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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » Does Lyme CAUSE Parkinson or MS.... ect????

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Author Topic: Does Lyme CAUSE Parkinson or MS.... ect????
saved10
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Just wondering if any of you, where diganosed with any of these....If, so hopefully we can get the word out!!!! Thanks!!!
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dmc
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Do a search here. Lots of info/comments regarding those diagnosed MS. The search is up under the "post a poll" above.
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Lymetoo
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I think it can! Good luck getting anyone to listen to you/us though.

I believe Lyme caused my father to have Parkinson's. We didn't know about Lyme until after he had died.

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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saved10
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I was diganosed with Parkinson first, been in treatment for 11 months forLyme, I would say I'm 25 per cent better have a long way to go....

I also see, Ben Petrick was dignosed with PD first, he was in under our skin

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saved10
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Lymetoo

Sorry for your loss. If you don't mind me asking...What did your father pass away from and how old was he?

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farraday
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I don't know about Parkinsons. But my mom and my cousin died of ALS. The scary thing is that Mom started with all the same symptoms I have. My LLMD said that he finds it most interesting.

Even my Chinese doctor in San Francisco asked me out of the blue if ALS ran in our family. My neuro symptoms are suspicious.

I just wonder if Mom had undiagnosed lyme that proceeded to ALS. She had the thyroid problems, heart valve and hip replaced, speech, swallowing problems, etc.

--------------------
DOCTOR: "I don't think you are sick."
PATIENT: "We are all entitled to our opinions. I don't think you are a doctor."

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Lymetoo
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Saved.... He officially died from complications of Parkinson's. It was sepsis due his being bedridden. ( He was a month shy of being 78 )

Read this:

http://flash.lymenet.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/3/23845

http://flash.lymenet.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/1/83357

http://www.canlyme.com/lymepark.html

Farraday.. be sure to open the first link above.

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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farraday
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Thanks so much. I guess I am a bit confused today. My friend sent me the ALS/lyme article and I did not realize you guys already had it. I should know better!

I will check out all the links. This is very interesting info. I know my husband is interested, too.

His latest focus has been on the relationship of lyme and XMRV, testing, etc. Will post if he learns anything new.

--------------------
DOCTOR: "I don't think you are sick."
PATIENT: "We are all entitled to our opinions. I don't think you are a doctor."

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bv
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quote:
Originally posted by saved10:
Just wondering if any of you, where diganosed with any of these....If, so hopefully we can get the word out!!!! Thanks!!!

Lida Mattman (author of Stealth Pathogens--cell wall deficient forms) would suggest its certainly a possibility worth more research.
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Keebler
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-
There are many medical articles linking lyme to many neurological disorders, just do a cross search to begin.


=================

http://www.ilads.org
ILADS

see articles and presentations

=================

Many instances of falsely diagnosed Parkinson's, MS, Alzheimer's, CFS, Fibromyalgia - all mentioned in this documentary:

www.underourskin.com

UNDER OUR SKIN

===================

While this article below is about MS and lyme, it is informative concerning all neurological diagnoses where lyme might be a player.

http://www.ilads.org/goldings.html


CONTROVERSIES IN NEUROBORRELIOSIS

Audrey Stein Goldings, M.D.

Updated October, 2002


===========================

www.jneuroinflammation.com/content/5/1/40


Persisting atypical and cystic forms of Borrelia burgdorferi and local inflammation in Lyme neuroborreliosis

Abstract Excerpts:

Background

The long latent stage seen in syphilis, followed by chronic central nervous system infection and inflammation, can be explained by the persistence of atypical cystic and granular forms of Treponema pallidum. We investigated whether a similar situation may occur in Lyme neuroborreliosis.

. . .

Conclusion

The results indicate that atypical extra- and intracellular pleomorphic and cystic forms of Borrelia burgdorferi and local neuroinflammation occur in the brain in chronic Lyme neuroborreliosis.

The persistence of these more resistant spirochete forms, and their intracellular location in neurons and glial cells, may explain the long latent stage and persistence of Borrelia infection. The results also suggest that Borrelia burgdorferi may induce cellular dysfunction and apoptosis.

The detection and recognition of atypical, cystic and granular forms in infected tissues is essential for the diagnosis and the treatment as they can occur in the absence of the typical spiral Borrelia form.

==================

The first article has much attention on both lyme and Cpn (Chlamydia pneumonia, another chronic stealth infection):


http://tinyurl.com/preview.php?num=64y3rv

(then clink "PROCEED TO THIS SITE")


May 2008 Volume 39 Number 5 LABMEDICINE
www.labmedicine.com - American Society for Clinical Pathology


CHRONIC BACTERIAL AND VIRAL INFECTIONS IN NEURODEGENERATIVE AND NEUROBEHAVIORAL DISEASES

- by Garth Nicolson, Ph.D.

------


For more detail, the author's site is:

www.immed.org

The Institute for Molecular Medicine

A nonprofit institute dedicated to discovering new diagnostic and therapeutic solutions for chronic mycoplasma infections.

-------

Also see:

www.cpnhelp.org

Cpn Help


==================

http://tinyurl.com/5crsjv

Cure Unknown: Inside the Lyme Epidemic (2008) - by Pamela Weintraub

This details what an entire family went through. Having this knowledge of their journey will help others to get better, faster treatment.

Author's website: http://www.cureunknown.com


=====================

And lyme is not the only stealth infection that can manifest as neurological illness:

In addition to the usual coinfections from ticks (such as babesia, bartonella, ehrlichia, RMSF, etc.), there are some other chronic stealth infections that an excellent LLMD should know about:


http://flash.lymenet.org/scripts/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=069911#000000

TIMACA #6911 posted 03 August, 2008

I would encourage EVERY person who has received a lyme diagnosis to get the following tests. . . .

- at link.

-

[ 01-26-2010, 01:45 AM: Message edited by: Keebler ]

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Keebler
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-
This is about that doctor interviews in the film, UNDER OUR SKIN:


http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/117994622/abstract?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0

Motor neuron disease recovery associated with IV ceftriaxone and anti-Babesia therapy

W. T. Harvey, D. Martz

ABSTRACT

This report summarizes what we believe to be the first verifiable case of a significant and progressive motor neuron disease (MND) consistent with amyotrophic lateral sclerosis that resolved during treatment with i.v. ceftriaxone plus oral atovaquone and mefloquine.

The rationale for use of these antibiotics was (i) positive testing for Borrelia burgdorferi and (ii) red blood cell ring forms consistent with Babesia species infection. The patient has continued to be free of MND signs and symptoms for 15 months, although some symptoms consistent with disseminated Borreliosis remain.

========================

Excerpt: `` . . . one year after initiating the antibiotic and anti-protozoal treatment, he was declared to be free of motor neuron disease by his neurologist . . .'' from:

http://www.dreamdoctor.com/radio/battle.shtml

ALS Caused by Lyme Disease with Babesia Co-infection Posted March 15, 2008

After experiencing difficulty speaking during his nightly radio show, Charles McPhee was diagnosed with a bulbar (neck and throat) presentation of ALS (amyotrophic lateral sclerosis), or Lou Gehrig's disease, on June 23, 2006.


After researching the possible causes of ALS, Charles decided to treat his ALS with a combination of antibiotics (ceftriaxone, Flagyl, azithromycin) and anti-protozoals (Mepron and Malarone). His rationale for using them is based on a recently documented link between ALS, Lyme Disease, and Babesia.

In a paper published October 22, 2006, Dr. David Martz of Colorado Springs, CO, outlined a harrowing journey through ALS... and back. He was diagnosed in April of 2003, and soon was unable to drive, dress himself, or walk.


Over the next few months his health continued to deteriorate rapidly, and he was forced to retire from his medical practice. Eight months later, while bedridden and confined to a wheelchair, he learned from a friend who sent him a newspaper clipping that it was possible he really had been infected with Lyme disease, an infection commonly carried by ticks.

After 6 negative tests for Lyme (late-stage Lyme is notoriously difficult to detect in the human body), an antibiotic-provoked urinary PCR test in December, 2003, finally showed positive for Borrelia Burgdorferi (Bb), the spirochete bacteria that causes Lyme disease.


During a visual scan of his blood, rings around his red blood cells were also detected, indicating a probable co-infection with Babesia microti, a malaria-like protozoa that is estimated to be transmitted in over 60% of Lyme infections.


Based on this new information, Dr. Martz began using a combination of antibiotics and anti-protozoals to treat his ALS. He noticed dramatic improvement in his symptoms.


Within 12 weeks he was walking again without assistance, and in February, 2005, one year after initiating the antibiotic and anti-protozoal treatment, he was declared to be free of motor neuron disease by his neurologist, Steven A. Smith, M.D. That same month Dr. Martz was fully recovered and once again began treating Chonic Disease sufferers in private practice in Colorado Springs.

---------

(poster's note: Dr. Martz has since moved/retired to devote time to research/writing.)

==================

Two other cases where ALS was misdiagnosed and lyme found to the be the cause:

http://flash.lymenet.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/3/23845#000002

Topic: Article in San Jose Mercury News Lyme not ALS!

-

[ 01-26-2010, 01:44 AM: Message edited by: Keebler ]

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tickalert
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I think ALS is a sign of lyme. Dr. Martz was my LLMD at one time before retiring.

I saw him at the Under Our Skin movie reccently and he seemed to be doing well.

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METALLlC BLUE
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Yes

--------------------
I am not a physician, so do your own research to confirm any ideas given and then speak with a health care provider you trust.

E-mail: [email protected]

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treepatrol
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quote:
Originally posted by METALLlC BLUE:
Yes

[bow] [woohoo] [bow] I concurr

--------------------
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.
Remember Iam not a Doctor Just someone struggling like you with Tick Borne Diseases.

Newbie Links

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David Miller
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I don't think it *causes* all these diseases. Or ANY of these diseases.

I does, however, frequently cause symptoms very similar to these and others, and thus get mis-diagnosed. I think that's what you were really asking, and is what MB was answering.

Under Our Skin and Cure Unknown both talk about it. ALS, CFS, fibromyalgia, MS, PD, are all common mis-diagnosis for lyme. And that's just on the physical manifestation side. It can also cause all sorts of mental disorders - emotional disorders, schizophrenia, OCD, cognitive, you name it.

It's enough to make me wonder how many people are in mental institutions, jail, or hospitals because they didn't get some abx at the right time.

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treepatrol
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Its been found in all of them one strain of Borrelia or another also I think because of the way the diseases present it depends on a secondary infection also.

--------------------
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.
Remember Iam not a Doctor Just someone struggling like you with Tick Borne Diseases.

Newbie Links

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Lymetoo
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quote:
Originally posted by David Miller:
It's enough to make me wonder how many people are in mental institutions, jail, or hospitals because they didn't get some abx at the right time.

absolutely

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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Hoosiers51
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I think sometimes people who really have Lyme are misdiagnosed as having other diseases instead...

...but I do not think that all MS is Lyme. MS is a disease unto itself, with separate disease processes that are not found in all patients with Lyme.

Check out LymeMD's latest blog post: http://lymemd.blogspot.com/

He mentions a few other diseases in the second paragraph.

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saved10
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I guess we'll never know for sure, there are other Lyme Dr's out there that do believe these are caused by Lyme.

I know of a few people who where told they had MSA. There LLMD said they had Lyme induced MSA.

I do agree, not all is caused by Lyme. It does make you wonder though. God Bless

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ping
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quote:
Originally posted by tickalert:
I think ALS is a sign of lyme. Dr. Martz was my LLMD at one time before retiring.

I saw him at the Under Our Skin movie reccently and he seemed to be doing well.

tickalert - Do you remember when Dr. Martz retired (what year)?

Don't everyone start screaming at me, as I'm not sure I recall correctly, but I thought I read on one of the boards last year that he passed away.

I'm probably have him mixed up with someone else, so don't yell, just tell me true, okay?

--------------------
ping
"We are more than containers for Lyme"

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Rumigirl
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NO, Dr. Martz didn't pass away, thank goodness. He presented at the ILADS conference last October in DC. Whew! That's like the game of telephone (getting things mixed up).

In fact he presented on this very subject of ALS presentation of patients with Lyme and the treatment needed for them (it has to be more modified, or it can kill them quickly from the die-off).

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Pinelady
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Yes. Incidentally they have a new drug just out for

MS. And another ready in 2 years.

Now you know the rest of the story.

http://www.nationalmssociety.org/news/news-detail/index.aspx?nid=2586

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/lifestyle/health/new-multiple-sclerosis-pills-could-be-available-in-two-years-14644873.html

Do I believe these people are being denied adequate

medical testing and treatment for the sake of the drug companies.

Yes.

--------------------
Suspected Lyme 07 Test neg One band migrating in IgG region
unable to identify.Igenex Jan.09IFA titer 1:40 IND
IgM neg pos
31 +++ 34 IND 39 IND 41 IND 83-93 +
DX:Neuroborreliosis

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lightparfait
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I support a neighbor who developed MS, after lyme disease. He is under treatment and testing now with the Mayo clinic.

Previous to that he had aggressive lyme treatments over years with the famous LLMD"s in the NY / NJ area...switchng LLMD"s when treatments were not successful to eliminate developing MS symptoms.

Hoping all along that withlyme in remissin, his MS symptoms would leave.

Although now the lyme is in remission. MS symptoms keep developing and progresing.

He as well as his MD's believe the lyme could have been the tipping point for the overload in his immune system to actiavate MS. It is unknown...the chicken or the egg thing.

From what I have learned, there are underlying conditions we all have, each individual that sets us up for these diseases...when we are out of balance in some way, whether it is the viral load, pathogens, or toxins, inherited and acquired...a combo of each in us!

Studies on underlying causes would be a great thing for the future of preventative care.

It seems now we are focused as a nation on abating symptoms, killing cancer cells,etc...rather than preventing it and finding its root. Seems there is a pill developed and sold for every symptom...but no cures come with these bandaids...very frustrating for all!

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