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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » swollen ankles in newly diagnosed person

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Author Topic: swollen ankles in newly diagnosed person
lpkayak
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i did a search and found a few ppl had unexplained ankle swelling when first dx.

i am helping a new person and i just wanted to check. her elisa was pos and she got a month of doxy but still has sx and has seen many specialists who say nothing is wrong but she has many lyme sx

i had never heard of the ankle swelling so just wanted to ask if those who dealt with it could update me

she is definitely getting to an llmd and will have igenex testing etc and tx...but i wanted to tell her how the ankle thing worked out for others with tx cuz it is her worst sx

thanks for any input

--------------------
Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself.

Posts: 13712 | From new england | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
joalo
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Up.

--------------------
Sick since January 1985. Misdiagnosed for 20 years. Tested CDC positive October 2005. Treating since April 2006.

Posts: 3228 | From Somewhere west of the Mississippi | Registered: Aug 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
FunkOdyssey
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I'm not newly diagnosed (probably had Lyme 20+ years) but I have some ankle swelling which is really unusual, since my kidney and cardiac function both appear to be excellent and I'm only 29 years old.
Posts: 195 | From Manchester, CT | Registered: Jun 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Marnie
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So do mice exposed to lyme -> paw edema.

Google: edema lyme

Very common.

Histamine related. Our first (and likely ongoing) reaction to Bb is an ALLERGIC reaction.

Women may have a far greater problem due to the links between estrogen and histamine and DAO (which during pregnancy goes up 500 fold to protect a fetus from mom's histamine).

If you have the symptoms of excess histamine already, this may become a problem.

It is now believed that while histamine helps us in the beginning, in the long run it harms our immune response.

Old timers here...remember Bendectin?

Another form of the same is still used in Canada. When it was wrongly pulled off the market (Doc falsified reports of fetal damage), the number of premature deliveries DOUBLED.

Really. Documented - legit.

Estrogen dominance and histamine levels are strongly correlated.

Then of course there is the problem of phytoestrogens in our environment - jury is out on the benefit/harm.

http://envirocancer.cornell.edu/FactSheet/Diet/fs1.phyto.cfm

http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/bsc/jnc/2003/00000084/00000006/art00013

Look closely at PKC impact.

Tamoxifen, for breast cancer is a man-made PKC inhibitor that blocks chloride channels. Sometimes it isn't "enough" to kill off all of the cancer cells.

In steps EPA (omega 3).

Doubt?

Google: Tamoxifen EPA

Posts: 9402 | From Sunshine State | Registered: Mar 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Wolfed Out
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Interesting stuff from Marnie.

I'm 27 y/o, and I have a problem with ankle bruising and slight swelling occasionally. Really, I notice it when my joints in my wrists and elbows are hurting more as well. Also, my sinuses seem to be more inflamed when this flares up. So, I think it's linked into some kind of inflammation process happening at once.

But, from Marnie's perspective. One of the the first problems I developed ten years ago was chronic hives from exposure to the sun and exercise.

Doctors couldn't figure out what happened, but they tried to give me several medications which only made things worse. Zyrtec, Allegra and Benadryl only caused me to breakout in MORE HIVES. Big ones too.

Doctors are puzzled when I tell them I'm allergic to anti-histamines.

Posts: 829 | From MD | Registered: Dec 2009  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Marnie
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Get you histamine level checked if at all possible. IgE levels?

Allergic to anti-histamines...1st (cross blood brain barrier) AND 2nd generation (don't cross)...whoa.

Have you ever tried TOPICAL MgCl? Liquimins makes it and it is not expensive. Comes in a small blue glass bottle. 2 eye droppers full = approximately the RDA for Mg. We DO absorb things thru our skin.

Mg is an anti-histamine, anti-inflammatory and blocks HMG CoA reductase (stops cholesterol pathway like statins).

I wonder...Bendectin (1st generation anti-histamine) also contained B6 (coated tablet because our stomach acids destroy B vitamin supplements) which is why sublingual B6 is far superior and cheaper.

B6 deficiency = sleepy.

Bruising...easy...vit. C deficiency - oftentimes.
Vitamin K (clotting) may be dropping for PROTECTIVE reasons as lyme can trigger "thick blood".

However...if you aren't pumping in probiotics a very low level of the "good guys" WILL show up as bruising (esp. post op). I know for fact...my son.

Vitamin C lowers histamine.

Okay...I needed to figure the hives - antihistamine - B6 links.

Look at what I found (!):

"Writing in the New York State Journal of medicine, Dr. Edward Mandel reported a treatment using vitamin B6 for photosensitive skin eruptions.

Since Mrs. Wilson apparently was "sensitive" in her vitamin B6 metabolism, that seemed a logical place to start. Because vitamin B6 is generally safe, I asked her to start with the highest dose recommended by Dr. Mandel to his patients: 100 milligrams every hour while exposed to the sun.

It was apparent that her experiment had not been a complete success when she returned six weeks later. She had fading hives on both arms.

"Well, I must give the vitamin B6 a little credit," she said. "At least, I didn't itch as much, and I have a little less water retention.

But I'd hoped for more. Now what?" "Sometimes vitamin B6 doesn't work for this condition when taken by mouth, but works just fine injected. I'd suggest 300 mg twice daily as a starting point."

http://www.2020tech.com/health/health04.html

Try sublingual B6..Source Naturals makes it and it is called "Coenzymated B6". It is cheap. It is the ACTIVE form of B6, so ignore what appears to be a lower dose (milligram wise).

Oddly Unisom sleepTABs (same chemical as in Bendectin) normally cause us to fall asleep, but in combination with B6 (deficiency = sleepy), it doesn't.

Exercise and hives here:

http://dermatology.about.com/cs/hives/a/exana.htm

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lymednva
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Interesting about the Bendectin. I took it in all three of my pregnancies, even thought by the third one the test results about it had been out. Thanks goodness my ob/gyn is open-minded!

I had Lyme then, too, and figured out a few years ago I didn't really have morning sickness, I had increased dysautonomia symptoms. I did feel a bit better on the Bendectin.

My kids were born fine, except for probable Lyme in all three, who are now adults, and do not want to discuss it with me.

--------------------
Lymednva

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Robin123
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Yes, I had swollen ankles and knees when I was diagnosed.

The swelling went down rapidly when I started on antibiotics. Mine was and still is clindamycin, 150mg a couple times a day. I started by doing it every 6 hours.

The trick is to find the treatment that works for each person.

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lpkayak
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thanks all. i gave info to her to take to llmd

--------------------
Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself.

Posts: 13712 | From new england | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
D Bergy
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My wife had ankle swelling that Lyme treatment would not take get rid of. It was only when treated for Bartonella, that it went away for good.

Dan

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randibear
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both my ankles have what looks like golf ball size swelling on them.

doctor said no big deal. it's sort of soft, not hard. been there for years.

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do not look back when the only course is forward

Posts: 12262 | From texas | Registered: Mar 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
   

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