I think it makes sense that a partner could have positive bands on IgG (or IgM maybe?) and not actually be infected with Lyme, or at the least, not have an active case of Lyme.
I think that maybe they could be exposed to dead spriochetes or fragments (such as an Outer surface protein?) during sex, and then their body would build antibodies to that.
If you were to find the partner positive on something like PCR, that would be different, that would mean you would know they were somehow infected.
If they have symptoms then I guess you would need to treat, but if there are no symptoms, I think the first explanation of being exposed to fragments is plausible. That is just my theory though....I read it somewhere else (from someone Lyme Literate) and thought it made sense.
If my partner tests positive for Lyme on a western blot, I don't think I would treat him because he seems very healthy.
Posted by 1Bitten2XShy (Member # 12280) on :
Well, 12 years ago my then husband to be, had Lyme. He was lucky, had the bullseye, knew enough to get to the Dr. and insist on meds. Of course Dr. said, no I do not think you have Lyme, but will test and put you on 30 days Doxy.
So, yes WB comes back positive, 30 days later meds done, 3 months later husband feels fine.
Now, during this time...I did not know he had Lyme..Had unprotected sex.
Fast foward 10 years and after a tragic event I become very ill. Cannot figure it out, LLMD says Lyme after the 10th gazzillion Dr, I had seen.
Igenex IGM
23-25 IND
28 +
31+
39 IND
41 IND
83-93 IND
Igenex IGG
39 and 41 IND
So, in treatment for 2+ years. Am better but not 100%. Very nice and aggressive LLMD, but even he stated at last visit that he does not know "if I still have active Lyme".
Have found I have Hashi's, terribly anemic, low low D and B12 is low. (which can all be caused by Hashi/Hypo Thyroid). I also tested positive for Hashi's back when I first became ill, but it was brushed off then. Sex hormones out of whack, and still test very high positive for EBV & CMV. (had mono as a teen)
I am now at the point where I am not sure I actually have/had Lyme, but maybe positive antibodies due to what took place 10 years earlier.
Not sure what path to take, it gets so darn confusing....
Posted by nenet (Member # 13174) on :
I am fairly positive that antibodies can only be passed between humans mother to child (e.g. via placenta), but I could be wrong. It's an interesting question.
Even then, only IgG antibodies are possibly transferred - the IgM antibodies are too big to pass through. (according to "Everything you Need to Know About Lyme Disease and Other Tick-Borne Disorders" by Karen Vanderhoof-Forschner, p. 68)
I am of the opinion that sexual transmission (and possibly other modes) of Lyme infection is possible - at the very least, it has not been ruled out, so I approach it as a possible risk.
However, just having antibodies with no infection? According to all I learned from my reading on Lyme, I don't believe that is possible, *unless* you had the Lymerix vaccine, and that only created 31kda and 34kda antibodies. I could definitely be wrong though. I would very much like to know the answer to this too.
In your personal situation, if you had Lyme symptoms, and had such an indicative test result, I can't see how you couldn't have an active infection causing those. How you got it would still be unanswered I guess.
Posted by 1Bitten2XShy (Member # 12280) on :
The symptoms I had/have however intertwine with the Hashi's...and that I know for sure I have.
Posted by SForsgren (Member # 7686) on :
No, not likely. Much more likely you have the bands because you have Lyme disease from the sexual contact than otherwise.
Posted by 1Bitten2XShy (Member # 12280) on :
Still so confusing. After 2 years of aggressive treatment and not where I should be, and not alot of positives...sigh
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
nenet, I wasn't saying the antibodies themselves are passed through sex, but that the partner forms his/her own antibodies after being exposed to spirochete material from the person infected. It is just a theory. I'm not saying it is right or wrong, but I have heard it tossed around, and it makes sense to me.
If I am indeed infected with Lyme, I'm sure there are also dead spirochetes in my body, and that material has to make it's way out of the body somehow. If it makes it's way out through urine, it makes sense fragments could at least be found in the area of the body used for sex (sorry I can't think of a better way to phrase that). That is my personal logic we are following, so I am not saying it is without fault.
Anyways, regardless, the decision to continue treating is a personal one. Even those of us who know how, where, and when we got Lyme ask ourselves "how do I know when to stop treating?" So you are not alone in asking that.
You could ask your LLMD if he or she has a "maintence protocol" you could go on that would be low stress on the body, that would give you a couple months to let the smoke clear and see where you are at without strong treatment. And in the mean time, you could evaluate the other conditions you have. That is one idea.
Posted by Leelee (Member # 19112) on :
My husband and I asked my LLMD and he said no one knows for sure. Posted by billclo (Member # 12939) on :
Kinda like if you exchanged saliva with someone with AIDS - it's generally thought you can't get it that way because the number of particles is too low. But you can develop antibodies to the virus...
So many diseases are passed sexually, I really do not see why this cannot be. I know the jury is out on whether you can or cannot...
But am wondering if maybe you could show some IND or positive test signs for the antibodies..
Call me crazy
You're NOT crazy! I, personally believe, as do numerous LLMDs who have done very significant studies and reviews are convinced that Borrelia sp. is sexually transmissible, at the very least "with repeated contact", period. End of story.
If you want to call me crazy, knock yourself out , but your line of thinking is right on.
ping "We are more than containers for Lyme"
Posted by MorningSong (Member # 19989) on :
My husband and I asked the LLMD the same question. She stated that the man can give it to the female, but not visa versa.
Posted by ping (Member # 6974) on :
quote:Originally posted by MorningSong: My husband and I asked the LLMD the same question. She stated that the man can give it to the female, but not visa versa.
MorningSong - IMHO, I don't believe that for one second! If you saw UOS, then you saw possibly a mild example against your docs argument. Not to mention the number of testimonials from many women that I know here in TX whose male partners were not symptomatic before hooking up with them and are now testing + on Igenex; some even CDC +.
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, but your line of thinking is right on.