Can anyone refresh my memory about 41kDa? I seem to remember that if that is positive there is no question you are positive?
Posted by mobfarias (Member # 13000) on :
I just found out this is what showed up on my Western Blot. I was told by my PCP that I did not have Lyme, but I am having alot of symptoms with it. I have seen that 41 KD is the specific weight of the tail. It was also stated as the most common test result.
Do a google search for "western blot 41 kilodalton" Site after site about lyme will come back.
I have an app. with an LLMD next Wed.
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
Read this entire link....near the bottom is additonal info on band 41....It is not to be ignored!!
wiserforit
Posted by James Marschner (Member # 13073) on :
Yeah, the band 41 is supposed to represent ab's against bacterial flagella. Syphillis and a dozen or more other bacteria have a flagellum.
I wonder how many (Bacteria w/ flagella.) are common infections in people?
Posted by Aligondo Bruce (Member # 6219) on :
Look, on lyme WB, the only bacteria that have been shown to cross react with the blot at 41 KdA are leptospirosis, syphilis, relapsing fever, and oral spirochetes. usually oral spirochetes only when a gross infective gum disease process is present.
All other flagellated bacteria DO NOT cross react at 41 Kda. Now, there are reports that EBV can cause positivity, but this has NOT been systematically studied, and has only been anecdotally reported AFAIK.
Posted by Geneal (Member # 10375) on :
Heres one for you.
My neighbor who lives down the street, has a history of tick bites and bulls-eye rashes. (30yrs plus)
He has been duly informed of Lyme, etc. by myself and my neighbor (RN with Lyme).
His wife started feeling fatigued with joint pain, etc.
They both went to our LLMD.
Unfortunately, although I told my neighbor to take a picture of his bulls-eye rash, he didn't.
Both had Western Blots done.
His came back with only band 41.
Hers came back CDC positive for IgM and IgG.
He has many more Lyme specific symptoms than she does.
He believes that Igenex switched their blood and gave the wrong results.
Retested yesterday.
In a phone conference with my LLMD two days ago,
We discussed bands, etc.
Although I wished I were CDC positive (not likely to happen with Quest testing),
I only had one band show up. IgM band 23.
My LLMD said that some of the sickest patients he has seen with Lyme had some of the fewest bands.
The number of bands does not equate to how ill you are.
It is helpful, but not necessary for a Lyme diagnosis.
It is just a sign that your immune system is posting a response.
Some people, especially those with long standing infections, often have negative WB's.
May want to prime the immune system so to speak.
Igenex recommends 28 days of antibiotics. Stopping for ten days and retesting.
Best chance for getting more positive bands.
Hugs,
Geneal
Posted by treepatrol (Member # 4117) on :
Section of Immunobiology, Yale University School of Medicine, New Haven, Connecticut 06510.
The earliest humoral response in patients infected with Borrelia burgdorferi, the agent of Lyme disease, is directed against the spirochete's 41-kDa flagellar antigen. In order to map the epitopes recognized on this antigen, 11 overlapping fragments spanning the flagellin gene were cloned by polymerase chain reaction and inserted into an Escherichia coli expression vector which directed their expression as fusion proteins containing glutathione S-transferase at the N terminus and a flagellin fragment at the C terminus. Affinity-purified fusion proteins were assayed for reactivity on Western blots (immunoblots) with sera from patients with late-stage Lyme disease. The same immunodominant domain was bound by sera from 17 of 18 patients. This domain (comprising amino acids 197 to 241) does not share significant homology with other bacterial flagellins and therefore may be useful in serological testing for Lyme disease.
Most troubling, Steere chose to make 20% of his control - 25 serum samples - serum derived from syphilis patients. While this group formed 20% of the control, the disease's annual incidence in the United States is about 3 cases per 100,000 - an incidence of far less, by a multiple of 300, than 1%. This statistical manipulation dramatically impacted the importance of the 41 KdA band on blotting, because syphilis cross reacts with Lyme blots at 41 Kda due to their both possessing a key flagellar potein structure. It has since enabled Steere and his cronies to confabulate that seroreactivity to the 41 kDa antigen is 'normal', when in fact it is largely only seen in advanced spirochetal infection - usually only in gingival infections when visible pus-filled pockets are present.
The distinction is especially important because the lyme disease bacterium has since been discovered to regulate the expression of most of its surface proteins in a differential fashion, varying throughout infection according to stage, tissue type, temperature, and even dissolved oxygen level. Flagellin, however - the key protein in question at 41 KdA - is constitutively {always} expressed, being absolutely necessary for borrelia survival at any stage of infection. Thus, in many ways it is the most important indicator of exposure or infection, latent or active. From 41+kda wiki
IMMUNOLOGIC TESTING
B. burgdorferi sensu stricto is a complex bacterium with numerous immunogenic lipids, proteins, lipoproteins, and carbohydrate antigens on its surface and outer membrane, as well as within the cytoplasm. These antigens offer a wide array of potential targets for immunoserologic testing. Among the most important antigens are the outer surface proteins OspA to -G, the 41-kDa flagellin protein, and a number of heat shock proteins. Some antigens, such as OspA, are lipoproteins expressed by B. burgdorferi sensu lato when the organism resides in the unfed tick vector but are downregulated after a blood meal and upon entry into a human or other mammalian host. The 23-kDa OspC lipoprotein is a highly immunogenic antigen which demonstrates considerable variation, a situation analogous to the variable membrane proteins expressed by other Borrelia species. Although the three genospecies of B. burgdorferi sensu lato express generally similar antigens, significant differences do occur; these differences complicate development of a single immunoserologic assay that is optimal for laboratory testing for LD that has resulted from infection with any one of the genospecies (5, 21, 26). from jcm,asm,org Posted by CaliforniaLyme (Member # 7136) on :
Wow!!! I can't believe I have never come across you before beacuse you have posted on & off here for a few years now a dozen times or so total.
Do you think you could change your login since I have had this one for years longer? It is probably confusing to people who think we are the same. In fact, it explains why a few people have said I posted what I didn't and were so sure about it!!!!!!!!!!!!