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Originally posted by seekhelp:

How many here obtained relief from the surgery? How many here went the other way?

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Some relief here, and no regrets about having had the surgery.

It was a piece of the puzzle.

Recovery took a bit longer than the surgeon predicted - but that was to be expected.
 

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Posted by Jin (Member # 11735) on :
 
Dear seekhelp,
The unfortunate news is that those diagnostics are only about 33 percent accurate at best. No stones showed in my tests, but my gallbladder was ready to rupture. It could not have been removed soon enough! I had symptoms similar to yours, with the addition of nausea and dry heaves. If you do not get the gallbladder removed, it will rupture if it is in bad enough shape. Make sure after it is removed to start taking bile salts, because your body will not tolerate fat at all if you do not.

Sincerely,
Jin
 

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Posted by seekhelp (Member # 15067) on :
 
Jin,

I have had nausea and dry heaving very often too. it's a major problem.

I think I'm moving forard with the surgery. It may not prove to be correct, but I have a lot of signs. I'm sick of being sick and my gut feel tells me my gallbladder is a bigger issue than I may realize.
 

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Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
I don't know anything about this subject but I have been researching Dr Hulda Clark's methods....

Just thought I'd post the info -

http://www.drclark.net/hulda_clark/zapper/index.php

There may be options to surgery for some people.
 

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Posted by klutzo (Member # 5701) on :
 
They tell you the tests are 96% accurate but they missed my stones on 3 ultrasounds and 2 HIDAS.

I had to have a procedure under anesthesia, that was as expensive as the surgery, to prove to them that I did have stones and needed surgery. It was called EGD with biliary microscopy. Then 2 weeks later I was under anesthesia again having the GB out.

If I could give you one piece of advice it would be that if it needs to come out, have it out, but eat a low fat diet from now on, no matter how good you feel afterwards.

My TCM doc told me to do that, and she told me the reason is that gallbladder disease is really liver disease and you can still form stones in your liver that can come down and get stuck in ducts, or have too little or too much bile, relative to cholesterol.

The TCM doc says once the GB is gone, most people can never metabolize fats normally again. (I looked it up...the rate of this problem is 40% for middle aged females, which is not "most", but it is an awful lot of us).

But I listened to the conventional GI doc instead, who told me I could eat anything after surgery, and 5 months after surgery, still feeling really good, I risked eating just one slice of very rich cake for someone's birthday.

I've been sick ever since with the same symptoms as before surgery, severe pancreatic insufficiency which will require prescription enzymes for a much shorter life span, and bile reflux gastritis which has caused both gastric and esophageal precancers, and keeps me up all night with burning reflux. Bile reflux is very hard to treat, not like GERD.

I would suggest a visit to www.gallbladderattack.com to prepare yourself with the facts, so you can deal with them if need be.

However, I hope you will be one of the lucky 60% that never has a problem again after surgery.

klutzo

P.S. Some good news: The actual surgery is nothing. I did not even need the pain meds they gave me. Compared to average daily Lyme pain, it's a walk in the park.
 

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Posted by MY3BOYS (Member # 17830) on :
 
reading this for my own problems right now. having what i think is gall bladder attacks. really one tonight

have read that is prob. that really if from the liver, even with gall bladder out, can still have symptoms.

my mom and mother-ni-law have both had that surj and BOTH have had GI problems ever since both with dumping symdrome, intolerance to just about everything.

i am hoping mine is not "dead" or near rupture.

how do u save it with lyme??
 

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Posted by mojo (Member # 9309) on :
 
I had my GB out years before I knew I had Lyme (although I definately had Lyme at the time of surgery).

I am pleased with the result - I had a couple major attacks that lasted days. Nothing like the pain of a gallstone stuck in a bile duct. Ouch!

Make sure that you take the time you need to recover. They gave me pamphlets that said "resume most normal activities" in three days (but say you can drive a car for a week).

they didn't tell me to take time off of work so I went back to work too soon and got very very ill. I had my surgery on a Friday and worked on Tuesday. I worked at home but my fax machine was on the floor and I was bending all day. (duh) Even though I took long naps I still got very sick.
 

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Posted by Cold Feet (Member # 9882) on :
 
Klutzo, your post is very interesting indeed. Thx for posting these tidbits.

I know only a few people that had their gall bladder removed. Ironically, both had/have pains in same areas where there gall bladders once were.

Please try the Hulda Clark cleanse several times before considering surgery. I've edited and polished the instructions and have them in Word -- I'd be happy to send them to you -- just PM me your email address.

I've done the Clark cleanse three times, and have been stunned with the results (lots of stones, though I had/have no pains). I do it to help my liver stay clean and efficient...kind of like the oil filter on your car!


 

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Posted by rebecky (Member # 19251) on :
 
Hi- I'm newly diagnosed. I had my gallbladder out last August after bouts of nausea and pain and vomitting.

The MD did ultrasounds but no stones were seen. So he did a HIDA scan and I had a low ejection fraction so I had it out laparsopically.

I wasn't really prepared for the recovery so be prepared to be laid up and take it easy.

I haven't had any of that same pain but a few months ago I was back in the gastros office with nausea, vomitting and chest pain.

Had a barium swallow (yuck) and they found GERD. I thought "Duh, I could have told you that."

Then they did the gastric emptying sutdy and found I had gastroparesis, which I have come to find is a common lyme symptom.

I have no lasting side effects from having the gallbladder out. I can eat fats fine. But everyone is different. I do still have a lot of nausea but I don't know what to attribute that to.
 

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Posted by Geneal (Member # 10375) on :
 
I had my gall bladder out in 1999.

It was full of stones.

I have had no difficulty eating fatty foods.

None at all.

It was done via laporoscopy and recovery was about 2 weeks.

Pain in the same region as my gall bladder was,

Happened to me when I was 36 weeks pregnant with my son.

It was pancreatitis.

I had one subsequent attack since then.

Hadn't had one in over 6 years.

It isn't uncommon that a stone gets left behind

In the common bile duct.

Elevated liver enzymes can also be an indication of pancreatitis.

I am so glad I had my gall bladder out.

Sure beat sitting up in horrible pain, night after night.

Mine was done on an out patient basis.

Hugs,

Geneal
 

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Posted by Jin (Member # 11735) on :
 
Dear seekhelp,
You sound exactly like me before the surgery! I actually had mine out at only 20 years of age. That is highly unusual. However, the Celiac Disease likely caused it to go bad. The misery it results in is unbelievable. I would love to talk to you on the phone about the surgery if you need extra support.

Dear klutzo,
I am so glad you mentioned those things! Most people are not told by their doctors that you can still get stones in bile ducts after the operation. Tolerating fats is much more difficult without the gallbladder. I am on bile salts, and they help. I can always tell when I overdo it, because it starts hurting where my gallbladder used to be.

Bialary reflux can be a result of a stricture in the bile duct. I still worry something is wrong in there. You can have trouble with the Sphincter of Oddi or Ampulla/Papilla of Vater. A stricture or injury may cause bile to back up into the stomach. I still get reflux and bowel issues from this. It is very frustrating to deal with.

Sincerely,
Jin
 

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Posted by klutzo (Member # 5701) on :
 
Geneal brings up a very good point about stones being left behind in the ducts. I was looking to avoid this, so I insisted on a cholangiogram done during the surgery to make sure it did not happen. Do not ask for this if allergic to iodine, as that is the contrast medium they use for the test.

Re: GB cleanses. I did two of them before resorting to surgery. I also passed many "stones" or whatever they were, (some who have analysed them insist they are just balls of olive oil) but I still continued to get worse. I am not saying cleanses don't work, only that they didn't for me.


I only went for surgery when it got so bad I could not eat anything but applesauce and plain lettuce, I was losing 5 lbs. per week, and my hair was falling out. The chills kept me up all night.

Also, if you have chills and/or lose your ability to eat other things besides fats, I would press the docs to evaluate your pancreas. A GB problem should only affect the ability to eat fats.

It turned out tiny stones had been backing up in my pancreatic duct for years, blocking the enzymes, which then ate my pancreas instead of digesting my food, and now 95% of my pancreas is destroyed.

Jin is right. Taking bile salts is a good way to find out if you have too little or too much bile as a cause of post GB surgery problems. If you have too little, they will help.

If you make too much bile or it is too thick, like me, the salts will make you have bowel cramps so bad you will swear your guts are going to bust out of you and fall on the floor. If this happens, stop taking them immediately, as it can be dangerous.

To test for Sphincter of Oddi, strictures, etc. an ERCP can be done, but it carries a high risk of pancreatitis, so I had an MRCP instead, which is very safe and simple and almost as good.

klutzo
 

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Posted by Jill E. (Member # 9121) on :
 
Like Klutzo mentioned, the www.gallbladderattack.com website is informative.

In fact, I paid for a phone consultation with the acupuncturist/herbalist who runs is. She is in my city but only does phone consults. I did buy a few of her products, and also tried a few homeopathics and herbs that my naturopath recommended.

However, I don't tolerate medications, herbs, homeopathics well and have to ramp up, and I couldn't really stay on things long enough to know if anything helped. And the supplements with ox bile increased the pain way too much.

I did ask my surgeon if my Sphincter of Oddi might be blocked or spasmed. He had thought that my whole problem might be a vagus nerve problem, and this was before I even told him that Lyme Disease can cause vagus nerve dysfunction. So if it were nerve related, it could cause problems with the nerves going to the gallbladder, pancrease, Sphincters, etc.

When he did the surgery he examined my Sphincter of Oddi and it was open. But who knows if it spasms intermittently. Like Klutzo said, I opted not to do an ERCP for concern of getting pancreatitis. I did have a CT scan of my pancreas but never had the MRCP which one doctor recommended.

I've been lucky, I did not get the dumping syndrome which many gallbladder patients I talked to (including my sister-in-law) get. In fact, I switched to a surgeon who is considered one of the top laparascopic gallbladder surgeons in my city, and I give credit to his skill for making the post-surgical part easy.

The post-surgery pain was nothing compared to tick-borne diseases. They had to talk me into taking one pain pill - I didn't need it. However, you do have to rest and recover for a month or so simply because of the incisions needing to heal and the impact of surgery on the body.

Jill
 

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Posted by lpkayak (Member # 5230) on :
 
my major symptom was nausea.

they said gall bladder went bad cuz i lost 60 pounds in 4 weeks.

i had, had lyme 10-15 years at least at that time.

it was the easiest surgery i had had. i always feel great after cuz of the iv abx they give you. and nausea went away.
 

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Posted by Jin (Member # 11735) on :
 
Dear klutzo,
I am so sorry about what happened to you!
Something similar happened to a woman a little older than me I met in the surgeon's office. She said I was doing the right thing, getting it out then. This woman had been misdiagnosed 15 times in less than two months by ER doctors. None of her tests showed anything, just like mine.

It turns out, she had sludge. The sludge ate through her gallbladder wall into her pancreas. As a result, she had pancreatitis, liver, and kidney problems. What is so tragic is, like all of us, she has to live with the errors doctors willingly make on a daily basis. I was thinking about the Sphincter of Oddi, because of the issues I still have. MRCP sounds like it is worth checking into, since I feared the risks of the ERCP.

Dear Jill E.,
Some of what you posted about with the vagus nerve is another possibility for me. The surgeon I had retired. I am not sure what to do from here. I have a physical coming up in May. My PCP can tell me what she thinks.

Sincerely,
Jin
 

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