This weekend TxC' and I found out that a place we lived for over two and a half years was riddled w/ black mold [the worst areas were where I spent the most time in that house].
We had been suspicious,but were not allowed to do more than simple cleaning while there. Then we moved to 'Armpit park',and as much as the landlord tried to keep things up,...
we know there were some mold/mildew issues w/ water leakage in all areas w/plumbing.
But we found out there was a definite black mold issue in the place we had spent two and a half years before we moved to *'Armpit'*[we were *there aprox. a year. Thankfully,where we are now is better and safer.
I think that explains why my sinuses/upper respiratory continue to keep acting up. I know it didn't help me fight the Lyme and Co' diagnosed while we where moving there [it was a move because of a job].
Tho' we are blessed that TxC has a good job now, I still don't have any regular insurance [only accident/dental/eye but better than none at all].So am wondering what we can do to fight the ill effects from the mold problems.
TxC had his -stroke of the eye/ mid-vein occlusion- while we were living in the moldy- oldy house...
we were...I'll say 'forced out of the job'... so there wouldn't be any help coming from the folk in the situation at oldy- moldy there [just before Armpit park].
I'll be doing a search here on LymeNet too,but am wondering what we may be able to do after the fact,and on a limited budget.Perhaps losing that job, was Creators way of keeping us from getting more ill?!!!
Just Silverwolfi looking for Answers and a path back to health!
Posted by Silverwolf (Member # 9196) on :
Jus' me again...weather is getting weird...had some high winds yesterday[they lost a building that had just been framed out in town yesterday afternoon...it blew over]...
we didn't lose power...but it's getting odd out there again...hearing thunder rumbles...
If it gets any weirder...I'll be shutting down computer for a bit.Course it has to happen while I am on a break to search for info...
[and I have a load of wet clothes waiting to go in dryer..so here's hoping the power doesn't shut off]...
Posted by bettyg (Member # 6147) on :
bonny, look for a very long post, many replies on MOLD by JAM....and some numbers are after her name.
start reading there ... very detailed & many links of info.
perhaps they will see your post and give you some initial guideance. hugs/kisses my friends...
Posted by emla999/Lyme (Member # 12606) on :
Silverwolf, the link down bellow may be helpful to you.
How to determine if you have mold related illness:
There's alot of good info about mold toxicity on that post.
Posted by Silverwolf (Member # 9196) on :
<<<<< Betty' and Emla' >>>>>,
Thanks for the info'!!! I had things shut down for a bit...it is raining but the winds don't seem so bad now, so I can research on my breaks!!!
I appreciate this ever so much...and will get the info bookmarked quick as I'm able to!!! It's bookmarked...
Thanks again!!!
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
Check out biotoxin.info
You can have your doctor consult with Dr. S from that website. I found his videos to be extremely informative.
You definitely need to address the mold issues in your body. I found the detox from mold to be very bad, right up there, maybe even worse than the herxing from Lyme. Good luck! Glad you found out ... better than not knowing!
Posted by Pinelady (Member # 18524) on :
I got my dad some detox at the pharmacy to see if
it would help him on his breaks from chemo. He said
yes he feels much better and wants another bottle
for next round. I figure with terminal cancer it
can not hurt. It contains mostly all B vitamins and
he is looking better too. Blood work last week
said levels way better so I say yes. May be something to try.
Posted by minerva (Member # 20410) on :
I would check out "mold warriors" by doctor shoemaker. I had my house tested from this great company. Tennessee mold consultants. 'they send you petri dishes and you put them open in each room and cover them after a bit.
Send them in and they tell you what you have, how many, and how dangerous a health threat. You can even talk to the lab guy who is very knowledgable and helpful.
I was really glad I did it. I had no visible mold, couldn't smell it either but I had a lot, they send you photos of the growth of the mold in the dish too. It does not tell you what is in your walls that is a bigger and expensive process.
I was able to get rid a lot of it by getting rid of my house plants and using ozone in the house while I was gone.
You could also look into using ozone in your body, via blood injections, drinking ozone water, or having it gas via steam or in nose, ears, vaginal or anal insertion.
You can't breath it. I did feel better when I did the ozone but my person has moved. Good luck to you.
Posted by Veromia (Member # 22031) on :
Gosh this is a concern to me. the expense it kills us all.
Posted by Silverwolf (Member # 9196) on :
<<<<< Sixgoofyk',Pinelady ,minerva ,Veromia,and each replier >>>>>,
Hi there, thanks for the info'/links,ideas,tho'ts and suggestions !!!
TxC' and I both appreciate it so very much...
We were hoping the 'oldy-moldy' house wasn't too awfully contaminated,sadly an acquaintance has had to move there.
When they began to clean they found the black mold in the front den/bedroom area[where there was many years of water damage from a leaky air conditioner].
They of course insisted on help to get it cleaned up [it's an immune-compromised person],An option that wasn't allowed us,long story as is said.
I know the nasty moldy gunk is in the bathroom ,and laundry area as well. Every carpet in the place had been wet vacuumed/steamed etc. more times than anyone could count.
So at least now the carpeting has been changed out,and the place has had some painting done. it should actually have been torn down years back,and something better built or brought in!
We went to our SE Idaho stet fair and happened to run into the individual,who made certain we knew about the issues!!!
Well,we can at least start w/ some B-complex,and I do Methylcobalamin B-12 daily, so it is a start.
As soon as I can get a PCP,I'll find out what can be done ,w/in our budget,until we can get a better insurance plan!
I've been reading and came across the info' about 'Mold Warriors',and some info' on the biotoxin problem too...
So glad y'all are here, and willing to share this info'... at least I know now, why treatment seems to be at a standstill at this time.
Veromia, it is a concern, you're correct... Lyme and Co's is such a messy soup as it is,then add mold/mildew and parasites.It is all hard on the pocketbook,and I wonder that we humans are able to survive.
I'm wondering about ,Ozone-ated water if perhaps it could help...will see what I can find out!!!
Another tho't, it is no wonder our two dogs are having skin problems...they sit and sleep on the carpets most of the time...
Just Silverwolfi... of Foggy Swamped System...[Ain't givin' Up!!!]
Posted by randibear (Member # 11290) on :
oh my word, hon. what a mess. no wonder you kept calling that place names.
is there anything i can do to help?
how's the new place?
Posted by Silverwolf (Member # 9196) on :
Hi there <<<<< Randibear-Sistah-friend >>>>>,
It was a mess for certain,and it was the place before 'Armpit',which was bad enough as you know !!!
I'll dare to call the 'oldy-moldy-house' place an ...er... ''...whited sepulcher...''. Except some of those mausoleum type places are probably kept cleaner/healthier.
I am researching for TxC and me,and going to step up on B-complex to start w/,and go from there. Perhaps find a gentle-inexpensive detox if I can.
Randi' hon', if you come across *anymore info' than what is here*, please let me know... the more info' we can find the sooner we can get this mess out of our systems.
*[edit in: LymeNet folk have some fantastic info' and links here,and I am very grateful!!!...Just trying to find as much as is possible quickly,and find an affordable way to detox... the murk in my brain seems to be overwhelming lately...]*
New place is okay so far...just really slow w/ getting boxes sorted and stashed...and trying not to be to nervous about my Dad and Bro' coming the end of the month...
It's the... no energy...,but I gotta clean up enough so they can walk safely... I get injured enough for all of us now... problem.
And neither *TxC'* nor I can remember simple things like... paying the bundled cable bill ...so we had no 'puter or phone use this a.m. ... ...
*He* is doing pretty well at work,just recently got transferred to area home office [5 min. from home]!!!!
They are learning a new computer system tho' which makes life interesting... and a couple folk are out ill.
I am still wondering as did our 'supervisor' from the former,pre-youth home/counselor job,if the sick building, oldy-moldy-house may have actually caused the Mid-vein occlusion[eye stroke] in TxC's eye...
[Perhaps I should just type out, the job and place we were working...but I am trying to be nice...we still care very much about some folk who don't have much choice but to use the particular place[s]s at issue here.].
Well I'm off to check the never-ending laundry... Thanks again to each replier...for the info' and the caring!!!
Silverwolfi [ must check my paws for webbing and mold...] from the foggy swamps!
Posted by TerryK (Member # 8552) on :
Glad you found out this was an issue now instead of later so that you can deal with it.
It's highly unlikely that a PCP will know anything about mold issues. Even those doctors who say they do, often know less than the well educated patient and are not willing to do the whole protocol for mold.
Mold can make some people really sick and others much less. It depends on if you can make sufficient quantities of antibodies to get rid of the toxins that are created by mold.
If you brought your clothes, furniture, books etc. to your new house, then your new house is contaminated too. Spores are airborne thus easily contaminate new areas.
There is a genetic test that is mentioned in Mold Warriors that you could take. Mine was paid for by insurance. If you don't make the antibodies, you will need a binder to bind them and take them out of your system. If you don't at least do that, you will supposedly not get well because the mycotoxins will continue to circulate in your system, making your sick.
If you do make antibodies, it may take time to get well after exposure and if you've brought the spores and mycotoxins with you to your new home, you may be constantly exposed still, especially if they find a place to grow at your new place. They need moisture and food. Like bathroom walls or air conditioners.
If you have lyme disease and mold exposure, that's a double whammy since they both bring the immune system down a LOT and they both produce toxins. I would recommend using a binder to get rid of the toxins even if you don't have the genetic issue. If it helps, great. If not, then you can stop.
Be sure to read as many posts as you can about binders here. Some people have said that it makes them sicker. Cholestyramine can be difficult to take for lyme patients which is why Dr. S. gives actos. It downregulates some hormones that make it easier to tolerate.
Here is an article in the pulication "Public Health Alert" that you may find helpful. Biotoxin Pathway Holds Key Pieces of Puzzle in Solving Chronic Illness http://tinyurl.com/m5qdqv
Binders for mycotoxins The author of mold warrior uses a combination treatment of Cholestyramine (CSM) and Actos. There are over the counter binders that may work.
These are the ones that I know about. Beta-sitosterol Butyrate Charcoal (may bind biotoxins) Chlorophyll NanoTek Chitosan modified citrus pectin Sarsparilla Cholestepure by Pure Encapsulations modifilan
Lots of links in Jam's thread that should be useful to you.
I just bought an ozone machine. I'm plaaning on doing ozone shock treatments in my house.
Terry I'm not a doctor
Posted by bettyg (Member # 6147) on :
bonny, see about automatic withdrawls for monthly bills so they are paid on time!
they take money out on the day it is due ...
best wishes my dear friend. hugs/kisses
Posted by Truthfinder (Member # 8512) on :
Treepatrol posted a link on another thread, and I ended up reading about mold issues there. Amazing. What I could not find is if this will work to help or heal the PERSON after being exposed to mold.
In any case, I'm seriously considering the purchase of a diffuser. I've used this product for years but never diffused it. I think it's time! (It would be a good flu-preventative measure, too.)
quote:In 2005, Edward Close, PhD, a mold remediation consultant with 30 years experience in the environmental industry, was asked to do third-party sampling for mold in an apartment complex that had been flooded, evacuated, and later put up for sale.
The buyer who was renovating the apartments had paid a company which had used the strongest stuff they knew of--a hospital disinfectant. Yet Dr Close's sampling showed that either the product had not killed the mold or that the mold had already re-established itself.
After much urging by his wife, he diffused Thieves oil in the apartments for a 24-hour period. The research project yielded astonishing results! And two weeks later they were even more astonishing!
In another instance, 10,667 stachybotrys mold spores were identified in a per cubic meter area. After diffusing Thieves essential oil for 48 hours, Dr Close retested. Only thirteen stachybotrys remained.
Similarly, 75,000 stachybotrys mold spores were identified in a sample of sheetrock. After 72 hours of diffusing, no stachybotrys mold spores remained.
Thanks for the Info' ,links , tho'ts ,ideas, ,question ,and encouragement!!!
Hey Little-L, I am not sure about the 'thieves' oil and so on...but I'm going to research it...
I know just sorting a few of out boxes,is making it harder for me to breath today...I'll have to take something shortly to combat this.
I have some sarsaparilla,I think? and will double up on it as well...'til I can get more info' and supplements etc. to help ease this...and kill off the mold that has transferred.
Many of our boxes are going to be tossed too...I found evidence of mice.
[Haven't found any *new ones* since we put out the traps, but what a mess, and I don't want to take a chance ! {good catch Randibear }]!
I'm curious about oil diffusion...I think it might help...get the air healthier here!!!
Well I'm off to get something to ease my breathing...and then get more junk out of here,and salvage what good things I can!
Thanks again to each replier for all the info'!!!
Just Silverwolfi'-Swampthing!
PS, <<<<< Betty >>>>> ,the banking idea is a good one...we just need to work out some logistics on what gets paid when !!!
Posted by bettyg (Member # 6147) on :
.... to read later today..
Posted by Jin (Member # 11735) on :
Dear sixgoofykids, I thought it was interesting you said the herxing from mold detox can be much worse than one from Lyme. In January, we had a major ice storm. Our power was knocked out for several days. During that time, we stayed at the apartment my grandparents had just moved out of. Although the faint feeling and fatigue were better, I had terrible diarrhea.
I rarely have it. Is it possible that the mold in our home was the trouble? Was my body trying to release the toxins? Our house has mold all over the place! There has got to be a way to get out of here. A couple of days after returning home, the faint feeling and fatigue returned.
Dear TerryK, Chlorophyll being a binder for toxic mold may explain something I could not figure out. My chiropractor gave me a chlorophyll multi-vitamin to try, and it made me queasy. Perhaps I could not tolerate the chlorophyll because it is irritating my body as a result of still living where the mold is present. Constant contact is bound to cause a reaction like this. Cladosporium is likely in the basement toilet. Who knows what kind is in the shower upstairs, in the dehumidifier, on the ceiling in the living room, or wherever it is growing (possibly under the carpet or behind the wooden panels) in the basement?
Sincerely, Jin
Posted by Silverwolf (Member # 9196) on :
Hello <<<<< Jin >>>>> ,
Sorry you are going thru the mold mess as well, you raise some good questions.
TxC and I both have IBS, w/ frequent loose bowels/diarrhea issues. And now I wonder is it just IBS???
We've lived in many older houses and trailer homes. And I am wondering how many of them may have had serious mold issues.
I also get heartburn and reflux type problems...and grumpy stomach,as well as really being fatigued.
When we have so many health issues... Lyme disease and Co's, Chronic Viruses,Mold issues causing toxins to build in our bodies,
Parasites , Heavy Metals issues, and Allergies and Food Intolerances...Wow... ,It makes me wonder,what has caused/started our issues in the beginning ????
Whatever was the first problem,and that may even differ w/ each individual,it makes it difficult to know how to proceed sometimes.
I have to believe that somewhere there are answers, things that will help us overcome the many problems that attack our bodies.
I hope that soon,y'all can get away from the mold problems, so many issues to fight... we must all become vigilant warriors!
I'll check back in later... got woke up early... so i tho't I'd check in...
Jus' the Silverwolfi Weary Swampthing
Posted by Truthfinder (Member # 8512) on :
Little Lymie, I do not recall a worsening of symptoms or a negative reaction from inhaling diffused Thieves oil.
I know one person who has major chemical and mold sensitivities, and she seems to do okay with Clove oil in the air (one of the oils in Thieves). I don't know as she has ever tried the Thieves oil.
I think bejoy used some of the oils in Thieves when she was clearing mold from her house. Maybe she will chime in here.
I've never spent a lot of time in an environment where a diffuser was running constantly. Only a few hours at a time at a friend's house where he diffused Thieves 24/7 in the living room area (and that was a number of years ago.)
My use of Thieves has been limited to periodic inhalation of mist from an atomizer/spritzer bottle. (I keep a little bottle in my kitchen cupboard of 2-5 drops of Thieves in about 2 ounces of water. I use it if I suspect there's a bug going around or someone has been in my house with a cold, etc. I mist it into the air, spray it on my pillow and bedding, and directly onto my clothes; and I also spray some in front of me, then close my eyes, walk into the mist, and inhale slowly.)
I just don't recall any bad physical reactions from inhaling the mist.
Now, RUBBING any of the oils on my body is a whole different story. And the scent of certain oils will invoke a very strong emotional response for me (but Thieves never did).
Silverwolf, as for sinus and breathing issues..... I remember my SIL's reaction when she happened to be here visiting once when I spritzed some Thieves oil in the room. She suddenly said, ``What IS that?! I can breathe again!'' She has severe sinus problems and frequently takes antibiotics for sinus infections due to scar tissue from several surgeries after a 4-wheeling accident when her face was crushed. I gave her a small amount of Thieves to take home. Never heard another word from her. Suffice it to say that she and my brother are not into anything `alternative' and do very little in the way of `prevention'. I guess it's simpler to take prescription nasal sprays and abx all the time.
FYI, I just ordered Dr. Edward Close's book `Natures Mold Rx: The Non-toxic Solution to Toxic Mold' yesterday from Amazon. I don't know who I loaned my `Mold Warriors' book to, but I suspect I'll never get that one back - too bad I didn't read it first. In some ways, this book might suit me better anyway. We'll see.
I saw that Thieves oil and some diffusers can be ordered through Amazon.
(Gee, sorry this is so long.)
Posted by TerryK (Member # 8552) on :
I've diffused thieves oil and many other oils for mold and mycotoxins. My muscle testing herbalist designed a whole program for me. I even had specific things to mix and wash the walls.
My husband has asthma and he would be uncomfortable because I think the oil would irritate his lungs. It never bothered me.
I've taken theives oil internally and never noticed anything with it. Maybe I wasn't taking enough though.
My herbalist has another client who takes it internally and she said it was very strong and to go slow.
Terry I'm not a doctor
Posted by Silverwolf (Member # 9196) on :
<<<<< Truthfinder, and Terry' >>>>>,
Years ago someone loaned us a bottle of herbal oil,very strong wonderful for sinuses...wondering if it was the Thieves mix...
A hunting I will go...this weekend at a couple of health stores here in area, !!!
Good to know we can find it on Net too...in case I can't find it in the health places!
Thanks for info'/links etc. be back after a nap!
Sleepy-Swampthing Silverwolfi
Posted by Jin (Member # 11735) on :
Dear Silverwolf, Due to having Celiac, I have come to feel IBS is just a made-up disease doctors invented to make themselves feel smart. If they do not know what is causing your intestinal or digestive issues, they automatically use this catch-all illness. The truth is, they have no idea. My mother has diarrhea constantly, but refuses to even try the gluten-free diet.
My brother and I got the illness from somewhere. Considering most cases are genetic, you would think she would stop going into denial by now. Mom takes an absurd amount of medication daily. I refer to her generic Immodium as "liquid cork". I also know it could be on both sides, since my father had ulcerative colitis as a young man.
He also refuses to accept this as a possibility. I do have an issue with where my gallbladder used to be, but it is probably wishful thinking to believe that is causing the violent reaction to gluten and lactose. Cinnamon also makes me terribly ill. I lost my gallbladder at 20 years-old, was diagnosed with Thyroid Disease the year after that, and now my teeth are going bad. I also have a monster case of yeast.
When you have that going on, you will never get well living in a home with mold. The yeast will stay put. My parents are denying this problem as well. Heartburn and reflux are major problems for me as also. They have been so severe that my teeth are getting worse, including one that is abscessed, because I cannot lay down for them to work on me.
I am also getting pain where my gallbladder used to be, as I mentioned earlier. You are right about having a difficult time discovering when everything started. So much is wrong, you end up going in circles a lot. Everything is connected somehow. Food intolerances, Candida, mold exposure, Lyme, co-infections, and then parasites all are involved.
Heavy metals do play a large role for many. A friend of mine was so loaded with mercury that she could not get anywhere for a long time. Finally, she had LED treatments done. They really broke the barrier. Her Phase II Sulfation Pathways were blocked, and various treatments for chelation and unblocking the pathways were not successful.
Dear Truthfinder, Thank you for the information and links on the Thieves Oil. I hope to get a hold of some. I think it may depend on the type of mold you are treating. There are a few really toxic ones that may harm nearly anyone. My father has sinus issues, and my mother and I have allergies to everything from mold to pet dander.
Sincerely, Jin
Posted by Truthfinder (Member # 8512) on :
Silverwolf, you might want to call around about Thieves oil. Unless a particular health food store is a `distributor' for Young Living, you won't find it in a store.
There are a number of single oils and some blends that are very good for sinus issues. Thieves just happens to kill at lot of pathogens at the same time.
Jin, I wondered that, too, about what types of mold may be affected by various treatments. Killing the mold so that it stops producing spores is one thing; eliminating the residual mycotoxins from the treated area may be the more complicated issue. Perhaps Thieves oil works on both. I hope to learn more from the book I ordered.
Thanks for the detailed info, Terry. Also, it's important to hear firsthand that the oils may be irritating to someone with certain respiratory issues.
Posted by Jin (Member # 11735) on :
Dear Truthfinder, As you said, most people do not realize that even dead mold spores are toxic. Treatments may vary. We were under the impression bleach destroys it, but the mycotoxins are not necessarily that easy to eradicate. We live by the river, are in Tornado Alley, and have a fault line nearby. All of those factors make everyone here at risk for toxic mold.
I would love to get a hold of that book you are getting. The information will be extremely helpful. Most libraries do not carry these books. If I had some extra money, I would love to get a copy. A number of websites have been helpful for me. One of the best is www.doctorfungus.com where they have physical descriptions of molds and slides you can view.
From what I can tell, the mold on the living room ceiling appears to Penicillium. It is a highly unusual teal or blue-green tint. Aspergillus and Stachybotrys could be in other locations. Until you have them under a microscope , you are not going to know for certain. As expensive as remediation is, it will probably be smarter to just move out of this home.
Sincerely, Jin
Posted by kissis (Member # 4165) on :
I am sure I live in a "mold' duplex, This is unfortunatly the longest I have ever lived any whear and im in my 40's. I really dont notice a moldy smell in the winter but in the summer when the AC is running I can smell the mustyness. And I dont get out much but when I do , say to the grocery store, or out shopping for several hours, I always feel better if I've left my house for a few hours.I would lov to get my duck work cleaned out but it is money I just cant aford, just wondering if otheres with mold also feel better after leaving for a few hours?
Posted by Jin (Member # 11735) on :
Dear kissis, It took me a few days to really notice a difference. I think this may vary from person to person. Anytime you feel better upon leaving your home, that is proof there is something in it making you worse. Our ducts have never been cleaned, and my parents have lived here for 31 years! Even if we could afford it, they would argue it makes no difference.
Sincerely, Jin
Posted by Truthfinder (Member # 8512) on :
Jin, there are some good points about the website you posted about. Like the photos. The part I read tended to downplay the dangers of stachybotrys and the persistence of mycotoxins, and it's probably good to get balancing info from the `other side'. Some of the mold articles and websites will scare the heck out of you, and that's not necessarily a good thing! However, since the site is totally sponsored by pharmaceutical companies, I have to assume that they ignore a lot of information if it isn't `scientifically' verified. As most of us know, there's a lot we don't know because it hasn't been investigated thoroughly.
I haven't made it through all of Jam's MOLD thread here at LymeNet but she often refers to Dr. Mary Short-Ray. It is Dr. Short-Ray's website where I've gotten quite a bit of information. I don't think this link has been posted here, so I'll post it. Lots of good reference material here on supplements and other detox methods, air filtration, remediation, etc.:
As for the book I ordered, well it appears to be backordered or something so I won't be getting it real soon. I don't recall seeing it on any recommended reading lists so it's a bit of a gamble. This was a `splurge' for me - I sold some stuff at a yard sale this summer and decided to spend all those funds on stuff I wouldn't normally buy for myself. This was one of those items.
Depending on your library, they may be able to get this book through an inter-library loan. I've gotten a couple of books like that through our small county library. It's a great service, and one that most people don't know about. (As I recall, they didn't even charge me postage.)
I already know I have Stachybotrys in one room, along with a couple of other `less harmful' molds in the same room (can't remember which ones at the moment). I keep that room closed off but until I can rip the entire bathroom out above the room, I can't fix the problem. And now I have leakage into another room in the basement if we get a heavy rain, so I'll have to deal with that issue. Sheesh.
I'm sure I'm affected by this, but I'm not sure how much. If my pets are any indication, I don't think the problem is too critical. My last old-timer cat was 20 years old when I put him down so that's pretty good. I guess individual susceptibility plays a big role here, too, though.
Posted by daisyrlb (Member # 15686) on :
Truthfinder--Prayer really does make a difference (scientific research has even shown that to be true). Yes to "Prayers for the Lyme Community--6 p.m. Pacific Time..." 8 p.m. Okla time. YES!
Posted by Truthfinder (Member # 8512) on :
Agreed, daisy - thanks. Posted by Jin (Member # 11735) on :
Dear Truthfinder, I was frustrated as well when I discovered drug companies were responsible for that website. I do not trust them. They really do minimize the seriousness of these molds. Exposure to at least three of those listed are dangerous for most people. I have been on the thread jam338 posted.
There is a lot of great information there. I pasted and copied a lot of it into a Word document. That included the book suggestions involving Dr. Short-Ray. The site is very helpful. Dr. Shoemaker has a great site as well.
I am happy to hear you got some money from that yard sale. We want to have one, but need to wait until the weather gets a little bit cooler. It must be disappointing to have to wait for your book. My splurges are gluten-free food that actually tastes good, or organic foods. A tight budget makes those a rarity.
I do not think our library has any of the books on mold. So far, I have checked their database and come up with nothing close to what I wanted. However, the database is quite primitive. Amazon is my best bet, but money is an issue right now. At least they have the fitness book I was looking for.
Stachybotrys is bad news. It is one of the "Toxic Trifecta" molds, as I call them. Those generally include Stachybotrys, Aspergillus, and Penicillium. Cladosporium is extremely common, but a number of these love cellulose-based house items. It is used in insulation and various other elements of a home. We have a black-looking mold in the shower, which could be Aspergillus.
Your house sounds like ours. The basement has a leak somewhere, but we cannot find it. You can smell the mold when it rains, but cannot find it anywhere. We suspect that it is behind the paneling, or even under the carpet. Since the house was built in the late 70s, it can sweat as a result of the carpet being directly on concrete.
Pets are a good indication I would think. However, I wonder if certain animals are immune to such biotoxins. Rabbits and horses are immune to the venom of the Black Widow. Unfortunately, we had a rabbit become sicker after being moved to the basement. He had a parasite called Pasteurella, which thrives in humid conditions. Rabbits do not get colds, and this parasite is responsible whenever they get similar symptoms.
It is wonderful to hear your cat had such a long life! Not many live to be that age. We were fortunate that we had some pets live a long time. At one point, we practically had a zoo. I do think some of this mold was not an issue until later. My grandfather actually said years ago that he believed the house was making us sick.
Sincerely, Jin
Posted by Truthfinder (Member # 8512) on :
Well, Jin, you got me curious so I looked in my files to see what molds came up when testing in my `mold room'. I ended up with Stachybotrys, Cladosporium, and Penicillium. That was back in 2003.
Interestingly, my air samplings in that room came up negative, even after I sort of stirred up the air in there (not too smart that I did that). I had to scrape some specimen off and send it in to get a positive test where mold actually grew in the lab.
BUT I should point out that not long ago, I unwittingly sent something that was openly stored in that room to a person who was `mold sensitive', and she definitely reacted to it. (Boy, I felt SO bad about that. I just wasn't thinking.) So, I suspect that while there may not be a lot of spores floating around in the room, the toxins are still present which won't show up on a standard air sample test.
So, Jin - you haven't done any mold testing at this point? Is your area pretty humid generally? (It isn't here.)
One smart thing I'm doing - and didn't know it until I read about it someplace yesterday - is that I run my furnace fan constantly, and as of last fall, I went back to using larger, thick, disposable, pleated `media filters' in my furnace. The filters are kind of expensive so I had stopped using them for a number of years and just used the standard skinny filters that I could wash and reuse. (The larger media filter housing has to be built into the return air ductwork so not all systems are capable of utilizing the large media filters.)
I was glad to find this info - and I think it was at the link I posted earlier - because I was beginning to think that maybe keeping the air moving around was a bad thing. But I guess it is better to move it and filter it than have the toxins and spores become concentrated in one place. Plus, more air movement helps dry the air and filters mold-contaminated dust better.
One other thing that I found out recently is that it is now `code' to vent bathroom fans DIRECTLY INTO THE ATTIC of a home! That's the most insane thing I've ever heard! Bathroom fans used to be vented through the ceiling and through the roof to the outside. The theory is that the vents are placed close to the outside edge of the roof where there is usually air movement from soffets, etc. Well, in my part of the country, for 5 months out of the year, any moisture vented into the attic is likely to freeze solid. Then when it warms up, all that ice will begin to melt and become a source of constant moisture for awhile. With all that wood framing up there, I think this is a recipe for a mold disaster.
Interesting about the rabbit and the Pastuerella. Poor bunny. I didn't know that (used to raise rabbits when I was a kid, but they were outside.)
It is amazing that my pets seem to live pretty long. My 50-pound dog will be 13 soon, and one cat is 14 and the other `new arrival' cat is 11. The dog is inside 95% of the time, and wherever I am, he is. All of us spend time in the basement every day since that's where the TV is.
Well, I could go on and on about mold stuff, I guess. In fact, I found out the other day quite by accident that it's certainly not a good idea to EAT mold, either, lol. Maybe I'll make a new thread about that little mistake. It took me quite by surprise.
Posted by Jin (Member # 11735) on :
Dear Truthfinder, Those molds are seriously dangerous! It is a wonder you have not been more ill than you are now. You do have to stir things up to get mold to reveal itself sometimes. That is why the lab tests can be frustrating. I would like to get testing done, but money is an issue.
How awful about your friend! It was not your fault, though. Your heart was in the right place. Air sample testing can be helpful if it is done properly. However, I would think mold testing on an actual spore found on a surface would yield better results.
Our area is very humid. In fact, the humidity in the basement tends to be 60 or 65 percent on an average day. When it rains, it is even worse. When our sweet bunny that I told you about was down here, his cage would be soaked on the sides from condensation. No wonder he became so ill!
I know we have used the pleated filters some of the time. I do not think we run our fan all of the time. We have the filters you wash in the vents, though. I do not know when or if they were ever cleaned. They have been swept, but it has been a long time.
Keeping air circulating is better for a lot of reasons. Your house needs to breathe. You really do not want to shut dust and other allergens in. Fresh air is necessary to improve your health. My mother used to open the windows and put the screens on during the spring and summer when I was younger. Dad smokes, and the house has not been aired out in years.
You can imagine how awful the stench is from those Cancer sticks. I am so scared I am going to get Lung Cancer or that I already have it. My grandmother on my mother's side died of it. As far as our bathroom fan goes, I think it probably goes into the attic. I am sure that does not help our situation.
Poor Digger was the sweetest bunny you have ever known. He used to allow us to flip him over like a baby and cuddle him. A lot of times, he actually would fall asleep for a minute! If you put him down on the ground to let him hop around, he would go two step away from your feet. Then, he would turn back to make sure you were still there.
It is wonderful to hear your cats are living to a ripe old age, as is your dog. We had a Standard Schnauzer that lived to be almost fifteen. That is practically unheard of, since most dogs larger than medium size live an average of ten years. My Miniature Schnauzer died at only ten from Congestive Heart Failure. She was diagnosed before we moved her into the house.
Our Yorkie that we have now has seizures. They did not start until he was a year-and-a-half old. This was right after we gave him Frontline Plus Flea and Tick Prevention. I do wonder if other factors, like toxic mold are contributing. We really need to find a naturopathic vet to help detox him. I think the Frontline is stuck in his liver, and he needs it moved out.
Your experience with moldy food sounds a lot like mine. Last summer, I had the misfortune of biting into a moldy blueberry. Can you say "yuck"? From that point on, I made sure I lick grapes and other foods first just to be safe. I can smell or taste mold from a mile away. Mold is not always visible, but that does not mean it is not there.
Sincerely, Jin
Posted by Truthfinder (Member # 8512) on :
Oh, Digger sounds like such a neat rabbit! I never had any that got particularly friendly, no matter how much I handled them and worked with them when they were tiny.
Sounds like your pets have been fairly healthy, too, generally. Oh, I think you're absolutely right about most of those commercial `flea and tick' prevention products. Like vaccinations, they seem to set the system up for `disease states'.
I wish I had a good, safe, reliable alternative to keeping insects off of our animals. There are some out there, but I just don't have enough evidence to trust using any of them.
Some friends who live in the country are always racking up vet bills with their dogs - they have 7 dogs right now. We're talking serious stuff here, too. And they use the flea and tick `drops' on their dogs religiously. Well, out in the country like that, I'm sure there is a lot of risk. I wish I had a healthy answer for them.
One product line I'm going to look into is Cedarcide. (I just found out accidentally that Walmart may actually carry some of these products.) I'm just a little confused by which products do what..... the website isn't real clear.
``[Cedarcide] BEST YET is rated the number one Flea, Bed Bug and Insect killer as published in the recent Neilson Organic Ratings Insect Control Review."
``CEDAR OIL FORMULATIONS FOR CONTROL OF FLEAS, TICKS, MITES, LICE, MANGE AND EAR MITES EVERYTHING YOU NEED TO ELIMINATE DANGEROUS SPOT DROP TREATMENTS OF YOUR PETS AND EXPENSIVE CHEMICAL PRESCRIPTIONS''
(Sorry to be putting this on your thread, Silverwolf. Didn't mean to hijack the subject.)
Posted by Jin (Member # 11735) on :
Dear Truthfinder, Digger was an amazingly good-natured bunny. He was unusually mild-mannered for any pet, really. The bunny I have now is much different. He stomps all the time, and is a spoiled little brat! I adore the little rascal.
The rabbit I own now is in my room, and doing fairly well. He escaped from his first cage three times, so I had to get a wired one. Another thing he loves to do is run around in circles. Sometimes, I wonder if he is trying to audition for Nascar! I also have tirds everywhere, because he kicks them out and I have yet to find a vaccuum that works on those things! You can imagine the hilarity of me trying to sweep up these little tirds that roll all over the place.
Flea and tick medications are really dangerous to animals. They have to be extremely strong to destroy ticks. You can imagine the neurological damage that takes place. Hartz was said to be really bad, but it did not even keep the fleas off of our dog. He got worms!
This is why we switched him to the Frontline Plus in the first place. We wish that stuff had never been used. Natural repellents are good when you can get them. As you said, the trouble is finding a reliable one. CedarCide sounds like a possibility.
Whether or not they carry it here is another story. Wal-Mart is strange here. Sometimes they have something for a while, then will not carry it for weeks or months. I am allergic to cedar, but I am also allergic to the bunny, the dog, and pine that my rabbit sits in. I just have to sniffle, because I love my furry little babies!
Thank you for the links. I am definitely going to check this option out some more. I was surprised the other day when I noticed I was not getting bit by mosquitoes despite being outside a lot. I then realized I had seasoned my beef with garlic while cooking it, and that they hate garlic. That is just more proof to me that mosquitoes are evil vampires.
Dear Silverwolf, I am sorry to hear about your poor wrist and hand. Injuries like that make everything more complicated. You need your hands for so much. I can only imagine how difficult typing is right now for you. I hope I never injure my hands, because not being able to write and draw would drive me crazy!
Sincerely, Jin
Posted by Truthfinder (Member # 8512) on :
Ha, ha - you've got great rabbit stories, Jin!
I used to try to put them in small dog harnesses so I could `walk' them. Ha! But, of course, they walked right out of a dog harness, just like a cat would. None of my `modifications' worked. Rabbits/cats aren't built to wear a harness (though it seems I've seen some for cats now).
Amazon carries some Cedarcide products, but they are more expensive than at the Cedarcide website. I'd have to see how shipping costs compare, I guess.
Sometimes you can order stuff online from Walmart and they ship it to your local store for free. Cedarcide isn't one of those - at least not that I could find.
Oh dear, if you are allergic to cedar then you should probably stay away from the Cedarcide products. That's so sad - I think cedar is one of my favorite smells. And the reviews of the products indicate that there is a definite cedar odor to them.
Silverwolf, hope your splint situation is very temporary.
Posted by karenl (Member # 17753) on :
personalconsult.com has articles.
If you can afford Dr. Sh (mold warriors), I would travel there. I was in your situation ( stroke, eye...), it takes forever to get better. Three years is a good time limit if you work very hard and with the best possible doctors. I heard there is a doctor G in Texas. Never go back, don't take anything. Borox for wash.Take care with old things like books, they contaminate everything. pm me if you need more help.
Posted by Jin (Member # 11735) on :
Dear Truthfinder, We have had six bunnies so far. All had amazing things they did. I was laughing about the harnessing of your rabbits. We tried the same thing with one of ours. He bit right out of it!
Honestly, finding something I am not allergic to is difficult. I react to certain trees, pollens, grasses, mold, ragweed, dyes, cigarette smoke, perfumes, colognes, rabbit fur, dog fur, dust, dust mites, strawberries, and tomatoes. According to the allergist, they are all mild reactions. One thing I actually am not allergic to is cats. That was surprising.
I have found that Wal-Mart has items on the site you can order in as well. I love these collapsible mixing and storage bowls they had on there. They do not have them at our local store. Anything that saves space but is still useful helps a lot. Cookware particularly can overwhelm your kitchen quickly.
Cedar and pine are two trees I know I react to. We have to use a synthetic tree at Christmas because of my allergies. It was annoying that the allergist never told me what pollens, trees, and grasses I react to upon being tested. You would think for over $400 that is the least they could do. Mold really has a terrible affect on me, and now that it has rained for days I have a massive headache.
Dear karenl, I was wondering when I was able to move out of this place if I should buy all new clothes and such. This means new furniture as well I suppose. What about my cookware? Do I need to replace it again? At least the books I can write down the titles and authors and get some at the library until I can replace them.
Sincerely, Jin
Posted by Robin123 (Member # 9197) on :
Skimming this thread tonite -
I recommend TKO Orange (www.TKOOrange.com), also sold as Orange Guard in stores, as an essential oil, nontoxic tick repellent. It's derived from oranges, is biodegradable and deters and kills bugs, including ticks.
A small amount put in a spray bottle and filled up with water can be lightly misted on dogs and cats, and sprayed on our clothing, the home, the yard, camping area and camping gear.
Posted by Jin (Member # 11735) on :
Dear Robin123, Thank you for the information on TKO Orange! We need something for our dog who has seizures. He had another one the other day. The fact that the Orange Guard can also eliminate pet odors is very important, because Yorkies mark everything. All of our furniture seems to be ruined from it.
Sincerely, Jin
Posted by karenl (Member # 17753) on :
Jin,
you can keep what you can wash. Wash it twice in the dishwashwer.
You can also wash clothes in your old house - I washed with washing powder and borox twice - and then put it in a garbage bag immedately at the washer and close tight and do not contaminate it. You can wash some shoes and bags.
I didn't take papers and got a line from a doctor that it was toxic. I did not take furniture, bedding... Borox is at Publix near the washing powder.
Cysts: I heard it might be better with kelp ( iodine missing) and progesterone.
The allergies are normal if you live in mold, they will go. My cyst is gone too.
You should move immediately, look at your health.
Wish you a better time. Karen
Posted by karenl (Member # 17753) on :
Jin, mold does cause seizures. I saw a baby with seizures from mold.
Posted by Silverwolf (Member # 9196) on :
<<<<< All Repliers >>>>>,
Thanks so much for keeping this topic up and going!!!
Finding good info' here...we've been trying to sort what to keep and what to throw away!
Still,in Splint from a tendon problem in my wrist...lately I've felt like the Swamp-things Klutzier cousin...
Will check back in later...I appreciate y'all, and the info' so very much!!!!
Silverwolfi-Swampthing-Klutz
Posted by Jin (Member # 11735) on :
Dear karenl, That is a relief that I will not have to completely throw out everything. Thank you for the information! Borax is sold at Wal-Mart here. We do not have a Publix. Our town is too unimportant.
I really do desperately want to move, but have no money. Having no income makes it impossible to get an apartment away from here. My parents are ignoring it. They just go into their own little world and tell me I am obsessive. They also refuse to accept how serious Celiac Disease is, and sharing a kitchen with them puts me at a constant risk for becoming ill.
I go through a ridiculous amount of effort just to eat, because there is gluten everywhere. I was not able to obtain disability, so I am stuck here. I even called Adult Protective Services, and they were completely useless. I would have a lot more energy if I did not have to clean everything and move everything into the other room and wash my hands a million times a day. Allergies and mold are not helping.
This may explain why no allergy medication seems to get rid of the symptoms. If mold is the actual cause, no wonder antihistamines and others do not help much if at all. I know that the dog could be sick as a result of it as well. I actually had four ovarian cysts at once, and these issues run in my mother's family. All of her cousins even had hysterectomies in their 30s.
I just thought of something else. When I was away from home for several days during an ice storm earlier this year, I ate bread with yeast without getting sick. That never happens. It was all my brother had (he is Celiac as well), and I actually did not get diarrhea or stomach cramps like I usually would. There is no way that is a coincidence.
Dear Silverwolf, I hope your wrist recovers soon! Tendon problems can be very painful. Wearing a splint does not exactly make doing everyday things easier. I am naturally a klutz, so I do not need anything else to make it worse. When I am wearing my glasses, it helps, because my depth perception was so poor due to being myopic.
Sincerely, Jin
Posted by PB4 (Member # 20799) on :
Truthfinder, When you get your new book, would you please
advise whether Close's protocol kills mold to
stop spores or eliminates residual mycotoxins.
I'd love to know and I don't anticipate getting
the book right now. I know there is a problem
with mold in my basement. I cannot afford to
have professionals to fix it. Thanks.
Karenl- Did you say you had an "eye stroke"?
Silverwolf's husnbands had one and I have
something similar. PB
Posted by Truthfinder (Member # 8512) on :
Sure, PB. Good questions. I'm not really sure what to expect from the book. It was a bit of a 'whim' when I ordered it.
It will be a awhile yet, though - don't have it yet. I'll post something about it when I have a chance to scan through it.
Posted by Truthfinder (Member # 8512) on :
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
![[Embarrassed]](redface.gif)
...![[Smile]](smile.gif)
hugs/kisses
![[group hug]](graemlins/grouphug.gif)
,![[Frown]](frown.gif)
,It makes me wonder,what has caused/started our issues in the beginning ???? ![[loco]](graemlins/loco.gif)
![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
I also know it could be on both sides, ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
![[bonk]](graemlins/bonk.gif)
![[confused]](graemlins/confused.gif)
I do not think we run our fan all of the time. We have the filters you wash in the vents, though. I do not know when or if they were ever cleaned. They have been swept, but it has been a long time. ![[rant]](graemlins/rant.gif)
I am so scared I am going to![[sleepy]](graemlins/sleepy.gif)
If you put him down on the ground to let him hop around, he would go two step away from your feet. Then, he would turn back to make sure you were still there.![[shake]](graemlins/shake.gif)
I do wonder if other factors, like toxic mold are contributing. We really need to find a naturopathic vet to help detox him. I think the Frontline is stuck in his liver, and he needs it moved out.![[lol]](graemlins/lol.gif)
Last summer, I had the misfortune of biting into a moldy blueberry. Can you say "yuck"? ![[puke]](graemlins/puke.gif)
From that point on, I made sure I lick grapes and other foods first just to be safe. I can smell or taste mold from a mile away. Mold is not always visible, but that does not mean it is not there.