Has anyone tried Quercetin, Bromelain or Nattokinase to help with pain?
The doctor who is treating my autonomic nervous system disfunction is hoping I can reduce my vicodin use and stop using Flexeril, because he thinks it's adding to my ANS disfunction.
He recommended Quercetin as something that could replace the Vicodin. Anyone have success with this? Most of my pain is mucle and tendon pain.
The Bromelain is to help with a current herx from Zith. I've got obvious inflammation in my hands and feet, and within hours of starting Zith noticed liquid in some of my bigger joints like my knees.
The Nattokinase he said could replace the Flexeril. He said something about the muscle pain I have being caused by the thickening of blood and fibers caused by Lyme.
[ 20. August 2006, 12:53 PM: Message edited by: Aniek ]
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
He said something about the muscle pain I have being caused by the thickening of blood and fibers caused by Lyme.
I think you mean "fibrinogen"...that is related to hypercoagulation, which most of us have. Some know it and some don't.
I have had SOME pain relief from the enzymes like nattokinase, but nothing like I do from the mangosteen. Not even close.
I hope you can find something to get you off the vicodin, because it can permanently damage your liver and kidneys.
Posted by serendipity (Member # 8474) on :
Hi Aniek,
I have been using protease enzymes since the beginning of my treatment. A year ago, my hands and feet were dusky brown and cold from fibrin build up and the subsquent hypoperfusion. I had a stabbing pain in my hands and feet from the poor blood flow.
At the time, I was on Bromelain and Serrazyme. Bromelain on odd days and Serrazyme on even days. My doctor switched me to lumbrokinase as it is more effective (by ARG) and within a week my symptoms resovled. Since then I have used lumbrokinase alternating with Serrazyme and haven't had the symptoms again.
I could visibly see and feel the effects of the poor perfusion to my hands and feet, and wondered how my internal organs were being affected at the time. So I am consistant with thaking the enzymes.
I can't take Nattokinase as it has soy. My doctor uses the following enzymes with good results (usually on a rotation schedule): Lumbrokinase, Carnivora, Serrazyme, and Bromelain. They are listed in order of most effective to least effective
[ 20. August 2006, 12:58 PM: Message edited by: serendipity ]
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
quote:Originally posted by serendipity: I can't take Nattokinase as it has soy.
I guess I'm soy sensitive too, then. I had a bad reaction to the Natto. I also use the lumbro and add in Rutozyme for good measure.
Posted by Aniek (Member # 5374) on :
Thanks for the quick replies. We'll see how these go over the next few weeks, and if they don't work I'll keep all your suggestions in mind.
The zith pain is so bad, I'm not sure I can stop Vicodin until the herxes stop. But I'm weaning off the Flexeril.
Posted by serendipity (Member # 8474) on :
Hi Aniek and Tutu,
I haven't heard of anyone coming off pain meds after they started a just protease enzyme. There are more components to the paint than hypoperfusion, still it can help and along with other treatments you may be able to come off of the meds.
Tutu also has a good point about the vicodin and liver. Vicoden inteferes with liver function and detoxificaiton. THis results in further build of toxins. My doctor thinks that pain is in part due to increased toxin load, and therefore taking meds like vicodin exacerbates the problem. So I hope you will find other treaments to help you.
Tutu-Nattokinase is a good product, but a number of people can't tolerate the soy in it.
Posted by Aniek (Member # 5374) on :
Serendipity,
It's not just the Nattokinase to replace a pain killer. In fact, that's aimed at replacing the Flexeril which is a muscle relaxer.
My doctor thinks that the muscle relaxer might actually be making things worse now because of it's impact on my autonomic nervous system.
My doctor has had really good pain control from Quercetin following an accident. That's what he thinks might be able to replace the Vicodin.
Plus, I'm taking essential amino acids and B-12 to help my ANS. This doctor thinks the muscle pain is worsened from the ANS disfunction and that getting that back up and working in the longterm will reduce pain.
-Aniek
Posted by serendipity (Member # 8474) on :
Hi Aniek, I just assumed Quercetin was a protease enzyme like Nattokinase and Bromelin. I did a quick google search and learned that indeed it is not.
Well, keep us posted, this approach sounds interesting and promising.