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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » TRASNCRANIAL DOPPLER ULTRASOUND

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Author Topic: TRASNCRANIAL DOPPLER ULTRASOUND
Raymond
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Anyone ever had one done?? If so what did you learn?

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Raymond
Leave the gun, take the cannolis

Posts: 214 | From Rhode Island | Registered: Nov 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
LisaS
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Man if they have such a thing, why dont they do that on allof us complaining of head pressure!

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Raymond
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LisA

The first one good discrpt....the second one I e mailed with questions...hopefuly will post results

http://www.bcbsnc.com/assets/services/public/pdfs/medicalpolicy/transcranial_doppler_ultrasound.pdf

http://www.csmc.edu/3032.html

I just took a neuro physc test, awaitning reults then there is a nurologist at B & W in MASS who deals in autoregulation....cerebral....I am confused with this dam illness as most...but I am trying to find out what it's doing and hopefully get to compassionate docs that can help...

http://www.biomedexperts.com/

The above is a list of over 200,000 doctors worldwide...sign in for free...I will send you and anyone else that wants to looks at docs on this lists backgrounds....some are very impressive....the doctor I will be seeing at B & W is on there the ones at MGH are on there....if you don't want the PM E MAIL DUMP IT.....The web also has an abstract of the research they have done....like in the area of the doppler ultrasound and working with Alt. disease, and other forms of brain injuries....

Does make me wonder LisaA if SPECT scans are not a "diagnostic tool" why aren't these used in association with them??? Anyone else know the answer???

Oh..."Lyme the forbidden fruit"....when I was healthy I knew and always had a clear cut image of what the forbidden fruit was.....

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Raymond
Leave the gun, take the cannolis

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Keebler
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I would NEVER consider getting ultrasound on my brain. NEVER.

With the brain damage that most lyme patients deal with, the stimulation caused by ultrasound could have devastating effects.
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massman
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So right Keebler !

Ultrasound through your brain ?

Lets do that to the inventors brain every day for a year.

Then see if there is any brain left, if there ever was one.

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sutherngrl
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It seems an ultrasound would be safer than an MRI, or maybe I just don't understand how they work. They are used safely on pregnant women though.
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Keebler
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Lyme changes everything about the brain. The sensory sensitivities with lyme are enormous. It takes very little to spark trouble in a person who has an infection such as lyme in their brain.

Seizures (common with lyme anyway, sometimes from even the slightest sound, flash or startle) would be much more likely to occur with such stimulation.

Lyme patients also have increased problems with their ears - tinnitus, hyperacusis, etc. This can be devastating. Administering ultrasound near the ears, into the inner and middle ear areas could have the most severe and damaging effects I can imagine.

Due to the way bone conducts sound, it would be impossible for the ears not to be affected by the ultrasound frequency.

I can barely handle the sounds coming though my phone, I can't imagine the intensity - or effect - of ultrasound to my ears, even if I did not "hear" it - it would definitely affect the entire auditory system. Any dysfunction in that system can affect everything about a person's life: reading, writing, talking, walking . . . the world could spin for years.
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[ 10-12-2009, 02:28 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]

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Raymond
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Yeah...think of all the fetuses that have been damaged with the use of ultrasound....what's your basis for this comment? I can not find any...primarily all state something like this...

http://my.clevelandclinic.org/services/Ultrasonography/hic_Ultrasonography_Test_Transcranial_Doppler.aspx


or this

TCD has proven to be a safe, fast, and reliable procedure for measuring the rate of CBF, especially as an assessment of risk for stroke. Individuals at risk for stroke usually have high blood velocities in the vessels of the brain. The rates of flow can be up to three or four times normal. Restrictions in blood flow may occur with the narrowing of blood vessels (stenosis), clot formation (thrombosis), blockage of blood vessels (embolism), or blood vessel rupture (hemorrhage). Lack of sufficient blood flow (ischemia) threatens brain tissue and may cause a stroke or other types of brain damage.


Are there any side effects?

Studies have shown ultrasound is not hazardous. There are no harmful side effects. In addition, ultrasound does not use radiation, as X-ray tests do.

Where did you information come from? educate me....again the question is is the risk worth the procedure hmmm on this chat people take ABs for long time.....do you think it possible that it may help...gotta come out of the box sometime

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Raymond
Leave the gun, take the cannolis

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Keebler
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The Cleveland Clinic knows nothing about the brains of those with late stage lyme. The studies were not done on patients with neuroborreliosis.

I'm saying that lyme changes the brain, making it much more sensitive to damage from even mild stimulation. The ears, too, need extra consideration with lyme patients. Even though the sound cannot be heard, it will stimulate the ears and that could be dangerous for lyme patients.

If someone with lyme is interested in this, it should fist be discussed with an excellent LLMD who is ILADS educated. Preferably, then, lyme researcher Brian Fallon, with the lyme center at Columbia University, should be consulted as he is most familiar with the use of SPECT scans for lyme patients and may be able to offer his thoughts on this.


Bottom line: in nearly everything, lyme patients are often affected differently than people without lyme. Often, some of the results can create permanent problems that add to the torture already tipping the scales. Stress also compounds adrenal dysfunction which, in turn, stresses the heart. With lyme, all this has to be considered.

I've had some very rough rides from tests that were supposed to be a piece of cake. I just don't want others to have to go through some of that with doctors that don't understand why my body reacts differently than it should.
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[ 10-12-2009, 03:55 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]

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Keebler
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This experience is very common for lyme patients, even the sound of their own voice is like a football field full a screaming fans inside their head. Even the slight hum of a cell phone or fluorescent lights can set off a seizure for some lyme patients.

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From one of the people in the documentary UNDER OUR SKIN:

http://underourskin.com/blog/?p=109

Excerpts:

. . . The loud ringing in my ears. . . .

. . . The excruciating discomfort and pressure in my face and head from the sound of my own voice as I spoke. . . .

. . . .

- this very long, thoughtful post continued at link above.
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massman
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I am not aware of any tests to test the safety of ultrasound on fetuses.

Short term tests, long term tests following up to check if there are any differences in those who received the US(ultrasound) and those who didn't)

And since the brain is so complex what should be measured ? IQ? Social interactions with others ? ? ?

And the world famous Cleveland Clinic saying a service they perform does not work and may be dangerous ? IMO a cold day in he!! before that would happen.

Many seemed to be hooked on and bow down to high tech while our health care is some of the absolute worst in the "civilized" world ?

And Keeblers comments on such major differences between lyme brains and "normal" brains is excellent. And what really is normal ? Lots of assumptions are made on that. I could continue for a few more months on this, but...

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Keebler
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Who has the highest rate of hearing loss in the world, even higher at early adulthood than any other country?

The U.S. (as per one of my neurotologists).

There are places in the world, non-industrialized nations that even the very elderly have NO hearing loss at all. It is most sad (an erroneous) that hearing loss is regarded as something that simply occurs with age. It comes from damage to the ears.

And, yes, there have been parents who has reason to wonder if ultrasound during pregnancy may have been responsible for their child's hearing disorder. And that is one reason why there is a limit to the number of ultrasounds to be administered during fetal development.

But, as damage to the ears may take years or decades to come to light - and there are many ways hearing damage manifests itself - it is difficult to make clear associations.
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ArtistDi
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If the ultrasound is on the outside of the head,
it may not have the terrible impact of other testing that lyme patients go through. I had to have my corotid artery ultrasounded, and I have mcs, lyme, and it did not affect me. I am quite sensitive to testing, especially the dyes. I think a lot more patients may have had incidents with contrasts in MRIs, and SPECT scans. I know a few mcs/lyme patients that did.

The idea is to remain open to less invasive testing, I believe. Since I am a woman, I had several ultrasounds because I had a high risk pregnacy, and my son is very strong and sound.

I am intrigued by alternative approaches, especially since I have had to run the gamut of testing--spinal, EEG, EKGs, and many others. The EEGs are electrodes attached to the head and I have not experienced anything untowards with that.

It would be interesting to talk with professionals who use this, and why isn't it used more for diagnostic reasons? He raises an
interesting point.

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Raymond
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Brian Fallon......yeah.....I am not sure but I do not think he reviews all the lyme SPECT scans down in NY as he didn't do mine....but it was determined my cortical perfusion was due to infection, autoimmune or meds nothing definitive........Fallon has stated SPECT are not indicative of a diagnosis...as many docs understand this also..llmd's or not

The fact that cortical perfusion could cause brain tissue damage/brain damage well I think it may be worth the risk...and who's to say it was caused by lyme surely not Fallon's group...they gave me three or four choices

SPECT scan they inject a radioactive material into the brain....I am truly looking for a medical analysis...I understand we have allot of doctors on this web site and allot of sick people who listen to these doctors and aren't getting well....I have already done the neuro physc test also.....and caught h3ll for that....

Did your neuro give you the reason why US has the highest % of hearing loss? Was it due to industry, noise pollution, not seeking out proper medical attention...or ultrasound?

I came looking for medical analysis not personal opinions....and I will ask LLMD of this test...or by the way...the are many causes of hyperfusion, hepatic, endocrine/thyroid.....

[ 10-12-2009, 07:52 PM: Message edited by: Raymond ]

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Raymond
Leave the gun, take the cannolis

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ArtistDi
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sorry. basically double post
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massman
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ArtistDi not getting symptoms right after or soon after does not mean that nothing may have happened.

And the waves HAVE to pass through the brain in order to provide an image.

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ArtistDi
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Same with MRIs, CAT scans and SPECT. All past through the brain. Time will tell.
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feelfit
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I would choose ultrasound, which is essentially energy, over MRI, CAT, X-rays anyday.....oh, and over the beloved SPECT scan too. NO contrasting agents, no radioactive material. no brainer.

I hope that you find your answer Raymond. I admire your perserverance [Smile]

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feelfit
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Raymond
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feelfit....You know you and I have a commonality....deals with a cyperspace friendship and a relationship I had with a girl with the same name as you haha....Bless you...and pray for your wellness also..

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Raymond
Leave the gun, take the cannolis

Posts: 214 | From Rhode Island | Registered: Nov 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
   

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