LymeNet Flash: Broken tooth...dilemma

This is topic Broken tooth...dilemma in forum Medical Questions at LymeNet Flash.

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Posted by ArtistDi (Member # 2297) on :

Just when things seemed to be be going in the
right direction, I broke a piece off my back
molar.

I will have to have it checked on Monday.
Here's the thing: regular dentist said I may
need a crown, but that worries me because
bacteria could get underneath it.

Yet, I had broken a tooth a few years ago
and had an onlay put on it (this done by
a biological dentist). Long story short,
that onlay has given me the most problems
of all my teeth.

After a few months, I developed nerve pain
in that tooth, which coincided with my seizures. Now, I am not sure what to do,
because I don't want that sensitivity to be
in another tooth as well. Had two big named
biological dentists look at the onlay, and said it wasn't the tooth, but nerve pain.
Don't want that again.

I am hoping maybe something may be bonded to
the tooth.

Any experiences with onlays or crowns. I
seem to recall crowns are a no-no with lyme.

Posted by dontlikeliver (Member # 4749) on :

I have two crowns and was sick before and sick after, did not notice any change from having them.

DLL

Posted by minoucat (Member # 5175) on :

don't know if this is an option for you, Di, but the hubby just had a back molar yanked rather than mess with it. No problems at all post yanking, and no pain either. We were both expecting him to be totally prostrated.

I, on the other hand, have had several crowns. All but one seem to be completely fine; one recent one continues to be occaisionally sensitive and I'm trying to figure out if it's just tissue shrinkage as the dentist says, or if I have to do something about it.

Good luck. This is one of the most wearing things about LD for me -- how freighted with concern even the smallest decisions become.

Posted by GiGi (Member # 259) on :

Dental work done while infection is lingering below is often the problem. No matter how beautiful the crown or the onlay.

Pulling a tooth without thoroughly removing the infected bone around it, into depth, is not a good thing in the long run. Most dentists just yank the tooth out and tell us the body would do the rest. It does - but not to our benefit.

For many Lyme patients, this is where the major problems are - in the mouth, in the old wisdom teeth sites and back molars. Meds can't get there - bacteria, viruses, fungi, etc. thrive.

I cannot tell you how often I have heard it said "see the dentist n o w - " - a dentist that understands the problems.

I posted this yesterday on another thread, and as usual I got hell from the resident expert dentist. I really could care less. It may not be quite pertinent here - but in general it explains what we face with infections in the mouth and the jawbone, etc.
http://www.thehealingjournal.com/articles/articlev11a02.htm
http://www.altcorp.com/AffinityLaboratory/beyondthemouth.htm

So here it is - more information than you have time to read. But at least it gives you a hint as to one of the things you might want to have a look at if you just can't get well. The devastation caused by dental infection toxins is as bad as metal toxicity.

My husband's and my recovery from Lyme was not simply caused by a miracle or by a good doctor, but by the fact that we were made aware of the dental toxins that were killing us and we did something about it, whether we could afford it or even like the idea ------

Take care.

[This message has been edited by GiGi (edited 05 June 2005).]

Posted by zipzip (Member # 6226) on :

hey di!

glad to hear that tooth aside things are going right!

i don't think there is a definitive proper answer to your question.

make the most informed decision you can and hope that your homework, coinciding with your intuition, is the right choice.

i know a dentist who has lyme (and after 4 yrs is in full remission mind you) if you want his phone number and opinion.

i'm sure he will be glad to answer your question.

z ya.... zip

Posted by mlkeen (Member # 1260) on :

My dentist has re-built broken areas of tooth with filling material. I tend to have wider fillings in the middle of the teeth and then the tooth corners break off. The dentist used to prefer the metal stuff, of course not recommended now, because it was stronger. I have one like that and two of the white tooth colored material. None have given me trouble afterward. None were near the nerve but on the edge of the tooth. They were all on the inside of the tooth too.

Good luck.

Mel

Posted by beachcomber (Member # 5320) on :

Di:

I just went through months of dental work for 2 cracked teeth. I had the same concerns you have and got a few opinions.

Here's what I ended up doing: I had both teeth thoroughly cleaned and temporary crowns put on. Every 2 weeks I had the crowns removed and had the tooth and gum cleaned and tested for bacteria and had the nerves tested to make sure everything was still working fine.

I got one tooth filled and crowned and it was fine. The other continued to cause nerve pain. So, I went to a root canal specialist who actually advised against root canal. He suggested I crown it and see if the nerve pain starts to go away. So, I did.

The first 2 weeks were torture. But, now the pain in my face and jaw have gone away and the tooth is no longer sensitive. The crown took the pressure off of the tooth and helps to keep it clean.

I do floss and rinse with peroxide ot tea tree oil or Biotene. I do brush 3 times a day minimum. Hygiene is important.

The Endodontist said that healthy bone, tissue and nerves will often heal themselves. He had worked with other Lyme patients who did not fare as well and he pulled their teeth, rather than do root canals. The best possible scenario is that a good supply of clean blood is getting to the teeth all the time. That's tough when you are ill.

I would try a temporary crown and see how that feels. That's just my opinion. However, once you prep a tooth for a temporary, there is no going back. It is either a permanent crown or extraction after that.

All of this has nothing to do with mercury poisoning. It is just a matter of saving a healthy tooth, whether you have a mercury issue or not. It is a good idea to be on abx when the tooth is being cleaned, because of the bacteria.

Good luck.

Posted by docdave130 on :

bonding is the best choice depending on the area of the tooth that is broken. if it is an area of biting force inside cusps( bumps) of the upper teeth and outside cusps of the lower teeth then bonding won't hold the biting force and a crown is the choice.
a crown on a back molar should be porcelan to gold or all gold and the margins(edges of the crown should be above the gum if you are concerned about bacteria.
also of major concern is the cement used to cement the crowns and inlays, that could be a major cause of problems for the future.
the new composite cements and glass ionomer cements on vital alive nerves , when the crown is cemented the cement goes down the microscopic tubules of the dentin and can inflame the pulp or nerve of the tooth. this is almost 95% true of glass ionomer cements on vital teeth, no glass ionomers.
tell the ddds to either use temp cement if you are concerned about bacteria, or and old cement like durelon. durelon was the standard for 25 years and nobody had problems with it. new technology is not always better. ask the biologic( quack) dds if he used glass ionomer cement on the inlay, if he did you may have a good lawsuit against him.
By the way crowns are much more cleanable and bacterial resistant than inlays and onlays. there are twice the surface area of margins on inlays and onlays.
best bet bonding if possible with pin if necessary, if not go the temp crown route for 6 months then permanent crown.
make sure the dds uses a bleach solution or clorahexidine solution to clean the tooth prior to filling or crown cementation. this will sterilize the tooth under the restoration.

Posted by bg2711 (Member # 1865) on :

Diane,

Will the chemicals/adhesives add to your MCS problems? I am very nervous of dental materials with the MCS stuff. You have a tough decision to make. Hope you come up with a plan that will work best for you. Barb

Posted by docdave130 on :

excuse my ignorance but what the heck is MCS stuff?

Posted by bg2711 (Member # 1865) on :

Hi Docdave,

MCS is multiple chemical sensitivities. Some of us have problems with extreme sensitivities to chemicals. For me it hits my central nervous system and I feel horrible when exposed to toxic materials thanks to the Lyme.

There are several of us on this board with this problem. Hope this helps answer your question.

Barb

[This message has been edited by bg2711 (edited 06 June 2005).]

Posted by ArtistDi (Member # 2297) on :

I am in a quandry and a funk. I saw my regular dentist today and feels I need a crown becausethe tooth chipped off the right back molar. Yet I feel like the tooth could
still be salvaged, and he says not because I
grind my teeth. (I have been wearing my
mouth guard too.)

I would like to bypass a crown or an onlay,
as I am very allergic to different materials.
This whole thing has given me a headache.

I will check with a biological dentist and see what he says as they do dental compatibility testing, etc. I am also afraid of the mobility of the mercury and what that
will do to my system.

I keep thinking...why now?...why this? I
should know better than to question by now.

Sigh.

Thanks for all your insight, and I will ask
more questions. I just cringe at the thought
of going through this again...phobic about
dentists, especially with chemical sensitivity.

The expenses alone give me headaches.

Thanks again, all.

Posted by docdave130 on :

diane : you should not be allergic to all gold crown. gold is the most inert material on the planet. i t is very unlikely that you should be allergic to 18 kt or above dental gold.
the problem is theymust use an old cement that is more biocompatible than the new composite or glass ionomer cements.
Barb: i didn't know what mcs was, this is the first i've heard of in on the lymenet.
thanks for letting me know without too much embarsment(see i can't even spell and with a doctorate degree).
i have had this problem on an off over the years prior to dx 5 years ago and before.
i am many sensitive the organic smelling compounds, ie latex paint, paint removers, oil based paints (tried to take up painting pictures after disabity and retirement but could not stand the smell of the paints so had to stop, bad headaches for days.
didn't know you guys had a name for this.
since my many treatments my sense of smell has increased ten fold and i can smell a cigarette a block away, which is real bad because my wife smoke outside but i can smell it thru the thermopane glass.i guess lossing my sense of touch and some of my sight increased the smell sensation who knows.anybody else with this issue also?????

Posted by bg2711 (Member # 1865) on :

HI Docdave,

Yes, your problem with latex, paints, smoke is exactly what some of us have with the heightened sense of smell. It is overwhelming and debilitating for sure. See you knew what mcs was just didn't have a name for it. LOL Sorry you have the same troubles.

It isn't fun thats for sure.

Di,

Sorry you have to go through all this. I know it is so scary knowing that whatever may be placed in your mouth could cause you more troubles than you already had.

I ran into the same thing a few months back. Now I am scared to address dental problems because of the toxic substances used and having the mcs. Good luck.

Barb

Posted by docdave130 on :

you know that if you can find a good dds and a good allergist, they can run skin tests on dental materials to see it you are allergic just like grass and pollen.
they tape a patch of material or if liquid a small injection under the skin and in 4 days viola either a red patch or nothing.
i have run at least 20 of these skin tests in my years of dental practice, so i know it can and should be done if the is a question of MPH, OR MSG OR GPR, OR MCS.

Posted by docdave130 on :

up

Posted by ConnieMc (Member # 191) on :

I am getting a crown/root canal yanked in a few weeks as I obviously have an infection under it. It has been uncomfortable ever since I had it 3 years ago. Funny thing is I told the traditional dentist that it hurt ever since, and he just said "not possible as there is no root there". And he would not help me with the tooth pain.

Another funny thing, my Lyme had been in somewhat of a remission prior to that root canal, but I relapsed badly as soon as the root canal was done.

I may eventually get the metals removed, but no $$$ now. But I am convinced that dental problems are not as easily addressed as the general dental community thinks they are.

Some dentists are better then others. Our family dentist of 15 years really screwed up. My teeth never looked that clean after a cleaning, but my new biological dentist does a much better job. Our old dentist also put a crown on my 14 year old daughter instead of putting resin on to build up an undersized tooth, which was what he said he was going to do. He never even asked if he could do it, even though I was in the waiting room 30 feet away. We threatened to sue, and we walked away not paying for the unauthorized work. But worries me to death that this same incompetent dentist put a crown on her tooth. Wish now we had sued him. As if she has problems, it will be "too bad, so sad" for her. What a crook that dentist was. Guess he thought I would just pay that $900 without question. But he was wrong.

Look at your dentist very closely, and ask questions. Even if they aren't considered a "biological" dentist, there are great differences in quality out there.

Posted by maxima (Member # 4615) on :

I didn't see this post before posting mine. I had root canal done on one molar. They did it over 2 sessions. After first session the tooth was great even though she had to do another root. After she completed the root canal, I have had pain. I was told the same thing, there is no nerve, I shouldn't be feeling pain. But I am why? Also, had a flare-up when started dental work a few months ago.

Posted by GiGi (Member # 259) on :

Read here about the TOPAS test for root canals. And a lot more. http://www.altcorp.com/AffinityLaboratory/beyondthemouth.

Good luck.

Posted by JesusisLord (Member # 5776) on :

You may find this site interesting: http://www.drshankland.com/nico.html

There is a link at this site that discusses root canals and jawbone cavitations. They can be easily diagnosed with the new cavitat ultrasound.

Posted by HaplyCarlessdave (Member # 413) on :

I feel fot all of you with dental nightmares. I, too am undergoing one such! Awhile ago I also broke a tooth- a wisdom tooth.Maybe I should just get it removed? But wouldn't they have to remove the one opposite to it? I have a couple of capped teeth, and they're definitely not totally free of problems.
The worst thing is, I can't possibly afford to have it capped, given the bushwazian rate of inflation, unless I win the lottery or something! It would probably cost twice as much as the last one; more than 1000 bucks! I wonder how much it would cost to just have them removed? Or maybe I should wash off the vice grips real good... ...
In sympathy,
DaveS