Was wondering, if anybody has heard of a story of an ignorant duck or ID duck, who did not believe in chronic lyme, but ended up contracting it for theirself, and then later changed their view on it?
Just curious, as I figure it had to have happened at least once.
(I dunno if this post is even in the right forum)
Posted by randibear (Member # 11290) on :
i have heard of a doctor in texas who has lyme.
he's not supposed to be all that great but hey, i don't know.
Posted by dontlikeliver (Member # 4749) on :
Not yet, but can't wait.
Posted by bejoy (Member # 11129) on :
Didn't you know? Ducks don't get lyme. Its not endemic to their area (the inside of a hospital or clinic.)
Ducks often get lyme-type symptoms, but they are caused by other (less embarrasing) medical conditions.
A rash that looks to an LLMD like Erythema Migrans will resolve 100% of the time if treated long enough by a duck with an antifungal for ringworm.
Ducks are vegetarian as well. They never eat crow.
bejoy
P.S. I believe Dr. K. MD and his family had/have lyme, but I don't suppose he was ever quite the mallard type to begin with.
[ 06. March 2007, 08:29 PM: Message edited by: bejoy ]
Posted by ESG (Member # 4816) on :
yes, there is one I know whose daughter became very ill with Lyme and he is now a believer after being a definite non-believer!
ESG
Posted by mag (Member # 8920) on :
An MD or pharmacist in northern california had children with lyme disease --- started the hyperbaric chamber
still waiting for a duc awareness to rise to the level of "wow that must be Lyme Disease"
mags
Posted by Beverly (Member # 1271) on :
I don't know of any duck that has lyme, but boy I can't wait til that day comes!!
You are cracking me up bejoy..."Ducks are vegetarian as well. They never eat crow." LOL>>> soooo true...
Posted by ldfighter (Member # 9405) on :
quote:Originally posted by ESG: yes, there is one I know whose daughter became very ill with Lyme and he is now a believer after being a definite non-believer!
ESG, does this dr. treat patients with lyme now? (not looking for name, just curious)
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
I know one whose wife had Lyme. He now treats Lyme.
My PCP has chronic Lyme too.
Posted by chiz (Member # 10301) on :
Okay, I confess, I am medically qualified. But I didn't know anything about Lyme before my son contracted neuroborreliosis, so I guess that makes me ignorant. Lyme is less common in England and most doctors don't even know about the debate here.
My microbiologist colleague tried to warn me about "all the lies on the internet" but I observed my son's deterioration and looked at both sides of the argument and drew my own conclusions. Later I got his Igenex result - CDC positive.
My son's paediatrician in UK states that he has chronic fatigue syndrome despite no fatigue. His epsisodic leg weakness is psychosomatic!! It is so disappointing that he cannot look at the evidence dispassionately.
Three other doctors at my hospital will not talk to me because I have gone "to the other side". Other colleagues find the problems I have encountered in getting my son diagnosed and treated are almost unbelievable.
It is an absolute scandal but I am concentrating on getting my son better before I tackle the bigger political issues. One day, I hope to post his story here under the success posts.
Chiz with thanks to Dr J
Posted by psano (Member # 7785) on :
chiz,
Here's one of my favorite articles that you can share with your friends, if you like:
Microbes & Infection 2006 Sep 22; [Epub ahead of print]
Invasion of human neuronal and glial cells by an infectious strain of Borrelia burgdorferi.
* Livengood JA, * Gilmore RD Jr.
Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, Division of Vector-borne Infectious Diseases, 3150 Rampart Road, CSU Foothills Campus, Fort Collins, CO 80522, USA.
Human infection by Borrelia burgdorferi, the etiological agent for Lyme disease, can result in serious acute and late-term disorders including neuroborreliosis, a degenerative condition of the peripheral and central nervous systems.
To examine the mechanisms involved in the cellular pathogenesis of neuroborreliosis, we investigated the ability of B. burgdorferi to attach to and/or invade a panel of human neuroglial and cortical neuronal cells.
In all neural cells tested, we observed B. burgdorferi in association with the cell by confocal microscopy.
Further analysis by differential immunofluorescent staining of external and internal organisms, and a gentamicin protection assay demonstrated an intracellular localization of B. burgdorferi.
A non-infectious strain of B. burgdorferi was attenuated in its ability to associate with these neural cells, suggesting that a specific borrelial factor related to cellular infectivity was responsible for the association.
Cytopathic effects were not observed following infection of these cell lines with B. burgdorferi, and internalized spirochetes were found to be viable.
Invasion of neural cells by B. burgdorferi provides a putative mechanism for the organism to avoid the host's immune response while potentially causing functional damage to neural cells during infection of the CNS.
PMID: 17045505
I've sent this to a number of my past Drs as evidence that it isn't necessary to have abnormal labs to be sick with Lyme disease.
The ramifications of this study are huge.
1. A lack of positive laboratory evidence doesn't mean that the patient doesn't have Lyme disease.
2. You can't tell when a patient has gotten well by looking at their labs...you have to go by their signs and symptoms. At least until better testing is available.
Which raises the question, how do Drs KNOW that only 3-4 weeks of antibiotics has "cured" a patient of Lyme disease? Certainly NOT from their lab results.
Posted by david1097 (Member # 3662) on :
The reallity is that most the ID's DO KNOW THE WHOLE STORY WITH LYME. The problem is that they don't want to fight the fight against the "experts". If one of their freinds or family gets it or is found to have late stage, you can be pretty sure that they will treat it agressively, even under a different name if need be.
This is the problem we are facing. If the fraud being perpetrated by the IDSA panel finaly gets wide press then maybe this nightmare will be over. The arrogance permiates the air every time these guys appear, such as in the Dr. J case or when they write an article. It was the same sort that tried to kill the idea of H pylori. It took almost 25 years for that to finally be recongnized. Now what do those 4$$holes that tried to kill that one go??? On to some other idea to try to kill I would think.
Posted by bejoy (Member # 11129) on :
Chiz, my heart goes out to you.
It's so hard to stand up for what you have to believe in to save your child, while facing ostracization from your peers.
You have had such courage to trust what you are seeing, despite lack of support from your medical community.
bejoy
Posted by ESG (Member # 4816) on :
a resounding YES he does treat Lyme now, after years of not believing in it - unfortunately he is also now in semi-retirement and not taking new patients.
![[bonk]](graemlins/bonk.gif)
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
soooo true...