Hi, Does anyone know why Dr. B says "no stim allowed"? My chiropractor uses it all the time, which helps, but I don't want to be stirring things up by using it.
Posted by psano2 (Member # 11711) on :
What are you referring to"?
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
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My guess is that you are referring to some kind of mild electronic jolt thing to either help relieve muscle pain or hook to the ear for relaxation. I think it's call Alpha Stim ? As in stimulation.
I had this done and my adrenals, which were simply fried before, became toast, burned and turned to dust. While that is a metaphor, the effect was no less than utterly devastating for a long time to follow.
Very bad for the adrenals. And our nervous systems also can become very irritated by stimulation like that.
Still, ask the doctor for his reasons.
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Posted by disturbedme (Member # 12346) on :
uh oh.... my chiro used that all the time as well.. she uses that on ALL her patients actually.
I've used it every time I went and never really noticed much by it... chiro appointments didn't always help my neck pain though...
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
I think I know what you're talking about. My former chiro used that. I finally decided it was useless. The "traditional way" worked way better... if at all.
Posted by imagine2 (Member # 3136) on :
Yes, it is used by chiropractors to relax muscles. This is an excerpt from Dr. B's 2008 guidelines regarding the use of stim. He doesn't, however, say why ice and stim are contraindicated.Just wondered if anyone else knew why.
LYME REHAB-PHYSICAL THERAPY PRESCRIPTION NAME_____________________________________________________________ D.O.B._____________________________ DATE________________________ Please enroll this patient in a program of therapy to rehabilitate him/her from the effects of chronic tick-borne diseases. If necessary, begin with classic physical therapy, then progress when appropriate to a whole body conditioning program. THERAPEUTIC GOALS (to be achieved in order as the patient's ability allows): PHYSICAL THERAPY (if needed): 1. The role of physical therapy here is to prepare the patient for the required, preferably gym-based exercise program outlined below. Plan on several weeks of classic PT then transition to the gym. 2. Relieve pain and muscle spasms utilizing multiple modalities as available and as indicated: massage, heat, ultrasound, and passive and active range of motion. DO NOT use ice or electrical stim unless specifically ordered by our office. Paraffin baths can be quite useful
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
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Another point to consider is that the application of "electrical stim" can vary. For some it might be very mild but, for others, they may want to really send a charge that will be felt deep in the muscles.
Even the light electrical jolts can be very stressful and set off a cascade of all those stress hormones that are so out of whack with most lyme patients.
I've had this done in variety of modalities: P.T. with suction cups that send electrical jolts - it felt nice at the time and I was told to control it myself with the PT when off with other patients.
I was total toast for weeks after that.
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With hydrotherapy, too, more kinds of electrical stimulation to acupuncture points tossed me into a terrible relapse.
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The "Alpha Stim" machine - a tiny, hand-held device that attached to my ear lobe at a counselor's office. While marketed to help decrease anxiety and, although that was not my problem, the counselor thought it might help with lowering tinnitus.
It did the opposite. My ears wigged out and I nearly passed out.
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Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
OH .... ELECTRICAL stimulation! I know why!!! IT can cause severe pain in fibromyalgia and Lyme patients. It did for me and it was HORRIBLE.
The chiro over-did it even when I told him I had FM .. he ran it about 20 min!! AARRRGGHHH!! I refused to pay for the treatment since it put me in so much pain.
Posted by imagine2 (Member # 3136) on :
Sorry you guys had such awful experiences.
Well, Keebler, think I might just keep the tinnitus. Its preferable over "wigged-out ears".
Lymetoo, I had no idea stim could wreak such havoc. No wonder I feel so crappy today.(had stim yesterday)
Thanks to everyone for your replies
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
Yeah, and you can be sure I never went back to that guy!
Posted by CherylSue (Member # 13077) on :
I had accupuncture with electrical stimulation, and I could barely walk out of the room. I was a neurological mess. I never touched accupuncture and stayed away from any electrical stimulation since then.
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
I have bad EMF sensitivity (sensitivity to electrical things being right up against me, etc) and doing electrical stim is how I found this out.
Afterwards, I would have this combination of bad irritability and profound fatigue. It would start like 10-15 min after, and last for about 48 hours after the procedure.
Luckily, my chiropractor was very astute. I thought these symptoms were from my adjustments, but she figured out it was from the electrical stim, and when we stopped doing the electrical stim at the appointments, I never had this issue again after my chiro appointments.
So, maybe Dr. B said this because for some people all that electricity is just too stimulating or they are too sensitive to it. Like I said, for me it was VERY noticeable. EXTREME irritability and agitation and feeling "not right" after having this done....to the muscles on my back! (not even anywhere near my brain, yet it still caused this, just being exposed to that amount of electricity)
Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
This is interesting. Can you define what "stim" is? Is it TENS or something else.
I have an Alpha Stim. I don't use it that much since it didn't seem to be helping. It didn't make me worse, though. I also have a small TENS unit I bought in a drugstore in UK.
I've been to chiropractors who use some kind of electrical treatment & it seems to be a waste of time - especially since I have one at home.
The one "stim" unit I haven't tried is the one that Dr. K sells. It has special programs for lymph drainage & Lyme from what I have seen about it. I think it's similar to the Alpha Stim but I couldn't contact anyone at Dr. K's office who would answer any questions.
I'm also wondering how this may be related to Rifing... Some people do quite well with the Rife machine. I don't think you can just rule out all electronic devices.
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
Rife is different.
The electrical stimulation works on the muscles and many of us have VERY sensitive muscles.
sparkle.. What you mentioned from former chiros sounds like what we're talking about. Kind of like a TENS, but I think it's more intense than that.
Posted by Buster (Member # 19472) on :
The only form of electric device I will use on myself for pain is ultrasound combined with heat.
Playing football I got bruises, strains, hematomas, broke bones, and I know for a fact that it helps with swelling and inflammation.
I feel the Tens unit, and the electric stimulator are worthless.
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
The electrical stimulation I had was at my local chiropractor's. They put little suction cups on your muscles that are hooked up to a machine.
The suction cups sort of vibrate really quickly, I guess.....if I am remembering properly. I suppose it would feel good if I wasn't so sensitive to it.
I think with electronic things, you just need to go on a case-by-case basis. If something is affecting you negatively as badly as it was affecting me, you would know!
So maybe rife would do that for the same person, maybe it wouldn't. I guess the person would just have to try and see.
Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
I think it depends on the type of waveform & frequency. I don't have much knowledge in electronics. I guess it's an area we (or I) could study more about.
I would like to have more of an understanding of it. Like what's the difference between TENS, Rife, ultrasound, Alpha Stim, pulsed electro magnetic frequencies (PEMF), infrared & UV light...
If I have some time - I'll look into it. If you know anything or how to explain this in layman's terms - please post.
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
That was a good description of the eletrical stimulation, Hoosiers.
sparkle .. I can't tell you any technical stuff, that's for sure!
But I can tell you that Rife does not affect the muscles.... at least not in my experience. It's not a stimulation device.
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
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I also had very bad reaction to "microcurrent" treatments with a Chiropracter. Sent me into really bad relapses.
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I do fine with RIFE. It is very different. However, it's vital to keep to the cautionary time limits and only do treatments on the schedule (such as no more than every 12 days, etc.)
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Posted by Janice70 (Member # 16319) on :
I've been doing the electrical stimulation and ice at my physical therapist's office twice a
week for a few weeks now. I haven't noticed any problems from it. I do have to use very low
levels, otherwise my muscles contract, which is not supposed to happen. I was wondering if that
was because of the Lyme.
Posted by kelmo (Member # 8797) on :
The TENS unit made my daughter's back pain much worse. It was torture for her to use it.
We sent it back.
Posted by Tincup (Member # 5829) on :
"Lymetoo, I had no idea stim could wreak such havoc. No wonder I feel so crappy today. (had stim yesterday)."
My theory is it is killing keets and or other organisms... and causing a BIG BAD HERX!
Kinda like Rife.. sort of kind of?
I've seen people drop to their knees after doing this.
ME included.
SOMETIMES it doesn't "hit" you for a couple days. Then you think you are gonna die. Many don't associate the "elec stim" with the reaction because it is delayed.
I've had docs tell me it wouldn't be bad, it would help, no one else has that reaction... blah blah blah.
I didn't know better back then. Now I do.
So I tell them to stick it in their ear.
And I mean it.
If it has a plug on the end of it..
I don't want it ANYWHERE near me.
Posted by Robin123 (Member # 9197) on :
Interesting. I tried everything for unknown pain, and stim machines at chiro and pt offices was one of the modalities they used on me.
I never had any adverse reactions. I always felt a little better for a little while. That's all. So maybe we're all a little different in response to treatments.
Obviously, it can't treat Lyme.
Posted by dontlikeliver (Member # 4749) on :
Interesting, thank you. Never noticed that before. I had it done, not knowing, and to be honest it did not improve me at all and the electric thing made me feel 'weird'.
Posted by imagine2 (Member # 3136) on :
"My theory is it is killing keets and or other organisms... and causing a BIG BAD HERX!"
If it's killin' those krazy keets, I'm happy to be feeling crappy...uh...I think Posted by WildCondor (Member # 434) on :
I used it all the time, and have a TENS unit too and never had any problems, only good things.
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
I seriously doublt electrical stimulation kills keets. I really do. At any rate, I'm not willing to be tortured.
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