I often read in these posts, but forget where, that people with lyme don't seem to get sick from colds, flu, as others. Why? Or do I have it wrong?
I would think the compromised immune system would let in everything.
But I do know that I haven't had a cold or any illness in many years now.
Can anyone clarify? Thanks
Posted by millymollymandy (Member # 7703) on :
Hello Islandgirl, This was a question that I recently posted on an LDN (Low Dose Naltroxone) website and a very nice lady wrote this back to me ( I must write back to her!). It goes someway to explaining your question;
'I wanted to comment on your note about having a strong immune system so that you don't get colds but maybe have lymes. You may wish to read (if you haven't already as I'm sure you are well-informed) Dr. Cheney's views about immune system dysfunction and these diseases.
I will give my flailing attempt at paraphrasing his work: he believes that lymes and viruses as mentioned above can fool the immune system. There are T1h (h stands for helper) cells and T2h cells which are part of the immune system and which fight either cell mediated (can move freely in and out of cells) or cell contained pathogens.
Things like colds are fought off by one of these T helper immune system cells (Th1, I think) while the viruses and lymes are fought by the other.
The thing is, is that the viruses and lymes produce something (maybe it is interleukin--please forgive my poor memory and understanding) which tricks the immune system so that the Th2 (I think) system becomes even more active (to fight colds, etc.), while the Th1 (I think) system becomes dampened and can't fight off the viruses/lymes.
The LDN is supposed to help change the Th2 dominance and help re-establish a healthy balance, if my understanding is correct. Then the Th1 cells can fight the lymes.'
Let's hope that if we don't get things like colds & flu we will be able to miss the bird flu scare that is currently on the horizon!
Posted by map1131 (Member # 2022) on :
I've never understood how a lyme ill body that has a suppressed immune system could not come down with every cold and flu that passed by.
By I've lived it for 6 yrs. Not one cold or flu virus. Before lyme, every winter I would have at least 2 severe colds that took weeks to get over it. Flu was a sure thing every year.
My gut feeling has been too avoid flu shots. I just had a sense they would have an adverse effect on me.
Now all this talk about this bird flu is so frightening.
Take care, Pam
Posted by map1131 (Member # 2022) on :
double post again
Posted by lymeHerx001 (Member # 6215) on :
Youre right. Ive been sick for 15 years and I havent as of late had too many bad colds.
I just feel like crap pretty much every day and have chronic symptoms.
The funny thing is I can feel when I get a cold because somehow I feel a different type of sick.
Posted by arg82 (Member # 161) on :
While I don't get sick as much as I might expect, when I do get sick, though, I am sick for months before I get over it, be it a cold or the flu or whatever.
For me, I think there are a few reasons I don't get sick that often. 1) I'm on antibiotics most of the time so that takes care of some of the infections out there. 2) I'm not up to going out and doing much so I avoid a lot of germs. 3) When I do go out, I'm careful to wash my hands well when I get home and carry the antibacterial hand wash in my purse all the time.
--Annie
Posted by Lonestartick (Member # 2151) on :
Hi Islandgirl,
That's a very astute observation and you have it correct. This is the way my doctor explained it to me.
As a result of the intracellular infection (think Lyme & co-infections), the body responds by producing interferon. The interferon triggers many cytokines, but here we are concerned with the antiviral pathway, which responds by producing Rnase-l.
Rnase-l breaks down viral RNA, which stops the virus from reproducing. In a normal healthy patient this enzyme is limited. It's only produced as long as it's needed. It gets switched on, it does it's job, and then it gets switched off again. When it doesn't get switched off normally, you have a problem. In some patients this response runs amuck and the body starts producing a low molecular weight Rnase-l that is much more active. It doesn't shut off quickly like it's supposed to and it consumes ATP at an enormous rate. Dr. Cheney, a CFS doctor, has described this enzyme as an ATP black hole. This is why patients are so fatigued. Drained of ATP, our cells can't function properly.
Rnase-l is the reason why you can be so sick and so exhausted all the time, but at the same time, you aren't able to catch the normal viral infections that your healthy friends and family members get and get over. Once you are successfully treated for Borrelia and co-infections, you should begin to be able to catch and recover from the occasional virus.
If you spend enough time in the forums, you will see that the chronic Lyme patients tend to celebrate the ability to contract a cold or flu as a sign of returning health and an immune system that is functioning more normally. You wouldn't believe how happy I was when I caught my first flu bug 6 months into the MP. It didn't even matter to me that I contracted it from my niece at our wedding, or that I lost the first 3 days of my honeymoon to it. It was so exciting to finally run a fever and recover again in a few days. It was the first time I had caught a normal cold and thrown it off in over 15 years, despite years of high dose ABX for Lyme and co-infections. That was the experience that convinced me that I was finally on the road to wellness. Posted by aiden424 (Member # 7633) on :
I catch everything and it takes me weeks to get over it. It has gotten much worse since my grandson started pre-school and now school. He only lives a few blocks away so I see him a lot and he seems to have lots of snotty noses which I then get. Kathy
Posted by Christine202 (Member # 6158) on :
As I got better from Lyme the more the colds and viruses started comming on..... NOw I seem to have plateued a bit.
I still catch just abot everything, but my immune system is starting to deal with it better.
When I was very ill with Lyme I hardly ever got sick.
Posted by islandgirl (Member # 5914) on :
Wow, thanks so much for all these replies.
Ya won't believe this: the day after I wrote this, I got a cold. Complete with runny nose, sore throat, stuffed head. My first cold in many years. (and yes, you can definately tell the difference from lyme/babs symptoms and this)
So, now I can rejoice! What timing, God has a sense of humour.
Thanks for all your insightful replies. Love ya, Islandgirl Posted by DanP (Member # 7501) on :
I was on Ketek for 8 months. Started Omnicef in September. Started a Chinese herbal therapy on Thursday 10/13..
Guess what? Starting Sunday 10/16, first cold in years! Sore throat, runny nose, achy, phlegmy. But the back pain I've had since July of '04 is almost gone.
Also, was beset by fall allergies to ragweed for many years starting at age 29 (now 51). Past 3-4 years, no fall allergy response! Now wonder if herbal therapy is working and can expect fall allergies next year. Rather ragweed than Lyme.
DanP
Posted by duke77 (Member # 5051) on :
In the last 15 years I can count how many times I have gotten sick on one hand. I have wondered about that myself. I never have gotten the flu shot.
Posted by HopeHelps (Member # 7781) on :
This is interesting, I cannot figure this out. Simply because colds and flus are viruses, so to not get a virus is interesting. Lyme is a bacteria, albeit a stealth one, so we can't get rid of it, but aren't susceptible to viruses? I wonder. I have had a raging lyme reoccurence for the last 10 months and have not been sick once, but my family has had cold after cold after cold. (young kids) Could my body be fighting off viruses? Wouldn't that make us better off for the bird flu? A lot of what you wrote above is too technical for my pea brain.
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