LymeNet Home LymeNet Home Page LymeNet Flash Discussion LymeNet Support Group Database LymeNet Literature Library LymeNet Legal Resources LymeNet Medical & Scientific Abstract Database LymeNet Newsletter Home Page LymeNet Recommended Books LymeNet Tick Pictures Search The LymeNet Site LymeNet Links LymeNet Frequently Asked Questions About The Lyme Disease Network LymeNet Menu

LymeNet on Facebook

LymeNet on Twitter




The Lyme Disease Network receives a commission from Amazon.com for each purchase originating from this site.

When purchasing from Amazon.com, please
click here first.

Thank you.

LymeNet Flash Discussion
Dedicated to the Bachmann Family

LymeNet needs your help:
LymeNet 2020 fund drive


The Lyme Disease Network is a non-profit organization funded by individual donations.

LymeNet Flash Post New Topic  New Poll  Post A Reply
my profile | directory login | register | search | faq | forum home

  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » VSL #3, Theralac and General Probiotic, Yeast Questions

 - UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!    
Author Topic: VSL #3, Theralac and General Probiotic, Yeast Questions
muddyfeet
Member
Member # 26633

Icon 1 posted      Profile for muddyfeet     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I just started abx treatment 2 weeks ago. I was put on Diflucan 200mg 1x day for a week then Zithromax 250mg 1x day for a week and just a few days ago went up to Zithromax 500mg 1x day.

I have a strong history of yeast with abx. I got a yeast infection in my esophogus in '03 that wasn't diagnosed until '05 and was resistant to diflucan. And if I even look at abx I'll get a vaginal yeast infection.

So I knew I would need to prepare. I insisted on taking the Diflucan and also started Renew Life Ultimate Flora 50Billion for a pbx. I've been taking the Renew Life 2x day lately.

In addition I'm swallowing about 4 cloves of raw garlic a day. I also drink 250mg of GSE a day in a smoothie (1 cup plain yogurt, 1/4 cup frozen berries, unsweetened coconut milk, rice protein powder).

I eat very little sugar (no refined, granny smith apples, some strawberries) and am figuring out the low carb though I rarely eat gluten and have been avoiding anything that has yeast in the ingredients for at least a year now so I think I'm pretty low carb. I really never though about carbs before though so I'm still figuring this one out.

However, I keep feeling like I'm just on the edge of a getting a yeast infection. You know when things feel off down there. I've decided I need a better probiotic and might try adding in Olive Leaf Extract and Boric Acid.

In terms of the pbx I've narrowed it down to VSL #3 or Theralac. My M.D wrote me a script for VSL#3 DS for IBS but BCBS won't cover it.

So, I'm wondering if there is a difference between the VSL powder and capsules? I found on their website that if I purchase two bottles it would be stronger than the Renew Life and less expensive in the long run.

Also, are Theralac and VSL #3 comparable?

Also, I keep reading that I need to make sure to take Sacchormyces Boulardi. Is that in either Theralac or VSL #3? and why do I need to take it?

With the Olive Leaf Extract is there a brand that people recommend? Am I correct that 2-3 capsules a day is what people take?

Thanks for all your help. I get overwhelmed and don't post much but I come here for all needed info and questions.

--------------------
Labcorp 6/10: IgM + 41, 39, 23

IGenex 7/10:
IFA Ind
IGenex/CDC IgM +:
18+, 23-25+, 30+, 31+++, 34++, 39++, 41++, 58++, 66+, 83-93+
IGenex IgG +:
31+, 34 IND, 41++, 58+

No memory of tick/rash. Sick 1/09. Diagnosed CFIDS 7/09. Diagnosed Lyme 7/10.

Posts: 56 | From San Diego, CA | Registered: Jun 2010  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
LymeMom Kellye
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 24807

Icon 1 posted      Profile for LymeMom Kellye   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
We take prescript assist pro by researched nutritionals, and saccro B, either Jarrow or Thorne brand. We take 2 of each in the AM 2 hours after abx, and 2 of each in the pm, 2 hours after abx.

Everyone is on high dose abx. Daughter takes diflucan every 3rd day ahd husband does nystatin.

So far so good. My daughter has dealt with yeast issues her entire life. She also soaks her toothbrush in hydrogen peroxide/water to keep it clean, and then gargles with the same solution after brushing. Her tongue is much better as is her throat.

The other probiotic that we researched and really like is Garden of Life Primal Defense Ultra. It is a soil based formula that doesn't require refrigeration.

We have also taken Theralac, but it is so expensive, that we just add one to our mix once or twice each week.

I am not sure if you have found iherb.com yet, but it has the best prices by far. I am sorry that I can't answer your questions, but I thought it was good to post about pbx because it is something that we all deal with.

Posts: 333 | From Lyme Here Too | Registered: Mar 2010  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Lymetoo
Moderator
Member # 743

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Lymetoo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
After many years of dealing with yeast, I have finally bought VSL#3. It actually is cheaper in the long run. You don't need a script.

I bought the capsules since they were a bit cheaper than the powder... (initially) but the powder is twice as strong and therefore cheaper in the long run.

Theralac is VERY good .. but right now I wanted something different. And I agree that ounce per ounce, Theralac is more expensive.

And for now, I don't know which is better .. maybe I will know after trying the VSL awhile!

I found the Ultimate Flora to be pretty good stuff.... but make sure if you buy it online, that it is shipped under refrigeration. It's not like Theralac which can go a few days without refrigeration.

They will ship the VSL free and it comes in an insulated box with frozen packs.

I have found yogurt and fruit to be very counterproductive for me when battling yeast. Just too much sugar.. even if it's not refined sugar. Plain yogurt still contains milk sugar.

and you are right.. carbs are a big piece of the puzzle. Stay away from white foods.

S.boulardi is a good thing to take, but you can't take it if you are on Diflucan.

Olive Leaf Extract is good too. I take Gaia brand. Mine says take two a day... so I would say to follow whatever directions are on the bottle.

Hope this helps!!


Candida diet and elimination:
http://flash.lymenet.org/ubb/Forum1/HTML/021412.html

http://www.wholeapproach.com/diet/

Lyme symptoms list compared with yeast symptoms
http://flash.lymenet.org/ubb/Forum1/HTML/021202.html


DIET, DIET, DIET is the key. Then, be sure to follow the 5 step plan outlined below. It was developed by my naturopath. It works.

"Successful control and elminiation of a Candida Albicans overgrowth requires a multifaceted program as described below. Failure to follow ALL the steps simultaneously will result in slow progress and will lengthen healing time significantly. The program should be tailored to the individual and must balance the need to eliminate the Candida and deprive it of its food source while insuring proper nutrition for the individual."

Five Steps to Candida Elimination:

1. You must starve it into submission by eliminating its food source.


2. You must kill it with anti-fungal herbs and supplements. [e.g....garlic, onion, caprylic acid, Pau D'Arco capsules or tea, clove, grapefruit seed extract, olive leaf extract, oil of oregano, tea tree oil, Echinacea, Goldenseal, black walnut, MSM, barberry root, uva ursi, neem leaf, biotin]

3. You must reestablish the proper balance and quantity of probiotic bacteria in the digestive tract. [...multi-strain lactobacillus acidophilus and bifidus capsules with FOS should be taken between meals to maximize repopulation of the digestive tract by beneficial bacteria.]

4. You must reestablish proper levels of all B vitamins (yeast free) and utilize other immune enhancing supplements to boost immune system function. [e.g ... B complex vitamins (yeast free), biotin, beta 1-3 glucan, colostrum, maitake mushroom, vitamins A, C, E, zinc and selenium]

5. You must cleanse and heal the digestive tract to promote proper elimination of toxins and Candida and assimilation of nutrients. [e.g...chlorophyll, MSM, omega 3 fatty acids found in flax seed and salmon oils, GLA found in borage, evening primrose and black currant oils. Pantothenic acid, digestive enzymes between meals]

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

Posts: 95723 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
muddyfeet
Member
Member # 26633

Icon 1 posted      Profile for muddyfeet     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Lymetoo - I would be interested to know what your experience is with the VSL. Are you changing just to try it out or did the Theralac stop working for you?

Thanks for the info. Seems like I'll just have to give each a try. Suppose I'll start with VSL #3 though I like that Theralac says it has prebiotics as well.

Thanks for the advice about S.Boulardi and I might use hydrogen peroxide for my toothbrush as well.

I used a "garlic suppository" last night and think it helped a little. Plan on getting some boric acid.

Thanks:)

--------------------
Labcorp 6/10: IgM + 41, 39, 23

IGenex 7/10:
IFA Ind
IGenex/CDC IgM +:
18+, 23-25+, 30+, 31+++, 34++, 39++, 41++, 58++, 66+, 83-93+
IGenex IgG +:
31+, 34 IND, 41++, 58+

No memory of tick/rash. Sick 1/09. Diagnosed CFIDS 7/09. Diagnosed Lyme 7/10.

Posts: 56 | From San Diego, CA | Registered: Jun 2010  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
sammy
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13952

Icon 1 posted      Profile for sammy     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I like VSL#3. It has good scientific research to support it's efficacy. Much higher potency per capsule than Theralac.

The difference between VSL#3 DS and the capsules is CFU count. The prescription DS has 900billion CFU's per packet. Two of the capsules have 225billion CFU's.

I take 2 capsules VSL#3 at bedtime with 2 S.Boulardii. I also take 2 Healthy Origins Florafit probiotic capsules at lunch (60billion). I take this brand at lunch because it doesn't have to be refrigerated so it is easy to carry with me if I have to go somewhere.

Posts: 5237 | From here | Registered: Nov 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
mysteryillness1970
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 24588

Icon 1 posted      Profile for mysteryillness1970     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I got mine to cover VSL#3 under a tier 3. I dump the packets into an empty baby food bottle and use a dash (measuring spoon) with each round of abx.

One packet lasts a week and gets me through about 3-4 months.

Hope this helps [Smile]

Posts: 166 | From USA | Registered: Feb 2010  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Lymetoo
Moderator
Member # 743

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Lymetoo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by muddyfeet:
Lymetoo - I would be interested to know what your experience is with the VSL. Are you changing just to try it out or did the Theralac stop working for you?


------------

Plan on getting some boric acid.

Thanks:)

No experience with VSL .. just have heard how great it was all these years and I never tried it. I haven't used Theralac in well over a year. (using other products) Could be part of the reason I'm having trouble.

But mainly it's because I've been cheating on the diet and then my stupid GI dr gave me antibiotics and I wasn't being careful.

Do not ingest boric acid.. it is only for suppositories.

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

Posts: 95723 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
muddyfeet
Member
Member # 26633

Icon 1 posted      Profile for muddyfeet     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Lymetoo - My GI dr. told me I could take Florastor with Nystatin or Diflucan.

I said "are you sure cause I read differently" and he looks it up and says "oh, look at that, you are right, you can't take them both together".

He is one of the more well known GI dr. around here too!! I feel I spend my days trying to educate all sorts of dr.s!!!

I've never taken boric acid so hope that there isn't a difference in types. Crazy to me that it works so well for yeast but you can't ingest it. I'll be careful not to.

mysteryillness- Did you have to work at getting your insurance to cover it? My dr. gave me a script but the pharmacy called BCBS and told me they won't cover the VSL#3. Should I try again?

Sammy - Thanks for explaining the difference. I hope the capsules are strong enough, I just ordered a bunch. I may check out what you take in the afternoon in case I am not at home. Good idea.

Thanks everyone for the feedback:)

--------------------
Labcorp 6/10: IgM + 41, 39, 23

IGenex 7/10:
IFA Ind
IGenex/CDC IgM +:
18+, 23-25+, 30+, 31+++, 34++, 39++, 41++, 58++, 66+, 83-93+
IGenex IgG +:
31+, 34 IND, 41++, 58+

No memory of tick/rash. Sick 1/09. Diagnosed CFIDS 7/09. Diagnosed Lyme 7/10.

Posts: 56 | From San Diego, CA | Registered: Jun 2010  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
kitty9309
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 19945

Icon 1 posted      Profile for kitty9309     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Also try to drink plain Kefir. It is better than yogurt as it actually helps recolonize the intestinal tract.

Kefir has many trillions of probiotics per serving.

http://www.naturalnews.com/024477_kefir_bacteria_probiotics.html

"The yeast in kefir is able to deal effectively with pathogenic yeasts in the body."

Posts: 819 | From East Coast | Registered: Apr 2009  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
mysteryillness1970
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 24588

Icon 1 posted      Profile for mysteryillness1970     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Try going through your mail order service and ask if it's a tier 3 for your plan..

..best of luck, let me know if I can be of further help [Smile]

Posts: 166 | From USA | Registered: Feb 2010  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Lymetoo
Moderator
Member # 743

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Lymetoo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I said "are you sure cause I read differently" and he looks it up and says "oh, look at that, you are right, you can't take them both together".

That's funny.. well, sorta!! [Smile]

kitty.. I did make my own kefir once. It didn't really seem to help. I know for a fact that the store bought kind won't help me... way too much sugar content!!

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

Posts: 95723 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Lymetoo
Moderator
Member # 743

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Lymetoo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by mysteryillness1970: Try going through your mail order service and ask if it's a tier 3 for your plan..


What's a tier 3??

I think my insurance would be just as expensive as paying outright for it. They charge $50 or $80 for the more expensive meds. It costs around $86 for the powder form.

Maybe I should check though! [Wink]

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

Posts: 95723 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
mysteryillness1970
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 24588

Icon 1 posted      Profile for mysteryillness1970     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
The more expensive brand name drugs, and usually the ones your insurance company doesn't want you to get a prescription for (because their cost is higher) are also considered non-preferred. They are found in Tier 3. Tier III drugs will cost us even more than the lower tiers, usually $25 to $75 co-pay.

It saved $26 for me, every penny helps!

Posts: 166 | From USA | Registered: Feb 2010  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Lymetoo
Moderator
Member # 743

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Lymetoo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
My copay on the most expensive is $80. So it would save me $6... Not sure it's worth the hassle.

Buying the capsules for $52 was more my speed!

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

Posts: 95723 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Lymetoo
Moderator
Member # 743

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Lymetoo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I just realized that if it's a prescription, you can take it as a tax write-off. (IF you've got enough for deductions.. and I usually do.)

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

Posts: 95723 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
sammy
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13952

Icon 1 posted      Profile for sammy     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Lymetoo, you can claim supplements if your doctor prescribes them. I'm sure that your doctor has recommended probiotics for you and has this documented somewhere in your chart so you can claim the VSL#3 and Florastor cost. At least this was the rule last year when I had my taxes prepared. So save your receipts!
Posts: 5237 | From here | Registered: Nov 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Lymetoo
Moderator
Member # 743

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Lymetoo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
My tax person always tells me it's not deductible. I always save my receipts though!

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

Posts: 95723 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
mysteryillness1970
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 24588

Icon 1 posted      Profile for mysteryillness1970     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
LT, I def think it's worth the hassle b/c you're getting 900 billion in each pouch (1 lasts me a week)+ $80 (for you)= every 5 months.

2 capsules contain 225 billion and last only 30 days...then you are re-ordering and paying more shipping, again.

VSL will ship to pharmacy for free and they do all the legwork (or are supposed to anyway).

It is most definitely deductible! The IRS Publication Reference even states so. I think it's time for you to get someone who can get you all the deduction's you are entitled to...we all deserve it!!!

Posts: 166 | From USA | Registered: Feb 2010  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Lymetoo
Moderator
Member # 743

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Lymetoo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
You are so right, mystery!! I'll check into it again. I was dealing with a different dr before and his nurse told me she knew nothing about the dr writing scripts for supplements.

I think I will check into the powder (but I dont' drink juices.. how nasty is it??)

I think I'll also see about their delivering it to the pharmacy. I had some problems making sure I would be here when it was shipped last time.

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

Posts: 95723 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
   

Quick Reply
Message:

HTML is not enabled.
UBB Code is enabled.

Instant Graemlins
   


Post New Topic  New Poll  Post A Reply Close Topic   Feature Topic   Move Topic   Delete Topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:


Contact Us | LymeNet home page | Privacy Statement

Powered by UBB.classic™ 6.7.3


The Lyme Disease Network is a non-profit organization funded by individual donations. If you would like to support the Network and the LymeNet system of Web services, please send your donations to:

The Lyme Disease Network of New Jersey
907 Pebble Creek Court, Pennington, NJ 08534 USA


| Flash Discussion | Support Groups | On-Line Library
Legal Resources | Medical Abstracts | Newsletter | Books
Pictures | Site Search | Links | Help/Questions
About LymeNet | Contact Us

© 1993-2020 The Lyme Disease Network of New Jersey, Inc.
All Rights Reserved.
Use of the LymeNet Site is subject to Terms and Conditions.