My son just got his IgeneX Test results, I am a little confused.
WesternBlot
Bands Positive IgM 31 ++++ 93+
Negative IgG
I would think IgG would be positive if IgM is positive...weird.
Are bands 31 and 93 suggestive of Lyme??
My son is being treated by Dr. J in CT
Posted by feelfit (Member # 12770) on :
How long has your son been symptomatic?
The reason that I ask is because band 31++++ is suggestive that he has had the disease for quite some time.
Both bands 31 and 93 are Bb specific. The now defunct Lyme vaccine was made from band 31...the vaccine was withdrawn because it made many folks symptomatic.
Read Dr C's Western Blot explanation at the top of this page to get a complete explanation.
Hope this helps somewhat, Feelfit
Posted by UnexpectedIlls (Member # 15144) on :
HI FeelFit
Thank you for replying so quickly!!
My was was bitten by a tick about 5 years ago and just became symptomatic about a year ago.
I was very interested that he would show up IgM and not IgG
But than I just figures it activated in his body so it would show up IgM
I was reading that band 31 has some sort of cross reactivity that could be from a virus....is this true??
Thank you
Posted by UnexpectedIlls (Member # 15144) on :
HI FeelFit
Thank you for replying so quickly!!
My son was was bitten by a tick about 5 years ago and just became symptomatic about a year ago.
I was very interested that he would show up IgM and not IgG
But than I just figures it activated in his body so it would show up IgM
I was reading that band 31 has some sort of cross reactivity that could be from a virus....is this true??
Thank you
Posted by feelfit (Member # 12770) on :
5 years, that would make sense for the 31++++ then.
I'm not sure about 31 cross reacting with viruses. I *thought* that it could only appear as an antibody because of Bb...I'm not sure though.
Timica would be the one to answer this question for you, she is very versed on viruses.
Feelfit
Posted by Geneal (Member # 10375) on :
Band 31 is OspA specific to bb.
Sorry about your son. Please get him to a Lyme Literate Medical Doctor.
Hugs,
Geneal
Posted by UnexpectedIlls (Member # 15144) on :
Thank you
My son is being treated by Dr J in Connecticut!!!
Posted by KS (Member # 12549) on :
Go to the Igenex website and take a look at the "CONFIRMATION TEST". If I recall, band 31 can be false positive due to a viral infection. There is some further guidance there regarding interpretation of results.
You are correct thought that one would expect to see the same band show up in the IgG but with this testing, there are no guarantees.
Glad you are taking him to Dr. J but continue to do your homework in the interim...I think you are asking good questions!!
Posted by UnexpectedIlls (Member # 15144) on :
Thanks KS
I just looked over that test
My son tested Negative to EBV and CMV, so I wonder if there would be anything else to cause a false positve???
He is very symptomatic and responding to treatment with ABX.
It is just so hard seeing my son ill, It is hard enough being an adult and being as ill as I am, never mind seeing my son go through it and not being able to really help him because I am so sick....
I just wish he wasnt sick , so I guess I am looking for anything to prove otherwise
He also did test high for strep titre, but they said that is very common in lyme (especially for children)
And the saga continues
Posted by KS (Member # 12549) on :
The primary thing that matters at this point is that he is responding to antibiotics...making a virus highly unlikely to be making him sick/giving a false positive.
There are better days ahead...
Posted by jmo (Member # 13141) on :
I had almost the same test results... and was wondering the same thing!
31++++ and 58+.
I did test the highest on a PCR for babesia. When I went off my medicine for babesia and tried to treat Lyme specifically I back slided badly... first I thought it was a herx so I waited 3 months until I started having night sweats, arm numbness and air hunger again to switch back (way to long). Within 1 dose of bactrim/malarone, I felt 75% better and my symptoms are subsiding again. It's amazing. Lyme doesn't seem to be my issue. Maybe babesia is related to the ++++ on the 31?
Posted by UnexpectedIlls (Member # 15144) on :
Hello
My son tested negative for Co-infections, but that was also through quest so I dont know how reliable that is?
All I know is I cant stop crying...I am hopeless and cant take being ill or my son being ill another day.
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
From Dr C's Western Blot explanation:
"With most infections, your immune system first forms IgM antibodies, then in about 2 to 4 weeks, you see IgG antibodies. In some infections, IgG antibodies may be detectable for years.
Because Borrelia burgdorferi is a chronic persistent infection that may last for decades, you would think patients with chronic symptoms would have positive IgG Western blots.
But actually, more IgM blots are positive in chronic borreliosis than IgG. Every time Borrelia burgdorferi reproduces itself, it may stimulate the immune system to form new IgM antibodies.
Some patients have both IgG and IgM blots positive. But if either the IgG or IgM blot is positive, overall it is a positive result.
Response to antibiotics is the same if either is positive, or both."
Well I just have to except the fact that he DOES have Lyme. I dont think Dr J would stir us the wrong way if he thought it was something else.
In any case, what else would explain systemic symptoms, but an infection. It makes sense, he was bitten by a tick a few years ago.
He tested negative for virus's so I guess there is no need for a confirmation test.
I think we caught it fairly early, so I am happy about that.
Thanks everbody!
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
quote:Originally posted by UnexpectedIlls: In any case, what else would explain systemic symptoms, but an infection. It makes sense, he was bitten by a tick a few years ago.
There ya go!
Dr J would definitely not steer you in the wrong direction.
Posted by Connieaag (Member # 15199) on :
That is interseting regarding an elevated ASO titer in kids. My daughter has had one around 700 since she became ill in 2004. No one thought much about it except she had had step a lot and maybe rheumatic fever, but never known to us if she had. Do you have any more info on it and Lyme?
Connie
Posted by UnexpectedIlls (Member # 15144) on :
Hello
I thought it was very interesting too
My son kept having recurrent bouts of strep, but not with the "usual" strep symptoms...almost like he was just carrying it
When we finally started thinking Lyme and he tested high for the strep titre, we were like OK now I understand...although not FULLY
Dr. J said that having a high strep titre in lyme, especially in children was a common thing to see
Although I would like to know more on why that is myself
I never though of rhuematic fever????
Thanks for bringing that up!!!
I hope your child is feeling better!
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
Unexpected....Do a search here on ASO. Another member here has this. I'm not sure she still posts here.
Go to the little word "search" in the middle of this screen.
Then type in ASO in the subject.
Posted by UnexpectedIlls (Member # 15144) on :
I just got a hard copy of my sons test results
I am very confused IgM WB positive IgeneX but CDC Negative Bands: 31++++ 93+ 41IND????
IgG NEG IgeneX and Neg CDC Bands: 31IND 39IND 41+++ 58+++ 66+ He also tested positive for Mycoplasma Pneumonia and Anaplasma Phagocytophilium??? I dont understand why IgG is Negative and why it doesnt match up to the IgM???
He also has past infection with EBV, I dont know how because he never had mono.
Does this mean that band 31 could really be cross reacting with EBV?
I wonder is this really does suggest Lyme??
Posted by Polaris (Member # 11391) on :
Nick Harris of Igenex has said nothing else makes the 31kd antigen, so if the 31kd antibody shows up, it is due to Borellia Burgdoferi.
Posted by timaca (Member # 6911) on :
If possible, call Igenex and ask them to run the 30/31 KDA confirmation test. That will help determine if band 31 is from lyme or not. They keep the blood for 3 months.
Depending on what you mean by testing positive for mycoplasma pneumonia....IgG titers above 1:200 are suspicous for infection. Titers lower than that are not.
If he had "past" infections with EBV...how did the doctor determine that? By looking at IgG? High IgG titers may indicate active EBV infection...
In my opinion, I would consider lyme as a possibility, along with EBV, mycoplasma and anaplasma. I would NOT say he definitley has lyme...just as I would not say he definitely has EBV or mycoplasma without looking further into the lab results.
Get copies of all the test results. Discuss them with his doctor AND do lots of reading on your own...
Best, Timaca
Posted by UnexpectedIlls (Member # 15144) on :
Thank you Polaris and Timaca
I dont understand....
On the result sheet it says that EBV could cause a false positive 31 band to react, why would they add that there if it wasnt true?
I am looking into all of this...
Along with EBV (high IgG), M.Pneumoniae and Anaplasma (which I understand is Elrichlia) he also has a Strep titre of 800 with a range less than 100, thats pretty high
He also tested positive for some mutation in which he can have thrombosis and also D-NaseB which is another form of streP
He has many infections going on so it is hard to tell if it is lyme?
Can Lyme produce all of these other infections?
I am worried sick
I am worried about possible rheumatic fever, which hasnt even been discussed as a posibility...
Posted by WildCondor (Member # 434) on :
Those are highly positive, Lyme specific results.
Posted by timaca (Member # 6911) on :
Ask them to run the 30/31 confirmation test. A friend just had it run. It was negative...and he has high EBV titers...meaning his positive band 31 was due to viruses and NOT lyme.
Best, Timaca
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
quote:Originally posted by WildCondor: Those are highly positive, Lyme specific results.
AMEN!
Read this several times, including the replies to the original post: