I want everyone to know that you should NOT take any form of artemisin or its derivitives...it is not supposed to be in the united states..it was and is used in malaria only and I mean only if there was no other choice and you would die..this is not a drug but a peroxide based compound of a plant that is really a drug..it is not FDA approved and any doctor who gives this to you should be sued..artemisin affects the brain stem of all mammals no matter what the dose..it causes a die off of brain cells in the brain stem..it takes about three weeks before you know what the damage is..artemisin can also induce death by killing off brain cells that control breathing and blood pressure..this is no joke..if you need the info on how I know this my what my source is then I will let you know..just email me...again art can kill and for all you none believers that have taken it for so long well all I can say is dont do it anymore..when this reaction happens to you there will be no one to help you and you will be stuck..please beleave me and dont do it as you cant turn back after the first pill and the damage is done.. eric
Posted by trueblue (Member # 7348) on :
Post the documentation!
Anyone can say anything, this is the internet, after all.
Show the proof. Thanks
Posted by polar blast (Member # 9142) on :
look up the doctor stephen toovey toxicology letters on artemisnin..you will see the lab reports on art and it may surprise you that they used low doses..anyway check it out... eric
Posted by polar blast (Member # 9142) on :
by the way I dont need to prove anything to you true blue..if you dont believe me then dont..I am not some idiot..let it be known..it is you who has not done your homework on art.. eric
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
quote:Originally posted by trueblue: Post the documentation!
Worked for me!
Posted by meg (Member # 22) on :
And Me!
Posted by DolphinLady (Member # 6275) on :
Worked great for me too.
Posted by wchun (Member # 11957) on :
I've been taking it and my brain has been functioning much better.
Posted by Penn92 (Member # 9207) on :
Working for me so far. Much less neuro symptoms, certainly not killing brain cells that I can tell.
Polar, I remember you had a really bad reaction to art and I'm sorry for your experience. Would you please post links to any good info here on the board? I'd like to look at anything relevant and decide for myself whether art is dangerous or not.
Thanks.
Posted by micul (Member # 6314) on :
For anyone that has any doubts about the effectiveness and safety of this herb, see this previous thread. We've been through this many times before:
[ 15. August 2007, 02:11 PM: Message edited by: Jenifer ]
Posted by clpgotlyme (Member # 7875) on :
I have done 3 three week courses of Artemisinin and hae only gotten better. I am starting another course this week. I have seen no side effects at all. I cannot tolerate any other meds for Babesia. Cindy
Posted by lpkayak (Member # 5230) on :
it has helped me with no herx or side effects-only get/feel better.
probably doesn't get every last bug and i do have to repeat every few years (lyme complex over 20 yrs now)
but MUCH better results than mepron zith and couldn't do quinine
Posted by Badtick (Member # 9794) on :
It worked for me too. My brain functions much better on account of it. Who needs brain cells anyway.
Posted by listenswithcare (Member # 10719) on :
Well I don't take this herb, but I got curious. Here is a reference:
Robin
Posted by CaliforniaLyme (Member # 7136) on :
YES YES YES!!!
Artemisia DOES cause brainstem damage but ONLY IN OVERDOSE!!! You should never take too much- but is is VERY VERY SAFE in moderate doses.
Brainstem damage will NEVER regenerate and the two effects noted have been problems with balance and dizziness.
So NEVER take too much!!!! it IS true it CAN do this- but only if you OVERDOSE on it!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by dontlikeliver (Member # 4749) on :
In that case, what would be considered an OVERDOSE?
Posted by CaliforniaLyme (Member # 7136) on :
More than what the bottle says!! I have read probably every article on this on pubmed and it is DOSE DEPENDENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Normal dosages for malaria- and thAT are on bottles of Art sold that I have seen- will NOT DO THIS!!
The studies have shown it is DOSE DEPENDENT and it happens when the rats are given lots and lots and lots of it... There is ONE case of a person being treated for breast cancer who took it and got this- it is considered a very safe drug!!!
Basically- If you took a hundred versus 2 of almost ANY drug you'd be in trouble!!!
I am VERY wary of alternative stuff but I am VERY pro Artemisia- in 8 years of support groups we have not had one toxicity problem locally and hundreds of people have taken it- and been HELPED by it!!! It is considered a new cancer wonder drug partially because of the absence of side effects!!!
Here's a fun article re Art & Toxicity and even it concludes that there have been no human cases that demonstrate this as a problem- http://www.who-umc.org/graphics/4467.pdf
YES it is GUARANTEED to happen if you overdose yourself with it!!! So don't do that!!!!
If you swallow 300 aspirins it doesn't help either!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Take what it says on the bottle!!!!!!!
Best wishes, Sarah
p.s. I would treat my child with it at rec'd dosages!!!!!!!!!!!! I believe it is VERY VERY safe at usual dosages.
Posted by DanP (Member # 7501) on :
a cocktail will kill brain cells too, but every once in a while one or two go down well....or used to anyway....
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
And you should also not continue taking it while herxing to the moon. BACK OFF, as you would with any other drug for Lyme.
I'm a firm believer in artemisinin. Won't sway me one bit.
Posted by mtnwoman (Member # 8385) on :
What doses are folks using that are helping them.
I have seen recommended Artemisinin 600mg am and pm every other day for 3d/week, x 2 weeks, then rest 2 weeks.
As I recall, Klinghardt also only uses short high dose bursts.
Posted by micul (Member # 6314) on :
Litenwithcare.
The PDF file that you listed says the same thing as the others. You have to read this stuff and pay attention to what it says. These study's lump all the Artemisinins together when they initially talk about nuerotoxicity, but if you read the reports, it is the Artemisinin derivatives of Artemether and Artensuate that can be potentially nuerotoxic when used in larger doses, not the water soluable Artemisinin that we all use here.
Posted by painted turtle (Member # 7801) on :
Art is something my doc plans to do in collaboration with mepron, zith, and one other thing.
But as I remember
Polar Blast
at one time some time ago
was having some SEVERE herxing trouble when first began taking ART
I remember that much, (at least I think I do)
And if this is the case, I don't think Polar should be attacked for sharing a warning due to
personal experience couple with research.
I personally think we all have different sensitivity levels and responses to meds.
One thing can be toxic to one and a life saver for another.
Better safe than sorry and I appreciate tha warning Polar Blast,
I also appreciate all the evidence from personal experience from everyone who has faith in ART.
They just executed the director of medicine quality (like FDA) in China for passing of fake and dangerous, life threatening medicine. Not that this is where ART comes from....where DOES it come from???
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
quote:Originally posted by mtnwoman: What doses are folks using that are helping them.
I took 200-300 mg per day with zithromax. I believe I took this for 2 months.
Posted by kelmo (Member # 8797) on :
I agree, Polar had sent me private warnings. His reaction was scary, and I weighed that heavily when considering adding that herb.
I don't know what the combo was that contributed to his reaction, that should be taken in account.
So, I appreciate his warning, but I do have the choice to go ahead based on the experience of the majority of those who have tried it.
Kelmo
Posted by hopingandpraying (Member # 9256) on :
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I read many old posts while researching about Art and Polar Blast had a reaction to it when it was combined with fish oil. According to what I read, fish oil potentiates or makes the Art two times stronger!
I'm still trying to figure out which is to be used: Artemisia (whole plant) or Artemisinin (synthetic derivative). Would someone please clarify (Penn92 already replied to my other post). Thanks.
Posted by MariaA (Member # 9128) on :
For malaria (somewhat similar to babesia generally), it's hard to get enough artemesia down (either as a tea or a tincture) to have a permanent effect- many studies on malaria show that permanent eradication of the malaria parasite is dose-dependent and it's more difficult to achieve that with artemesia whole herb itself.
However, artemesinin has more potential side effects than the whole herb does, according to one of Stephen Buhner's non-Lyme books (he recommends artemesinin in the Healing Lyme book however).
Buhner now recommends cryptolepis (also spelled cryptolepsis) which has been studied for it's malaria treatment effects.
I don't have babesia, but when my boyfriend got malaria, we tried all three (under my LLMD's supervision- artemesinin is standard therapy for malaria), and didn't have lasting results with either of the artemesia or artemesinin, until we added the cryptolepis and some other herbs from abroad.
Posted by Parisa (Member # 10526) on :
Okay, so has anyone here taken fish oil with their artemisinin?
My husband will probably start taking fish oil (once we get back his Vit D labs) because he has osteopenia from all of the lovely prednisone he took last year.
He's been taking artemisinin three days on/three days off since December without any problems.
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
quote:Originally posted by Parisa: Okay, so has anyone here taken fish oil with their artemisinin?
Nope. Not me.
Posted by lymebytes (Member # 11830) on :
Hi, This was the first thing I was "prescribed" and cleared brain fog for me almost immediately.
I did look up the information you mentioned. I would not panic though, as all herbs, vitamins, foods, medications etc., carry risks.
It appears (from what I read) that the animals in the tests studied were the ones with bad reactions. Many times animals will react completley different to a "drug", food, herb than humans would.
For instance ibuprofen is toxic in animals, simple foods such onions and chocolate are toxic to dogs.
The animal studies do not look good, but more human study needs to be done to be more conclusive.
Also remember that there is no FDA approval on any herbal (plant) or homeopathic drug that I am aware of.
Thank you for the warning, but I believe anyone on Art should consult with their LLMD regarding these studies - here it is if you'd like to print and show it to your doctor, this a short version: http://trophort.com/011/776/011776864.html
![[Wink]](wink.gif)