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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » Diflucan for Lyme?

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Author Topic: Diflucan for Lyme?
thomasx
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Here's an interesting article from a Dr. claiming that Diflucan may be effective for Lyme. Diflucan Article Link This is from 2004/5 or so. What is known about this idea? Thanks.
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randibear
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well i know i felt much better on diflucan than i did on the abx.

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do not look back when the only course is forward

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thomasx
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RandiB, how long were you on it?
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randibear
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i couldn't get my doctor to give me more than two weeks worth. he'd give me 200 per day and i'd cut it in half so i'd take 100 for about a month.

didn't seem to hurt and like i said, helped a lot.

i don't know why these doctors won't prescribe diflucan longer, but they won't.

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do not look back when the only course is forward

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nefferdun
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I was told it kills yeast but also kills the cyst form of lyme.

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old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot

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Amanda
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Randibear,

you can order the generic form of diflucan (fluconazole) without a prescription at this website

http://www.pharmacy1010.com/product_page.asp?id=1777

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"few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example" - Mark Twain

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thomasx
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Did you guys read the article? It's fairly significant!!
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randibear
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0h yeah, read it, but it's something i already knew.

and man it's expensive to order without a dr's notice. at least my insurance pays for it.

still don't understand why doc's won't give it. i've begged for it practically and still no go.

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do not look back when the only course is forward

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sickpuppy
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I was on fluconozole and started to have heart problems. There's info about sideFX on the drug info page when you get the script, specifically about the heart. My heart was racing, hard to breath, feeling woozy. I'm a 'sensitive' drug taker so 50 mg was ok but 150 mg was too much. I was also on Doxy--the 2 drugs together intensify effects. In the end though, I still have the yeast. Doc wants me to try Nystatin instead.
Try a no sugar/no gluten (and of course no alchohol diet) for candida/yeast.

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nefferdun
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I didn't read the article the first time and now that I have I am feeling up beat. I found my prescription of diflucan in the cabinet and started my first dose this morning. I believe it made me dizzy last time. I have developed pain in my right arm, can't use it, and this is a lyme thing. I have been concentrating too much on the bartonella. I was told by the LLMD to take Rifampin, Biaxin and Diflucan together but this article says to take the biaxin and diflucan seperately. I had to quit abx after problems but restarted them on my own about two months ago. I think it was the combo of diflucan and biaxin that I could not tolerate as it made me so dizzy I could not walk. I have been taking rifampin and zithro but did not take it today to see if it helps my arm. Maybe I will do a few days of diflucan to see what happens - side effects if any, and then start the rifampin but not the zithro. Cycle it like the article says. I need to see my family practioner to get refills and tests. Thanks for posting this!

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old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot

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thomasx
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Most interesting is that it may be effective against neuro-lyme!
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dmc
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It is well known...it has been called swartz protocal.

It is good to post these articles for those new to Lyme treatment.


If you do a search on these things you'd see how it's been discussed over the years.

The search on this site is under "the post a poll" at tha top.

http://flash.lymenet.org/scripts/ultimatebb.cgi/ubb/search

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nefferdun
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I have neuro lyme! I am so relieved. I was worried I was just S***out of luck. I have 22 pills at 200 mg left. I must have taken 8 before I got sick last time and I am pretty sure it was when I added the biaxin that it happened.
We'll see how it goes.

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old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot

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thomasx
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I did do a search, but must not have been using the proper keywords. So, it's the Swartz protocol. Can anyone summarize the findings? Is it effective, does it work for some and not others? Is it mainly against neuro-lyme? This is the first time I've seen mention of it. I'm looking for some long-timers to chime in also. Thanks.
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randibear
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basically he gave his patients 30 days of diflucan then 30 days of penicillin.

cna't remember dosage but that's it in a nutshell.

i think he claimed a pretty good success rate but don't remember the exact numbers.

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TylerAdam
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yes thomasx, it would be good to know who has tried the Swartz protocol since it was published in 2004.

Can we have a poll on here? i.e. who has tried it? what dosage? for how long? and did you improve?

Would be very greatful of any replies.

By the way my LLMD want's me to try diflucan 100mg BID (twice a day) for a month.

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randibear
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do you do a search for that protocol? cause i think it's been mentioned on here a couple of times.

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do not look back when the only course is forward

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TylerAdam
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I forgot to mention that blood tests must be performed within a couple of weeks of starting fluconazole and also checks to make sure no other drugs interact with fluconazole.
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Lymeorsomething
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I'm not sure if the above linked to fulltext, but here is another PDF link:

http://www.daignet.de/site-content/die-daig/fachorgan/2004/ejomr-2005-vol.9/334.pdf

And thanks for the original post. Interesting.

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bv
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I am currently taking 200 mg doxy 2x day, 500 mg Biaxin 1x day & 100 mg diflucan 1x day, plus probiotics & various supplements. Been doing it for 3 months.

Diflucan speeds up the metabolism of certain other drugs (Doxy & Biaxin are 2 of them), so my Doc said take the diflucan 3 hours before/after the doxy & biaxin.

My experience with LD is that I get a bad flare every 4 weeks. I noticed that the flare (Herx?) was not as bad this past month.

I hope that means this treatment approach is working. I have had no out of the ordinary problems with diflucan.

Good Luck

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Lymeorsomething
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The study is interesting as 3 Igm positive patients saw their blots convert to negative with this treatment protocol...

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"Whatever can go wrong will go wrong."

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Tracy9
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I take 200 mg every other day, have long term, for about a year. I hadn't attributed it to this, but my neuro Lyme is much better. Maybe this is why. My LLD gave it me as a cyst buster as well as for yeast issues.

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NO PM; CONTACT: [email protected]

13 years Lyme & Co.; Small Fiber Neuropathy; Myasthenia Gravis, Adrenal Insufficiency. On chemo for 2 1/2 years as experimental treatment for MG.

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thomasx
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Again, the findings of the study are quite remarkable, even if based upon a small sample. I'm still surprised that I hadn't heard *anything* about this in the couple of years surfing this board. If anyone knows anything further about lyme and Diflucan, please chime in. Thanks!
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Lymeorsomething
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It's an easy protocol as well, although Diflucan can be hard on the body. But running it for a month at normal doses isn't too bad. Worth a shot.

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"Whatever can go wrong will go wrong."

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thomasx
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How can Diflucan be hard on the body?
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djf2005
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There is a local LLMD near me in Kennett Square who uses Fluconazole as his primary treatment.

It is rather successful for the lesser sick individual, as well as aiding some of his more sick patients.

I have been taking it for a couple months now, and my liver enzymes are fine, etc.

Some thing it's "hard" on the body, but IMO it's less toxic than a lot of the other drugs people subject themselves too.

From what "he" (the local LLMD) tells me, Fluconazole covers five "kingdoms" of bacteria, etc, so it's a good long term therapy for lyme patients because it can suppress the opportunistic infections that we all deal with giving our immune system a fighting chance.

I do not believe it is a miracle cure, but I do think it has it's place.

Most Drs will not Rx it for more than a month, my guy in Kennett is really one of the only ones I have known to do this.

None of his patients have elevated liver enzymes from it. Some actually go down and his theory on this is by using the medication it is clearing some of the infections/bacteria that are stressing the liver by themselves in the first place.

Best

Derek

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Lymeorsomething
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It carries some risks like most other drugs, but what I'm saying is that the protocol used here is brief (month +/-) so it's definitely doable.

Side effects/adverse reaction info for most drugs is typically available online by doing a straight google search.

I've never had any bad reaction to Diflucan personally but have only run it sporadically.

[ 01-03-2010, 07:54 PM: Message edited by: Lymeorsomething ]

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tory2457
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My doc has me on diflucan and either minocycline or tetracycline. and Mepron.

2weeks on 2 weeks off. I have MS er lyme and for me tetracycline along with diflucan has been wonderful. It's really been cleaning things up, I can't say enough good things about it.

best,
tory

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Geneal
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I've done the diflucan protocol for 18 months+.

I feel like this medicine has definitely been part of a turning point for me.

My speech became better. My balance was better.

Yeast control is just one of the perks.

I take 200mg for 60 days straight. Off for two weeks. Repeat.

My liver enzyme levels have always been okay on it.

Hugs,

Geneal

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Lymeorsomething
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Here is one original thread about the article:

http://flash.lymenet.org/ubb/Forum1/HTML/029810.html

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"Whatever can go wrong will go wrong."

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cleo
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Here is another interesting article. I know its not lyme but h pylori is intracelluar too.

http://www.blackwellpublishing.com/febsabstracts2005/abstract.asp?id=41966

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nefferdun
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Two days on the diflucan and my arm, which I could hardly use is much better. I have periodic problems with it and I attribute it to lyme. It usually lasts up to a month so it is surprising that it is resolving this quickly. I was worried it would develop into tendonitis (which is what happened when I took Levaquin) but that pain is gone and I have no aching. Perhaps a coincidence but I am going to hope that this might be my ticket.

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old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot

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lymemomtooo
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I have a friend that has been fighting LD and yeast and goes to a Dr near Kennett Square. She recently had a mini stroke..

Could this be a side effect of diflucan? She thinks it might be a side effect of the LD. lmt

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djf2005
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No, it's (diflucan) not going to cause a stroke.

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randibear
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i wish there was a way to convince doctors to give me more. one doc only gave me one 200 mg pill.

like that's going to do something...

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JRWagner
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Schardt protocol, NOT Schwartz...

Diflucan does NOT kill the cystic forms of Lyme...neither does Plaquenil.

Diflucan or its generic form are NOT available without a prescription...do not trust any site that says otherwise.

Diflucan CAN cause liver problems...one needs to have their liver enzymes checked weekly/bi-weekly to insure that no damage is being done.

This protocol went nowhere...many Lyme friends and myself have tried it. Often people feel better simply because they are not getting the side effects of the ABX.

Good luck if you try this!

Peace, Love and Wellness,
JRW

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thomasx
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JRW -- From the article... "JN: Tell me your reasoning as to why diflucan might work in chronic lyme.

FS: There are several reasons. First of all, it inhibits an enzyme called cytochrome P45O. This is an enzyme that your liver, for instance, uses to detoxify chemicals and drugs. Borrelia has a very primitive p45O defense, so if you inhibit it, it is easily weakened. Therefore I believe that diflucan inhibits the growth and replication of borrelia. It does not necessarily kill it. In addition, it penetrates well into the cells and into the nervous system and brain, where borrelia may hide."

So how do your comments about Diflucan not killing the cystic form relate to the above or to the study in general? Also, you mentioned that you and others followed it with no results. What was your exact protocol? Also, do you have neuro lyme? Have you done any research into Dr. S's work since the original study? Thanks.

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B4LYME
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I have looked into this protocol online and could really only find this one small study. If it was really as simple as using diflucan followed by a penicillin I would think there would be more written about it in the lyme community.

Diflucan does affect the liver and the liver enzymes must be followed closely by testing on a regular basis.

It also interacts in different ways with certain antibiotics and several other drugs.

As it was explained to me, the Diflucan theoretically may weaken the cystic form of lyme and the penicillin was to kill the weakened organism.

While I am not convinced of diflucan's part in treating lyme, I am convinced that abx need to be used to kill the lyme and co-infections.

I think we need more studies on this with a larger population. If you do try it make sure you follow the no sugar diet and follow the diflucan with a penicillin.

I hope my thoughts help and aren't too scattered.

B4LYME

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5dana8
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thanks for the article Thomasx. i have always felt better on just diflucan. get some serious lyme herxs on it too. it helps alot with everything including my neuro,fatigue & joint pain.

still an uphill battle to get an rx for it though. not sure why doctors don't want to prescribe this med

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thomasx
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Anyone here been "cured" of neuro-lyme sx using Diflucan for either the 30 or 50 day protocol?
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swedish lyme sufferer
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Yes I know one.
NOt me though.

You will have to repeat the procedure many times around Dr. Schardt says in the interview.

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Lymetoo
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Randi.. your LLMD doesn't prescribe it?

PS.. my view is that it is working more on yeast than Lyme. Many if not ALL lyme patients have yeast. Kill it out and you will feel better.

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Opinions, not medical advice!

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nefferdun
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I thought you were supposed to follow up 50 days of diflucan with Biaxin? My LLMD wanted me to used rifampin, biaxin and diflucan at one time. He said the diflucan would killl the cyst form, maybe not as effectively as some other drugs like flagyl but there has to be different approaches.

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swedish lyme sufferer
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No it should be ONLY diflucan ALONE,
then ABX. Not at the same time, if you do like Schardt's

Posts: 347 | From sweden | Registered: Feb 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
thomasx
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This is the first time I hear someone say that the treatment has to be repeated many times. Perhaps I'll have to reread the article.
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hobokinite
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I was on it a few weeks for Candida. Can't say it helped. But, everyone is different and why not try it?
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JRWagner
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Any LLMD who states that Diflucan kills the cyst form is blowing smoke...of the funny kind. Just like Plaquenil, there are NO studies that show this capability. The ONLY studies (Boroson, et. al.) for the killing capability of any ABX, Metronidazole and Tinnidazole, were done in VITRO...NOT in VIVO...big difference.

The Schardt Protocol has no follow-up or peer reviewed studies. Does it work? Not for me or anyone I know.

He did not use Bicillin...simply Fluconazole and Penicillin.

Yes, I do have Neuro Lyme...been fighting it for 16 freakin' years...been there, done that including IV three times. Thinking of going on Tigecycline IV. Dr. Burrescano said it is 100 times stronger than Mino...blocks the mechanism that pumps ABX out of the cells.

Peace, Love and Wellness,
JRW

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thomasx
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Exactly what it does or how it does it isn't that important at the moment. The important thing is that it did "apparently" show the ability to slay lyme in certain patients. Whether it was a European strain or not, doesn't matter. If the case report results are accurate, then this points toward further study of the mechanisms that may be in play. No?
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thomasx
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Oh, I forgot something. I just last week heard there is a local LLMD that treats primarily with Diflucan. Wrong or right? Not sure. Don't know what kind of results he's getting.
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djf2005
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Yeah thomas I mentioned this earlier in this thread.

--------------------
"Experience is not what happens to you; it is what you do with what happens to you."

[email protected]

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thomasx
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Oh, yeah. I see that!
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swedish lyme sufferer
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Diflucan works on toxoplasmosis and cryptokockmeningitis as well as candida......
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canefan17
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could the neuro-lyme symptoms that people are claiming it cures... simply be canidida symptoms coming under control?


Don't want to confuse us more... : )

But how could diflucan specifically be so helpful in neuro-lyme?

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