Hi, I've spent a good deal of the past week doing research and came across this info on a certain type of Cat's Claw.......there are two different ones, and the one with TOA in it will actually put you in worse shape, though it does have some uses for other ailments, so it seems important to not use the less expensive cat's claw. This info could also be useful to women who take cat's claw to help with menopause - it could actually be setting your Lyme symptoms back.
Here are just some of the articles/books, which seem to all be available to read on line for free, it REALLY looks promising!!!
A couple of the articles were very good, clear and concise - I hope this does not break any Dr. name rules because many of these articles were written by doctors, but this info is readily available on the Internet and mostly concerns using this herb.
Samento: Health for Everyone - 320 page book includes conference presentations and 250 patient reports Atanas Tzonkov & Svetla Lefterova, Sofia, Bulgaria, April 2005 - Html version (no download required) - PDF (678 KB download)
Curing Lyme Disease with Samento James Howenstine, MD, News With Views, April 2005
Lyme disease: A Look Beyond Antibiotics Explore Magazine- Dietrich Klinghardt, MD, PhD, Volume 14, No. 2, April 2005 Html version (no download required) PDF Version (124 KB download)
SAMENTO: Health for Everyone - 320 page book- includes conference presentations and 250 patient reports Atanas Tzonkov & Svetla Lefterova, Sofia, Bulgaria, April 2005 PDF Version (680 KB download)
Peruvian Herb Erases the Pain of IBS (Irritable Bowel Syndrome) Prescriptions for Healthy Living, March 2005
Miraculous Peruvian Herb Cures Emmy-award Winning Singer-Songwriter, Bill Chinnock, of Devastating Chronic Lyme Disease PRWEB, February 2005
Lung Cancer: More Hope with Samento and Noni Cancer Fix Magazine, Singapore, February 2005
Lyme disease: It's Evolving And The Clock Is Ticking What Medicine? Magazine, Lymington, England, February 2005
Lyme Disease, Potential Plague of the 21st century- Detection Problems Resolved By Imaging With The Bradford Variable Projection High Resolution Microscope Townsend Letter for Doctors and Patients, January 2005
The New Great Impostor David Williams, MD, Alternatives Newsletter, December 2004
Cat's Claw (Samento) and Chronic Health by Heather Redmond, Laterlife.co.uk, United Kingdom, December 2004
A Peruvian Miracle in the Making? Health Food Business Magazine, Essex, England, November 2004
New Remedy for an ancient enemy- Lyme Disease What Medicine? Magazine, Lymington, England, November 2004
Chronic Fatigue Often Misdiagnosed Lyme: Is Samento an Answer? CAM Magazine, Vol. 4, Issue 3, Essex, England, October 2004
Samento Case Reports- Lechitel Clinic Samento International Conference- Brighton, England, September 9-10, 2004
Samento - Key to the Optimal Medicine (12,000 patients treated in European clinic) Samento International Conference- Brighton, England, September 9-10, 2004
Cat's Claw Will Put You In Good Spirits The Argus newspaper, Brighton, England, September 2004
Samento vs. Saventaro Vitamin Research News, Vol. 18, Number 8, September 2004
Samento: Immunological Mechanisms of Action Samento International Conference- Brighton, England, September 9-10, 2004
Samento Users Share Their Experiences: 30 testimonials, NutraNews, September 2004
Miraculous Plant: The birth of Cat�s Claw without tetracyclic alkaloids Somos Magazine, El Comercio, Lima, Peru, August 2004
Samento: New Remedy For An Ancient Enemy - Lyme Disease Vitamin Research News, Vol. 18 # 6, July 2004
What Makes Lyme Disease Tick & How Samento Eliminates It, Townsend Letter for Doctors and Patients, July 2004
Effective Treatment of Lyme Borreliosis with Pentacyclic Alkaloid Uncaria tomentosa (TOA-free Cat's Claw), Pilot Study executive summary, Dallas, Texas, May 2004
The Best Alternative Treatment For Lyme Disease What Doctors Don't Tell You, Vol. 14, No. 11, February 2004
Healing Reaction with TOA-Free Cat's Claw, William Lee Cowden, MD, February 2004
Get Armed and Ready for Flu Season (Samento for the treatment and prevention of Influenza), Sinatra Health Report, January 2004
Lyme disease and chronic illnesses are completely reversible, thanks to... The Incredible Healing Action of One Simple Herb Second Opinion, December 2003
Posted by SForsgren (Member # 7686) on :
Many people have used Samento as part of their treatment protocol, including myself.
I'd suggest you look more broadly at the Condensed Cowden Protocol from NutraMedix vs. just this one product, also from NutraMedix.
As I understand, the new Condensed Protocol has had success rates that are near 90%.
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
It's a nice herb for treatment, but didn't help me much. As Scott mentioned, it's better as part of a protocol. I like it with the Buhner herbs.
Posted by lymewreck36 (Member # 4395) on :
What is the basic herbal protocal for those of us who cannot take antibiotics anymore, or is that too broad a question.
Is there a list of what most people use, and where to buy them?
Mary
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
Don't hold your breath on this one.
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
There are a many, Lymewreck. Cowden is one. I like Buhner ... he wrote a book - Healing Lyme.
Core Buhner herbs are samento, banderol, resveratrol, and andrographis. Then you add to that based on your personal symptoms.
If you're in Switzerland, you might consider Bionic 880 in Germany. And/or AI drops.
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
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When it first came out, I used Samento for a year, although I found very little help with it (but, yes, even one drop can pack a punch).
Although I could not find third-party research and the company never did send the studies that they promised to mail me, I continued taking Samento because I knew of no other choices (no LLMD; I had not yet learned of allicin, etc.). I still have seen no third-party research on this and the lack of third-party research concerns me.
I know of two other lyme patients who relied mostly on Samento. They stuck with it for a full year and they were no better off. (They are excellent with their self-care.)
Some people, though, seem to report great things with it. As Scott suggests, see the Cowden protocol for the full measure.
Whatever you decide, it is not enough to kill lyme all by itself. Not by a long shot. You can read more about it. And, there are also many other choices.
Buhner does use cat's claw (as part of a larger protocol), but he uses the regular cat's claw and he discourages the TOA-free type, such as samento. You can read all about that in his book and what he writes correlates with the other article linked below.
I've used both over time and both have some effect. However, I could never find any 3-party research on Samento. And, I actually do much better with regular cats claw as it is much better for the neurological symptoms. The TOA actually HELPS with that. When it's removed, that effect is absent.
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I compiled this a while back so the PubMed numbers may be different today:
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Concerning regular cat's claw, Singleton discusses it; Buhner offers a full presentation.
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This book, by an ILADS member LLMD, holds great information about treatments options and support measures:
. . . Research in Argentina reports that cat's claw is an effective antioxidant; other researchers in 2000 concluded that it is an antioxidant as well as a remarkably potent inhibitor of tumor necrosis factor (TNF) alpha production.
. . . In addition to the immunostimulant alkaloids, cat's claw contains the alkaloids rhynchophylline, hirsutine, and mitraphylline, which have demonstrated hypotensive and vasodilating properties.
- Full article at link above - with dozens of links to third party research articles.
UNCARIA TOMENTOSA (CAT'S CLAW) - by Subhuti Dharmananda, Ph.D., Director, Institute for Traditional Medicine 1994
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[ 05-29-2009, 04:02 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]
Posted by randibear (Member # 11290) on :
well i'm starting the buhner protcol with resveratrol, andrographis, and cat's claw in tablet form, and sarasparilla. i'm doing one of each right now twice a day. next week i go to one each three times a day.
i know it will take awhile to work up, but i'm so dang sensitive to everything, i'm doing it slowly so i won't have any side effects.
so far i'm just sleep with a little softer stools.
and that andrographis does taste terrible, ugh...
but i'm staying on it. i like not having all those antibiotics and having to go to a doctor, plus ordering the quantity i like.
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
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Randi,
I am so glad to hear you are doing okay with this. Good luck.
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Andrographis has been fabulous in helping to control seizures. I've gone off this a time or two for a break and I get hit.
Yes, it tastes terrible and it makes me so much more fatigued but since I understand WHY, I can accept that, for now. I have lost inches just above my ankles from its help in reducing edema.
Buhner's book is fascinating and it takes many times reading it to get it all. I finally had to address just one chapter per week.
There are also other ways to work with this.
MARY/LYMEWRECK asked for some choices for those who can't obtain or tolerate abx. But, with the right protocol and the right doctor, an abx protocol may be better tolerated than one without the support measures. Abx without support rarely works.
Whatever you do, it is best if you work with a LL ND who has read all the ILADS works. It is vital to have the science behind lyme/TBD and also be very familiar with ILADS and Burrascano's protocols to have the rationale and understanding of the task at hand.
Supportive herbs are never enough. However, there are a couple of protocols with combinations of very specific herbs or vitamins.
And, then there is also RIFE to consider. Supplements for support would still be needed, here, though.
FAR Infrared Sauna has been very helpful for many (low heat but great penetration for releasing and sweating out toxins). High heat saunas are not suggested and can put lyme patients at risk.
Alternative Treatments for Lyme Disease and Co-Infections
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[ 05-29-2009, 04:18 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]
Posted by Leelee (Member # 19112) on :
I used Samento for one month prior to beginning abx. My LLMD recommended it as a sort of gauge to see how I might respond to abx. I had quite a reaction to the Samento, even hallucinating a few times.
At the end of the month my LLMD started me on low levels of abx and is gradually working up, in part, I think do to my herx on Samento.
My nutritionist/herbalist told me that she found that after a while Samento loses its effectiveness in helping combat Lyme.
Posted by Melodymaker (Member # 16434) on :
I originally looked into cats claw, and read that it was thought to work because it had quinilone properties. (Cipro is a quinilone drug)
So, since I am allergic to Cipro, i searched further and found that it was not recommended for those who are allergic to quinilones.
I did contact one of the herbal sites, and they suggested a method for trying it out. I don't remember exactly what the trial was.
When I think of herbs, I always thing "drug" as the herbs are often the natural form of drugs.
Herbs are a good natural alternative to the drugs, but they still have drug properties and should be respected and used with knowledge.
I chose not to try the Samento because of my allergic issues.
Does anyone else have info on this?
Posted by randibear (Member # 11290) on :
in buhner's book he addresses this. he says samento is not related to quinlo family and it's ok to take it.
i can't take levaquin or cipro and i take samento fine.
there's about a half a page on this.
Posted by ping (Member # 6974) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lymetoo: Don't hold your breath on this one.
Yep, unfortunately. Old news.
ping "We are more than containers for Lyme"
Posted by keltyl (Member # 14050) on :
I started on the old cowden, now on the condensed. Right now I'm using banderol and samento, plus the detoxers etc.
I think my next new one will be Mora and then Quina. If I recall there's one more too.
So far (about 3 mos.), I have not had any substantial improvements.
Posted by MariaA (Member # 9128) on :
Take a look at the herbal links thread in my signature for more info about the various herbal protocols.
And get Buhner's book. And listen to hwatever Keebler says, she/he's usually right on.
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
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Oh, Maria, thanks for the chuckle and compliment but there are so many factors and still much to learn.
I want to stress the importance of distinguishing between Samento and Cat's Claw. They are not the same. Samento is TOA-free cat's claw but, by altering that, it can no longer be referred to as cat's claw.
A few have said that Bunher recommends Samento. Making the distinction, then, that the two terms cannot be used interchangeably, Buhner does not recommend Samento or any other TOA-free cat's claw.
In fact, he has several pages of discussion about it and explains his decision to recommend only the pure cat's claw that has not been altered. He explains that cat's claw is beneficial to the nervous system and that is lost with the TOAs removed.
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If you want Samento or TOA-free cat's claw, the Cowden protocol works with that.
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Posted by nefferdun (Member # 20157) on :
I take TOA free cat's claw or samento which I buy in capsules. I take 250mg 3 times a day. I seem to be doing ok with this. I also take about 35 drops of cumanda twice a day, 250 mg graperfruit seed extract three times a day and 3 HH capsules for bartonella 4 times a day. It is very expensive but I cannot use abx any more. I am afraid to say I feel good, as that can change in a hurry, but I hope that I have this under control.
![[Frown]](frown.gif)
Old news.