at not.

So now to the regular flu . Do we have the same risk with this one. This was the flu what made me decide when in remission never to miss the vaccine as I was so sick when healthy , not as I am now

(Yankeedorie)
-

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Keebler
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-
Yankeedorie,

It is best to discuss a safety plan with your doctor if your doctor is truly aware of lyme, and your body.

Supplements that support the adrenals and the lungs are essential. Supplements that manage the cytokine storm are vital, too. Most of these are already on in our protocols.

Adding allicin is my plan.

There have been many threads about the flu that you can search and see suggestion for what can help: http://flash.lymenet.org/scripts/ultimatebb.cgi/ubb/search/search_forum/1
-

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RDaywillcome
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NO!

http://isiria.wordpress.com/2009/07/19/it-happened-all-before-the-1976-swine-flu-pandemic-and-the-us-government-vaccination-propaganda-that-caused-deaths-and-long-term-illnesses/

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Yankeedorie
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Thank you,

I have been asked to stop screaming at people by typing in caps and have.

My brain looked at the lesser struggle of not looking for shift key .

I am new and will be respectful

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Myco
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NO. There are many things you can do to strengthen your immune system.
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zil
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With my poor health if I got the flu it would kill me. A 5 yr old in good health died in my area. That is so sad. Needless to say I got both flu shots.
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ping
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quote:
Originally posted by Keebler:
-

Notice the above article said they may have enough thimerosal-free vaccine for children under the age of six, that does not mean that the thimerosal-free vaccine will be in every clinic ....

Personally, I think this is the major cause of problems for those who take flu shots. It's hell getting rid of the mercury and the build up over time compounds your problems, esp. neurologically.

ping
"We are more than containers for Lyme"

--------------------
ping
"We are more than containers for Lyme"

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disturbedme
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I have no idea what to do. I haven't gotten either flu shot and probably won't, but sometimes I wonder if it would be better if I did... Augh.

--------------------
One can never consent to creep when one feels an impulse to soar.
~ Helen Keller

My Lyme Story

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bettyg
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this year i'm NOT having my regular flu NOR hiney shot!

i'm just not comfortable about all the UNKNOWNS; my gut feeling says no and i'm a great believe in what our guts tell us, and i listen faithfully to it.

in the last 3-4 yrs., i've had flu shots plus hubby too.

5 yrs. ago i thought i was going to die; could NOT breath and the NON-STOP COUGHING for 3-4 days max. i swore i'd not go thru that again, and haven't.

i have NO LLMD; my 2nd/last i was to 2.5 yrs. ago.

i just have my regular NEW pcp who will NOT treat lyme but my diabetes, sleep apnea, depression, thyroid, etc. that i take pills for.

it's such a shame we have to chose what is SAFE for us or not. which it were easy vs. this hard dealing with CHRONIC diseases:

lyme and diabetes for me.

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zil
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You have to weigh the pro's and con's, do the research and then make the personal decision if you should get it or not.

I can't avoid all people during flu season. I was real concerned about going into my Dr's office.

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Robin123
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My understanding is this flu shot has adjuvants in it such as formaldehyde, mercury, aluminum and lipid squalene, all of which are not healthy for us, can cause auto-immune reactions, and the last one, lipid squalene, can cause infertility.

The shot is untested. It's been rushed out and no one even knows if it works.

I'd say no flu shot for us.

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Topaz
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Not for us either.
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cactus
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I've gone back and forth on this one, too.

But finally, after LLMD recommended no shot - I'm decided.

No shot for me.

Of course, everyone in our household was sick over the summer with a nasty flu-type virus - so it may well be that we've already been through H1N1 and it's a moot point.

Check out mercola.com - search for flu shot. Lots of interesting articles there.

--------------------
Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again? - A.A. Milne

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Truthfinder
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*** ``I am not good at this , we are supposed to do our own doctoring around with this lyme disease.'' ***

That's a good point, Yankee. I think it's times like this that make us realize how dependent we've become on the Western medical system. And, frankly, I'm not so sure that's a good thing. [shake]

Interesting that they are claiming `no adjuvants'...... depends on what they consider an `adjuvant'. I.e., aluminum acts as both an adjuvant and a preservative if I remember correctly.

--------------------
Tracy
.... Prayers for the Lyme Community - every day at 6 p.m. Pacific Time and 9 p.m. Eastern Time just take a few moments to say a prayer wherever you are.

Posts: 2966 | From Colorado | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Melodymaker
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I sent this e-mail to all my friends. Great natural advice and info. Especially the salt water info.

Forewarned is forearmed.....

H1N1 - SWINE FLU TIPS...

Happy Breathing From An RN Friend

The only portals of entry are the nostrils and mouth/throat. In a global epidemic of this nature, it's almost impossible not coming into contact with H1N1 in spite of all precautions. Contact with H1N1 is not so much of a problem as proliferation is.

While you are still healthy and not showing any symptoms of H1N1 infection, in order to prevent proliferation, aggravation of symptoms and development of secondary infections, some very simple steps, not fully highlighted in most official communications, can be practiced (instead of focusing on how to stock N95 or Tamiflu):


1. Frequent hand-washing (well highlighted in all official communications).


2. "Hands-off-the-face" approach. Resist all temptations to touch any part of face (unless you want to eat, bathe or slap).


3. *Gargle twice a day with warm salt water (use Listerine if you don't trust salt). *H1N1 takes 2-3 days after initial infection in the throat/ nasal cavity to proliferate and show characteristic symptoms. Simple gargling prevents proliferation. In a way, gargling with salt water has the same effect on a healthy individual that Tamiflu has on an infected one. Don't underestimate this simple, inexpensive and powerful preventative method.


4. Similar to 3 above, *clean your nostrils at least once every day with warm salt water. *Not everybody may be good at Jala Neti or Sutra Neti (very good Yoga asanas to clean nasal cavities), but *blowing the nose hard once a day and swabbing both nostrils with cotton buds dipped in warm salt water is very effective in bringing down viral population.*


5. *Boost your natural immunity with foods that are rich in Vitamin C (Amla and other citrus fruits). *If you have to supplement with Vitamin C tablets, make sure that it also has Zinc to boost absorption.


6.* Drink as much of warm liquids as you can. *Drinking warm liquids has the same effect as gargling, but in the reverse direction. They wash off proliferating viruses from the throat into the stomach where they cannot survive, proliferate or do any harm.

--------------------
Wishing You Showers Of Blessings!
Lyme since Fall 1983 = Diagnosed Summer 2008
IV Rocephin 7 weeks Stopped due to drug fever
Now doxycycline
"For I know the plans I have for you...plans to give you hope and a future." Jeremiah 29:11

Posts: 421 | From Sunny South | Registered: Jul 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
aileenhome
LymeNet Contributor
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My LLMD says no flu shots but that if I get flu I should stop my antibiotic and immediately take tamiflu for 5 days. He is not getting his own teenagers vaccinated at this point. I have 2 in college so very concerned about what to advise them.
Posts: 133 | From Far Hills, NJ 07931 | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
PB4
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I'm working so hard to get all of the metals OUT


of my body that I do not intend on putting any


more in! Mercury is very hard to detox. Besides,


I just plain don't trust this whole flu shot


issue. From what I've read, they put the whole


thing through too quickly. It won't hurt any of


them if the stuff kills us. We have to look out


for ourselves.


Truthfinder- I'm am with you on this one. I have


been using homeopathy for years and I trust it.


There is alot of info out there on preventing


and treating the flu.


I wonder whose piggy banks get bigger when


vaccines are needed.


With all that said, we each need to make our own


decisions and use the advice of medical folks


we can trust.
PB

Posts: 78 | From Maryland | Registered: Jun 2009  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
   

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