Finally, I will be starting IM Bicillin next week. Unfortunately, the only way my insurance will cover it is if I get the injections at a doctor's office. The only doctor I could find to do it is over thirty miles away, but I am grateful it will be covered.
I have read previous Bicllin posts using the search function. I have a few questions. Are the shots really painful or do you get used to them? Does it help to ice the area prior to getting the shot? If so, how long should the area be iced? Should heat or ice be applied after getting the shot?
For those who have used this, were your herxes severe in the beginning? Has this med helped you?
Any information and/or tips regarding these shots will be greatly appreciated.
Posted by merrygirl (Member # 12041) on :
I did 2.4 mu 3x a week for 14 months. IT is a slow progress taking months, so be ready for the long haul.
The shots do hurt but I did get used to them. I found for myself Icing made them hurt more. After my injections I take a hot bath and it helps the pain.
Are you going to be using a numbing agent like EMLA creme before the injection?
that is really inportant. If I were you I would put the creme on before the drive and by the time you get there it will be ready. IT has to sit for an hour.
thats my 2 cents
Posted by joalo (Member # 12752) on :
I did 1.2 mu 2x's a week for fourteen months. The shots are painful in the beginning but you do get used to them.
I iced the area for five minutes before the shot and used heat after wards. I never used any numbing cream.
I never herxed on bicillin. I had slow but steady improvement. I am backsliding a little since stopping the shots in November.
[ 01-12-2010, 11:01 AM: Message edited by: joalo ]
Posted by sammy (Member # 13952) on :
I used EMLA cream (1hr before) and ice (20min before the injection). It did hurt but I found that applying heat immediately afterwards helped. Walking around for a few minutes helped too.
Since someone is going to give it too you at the doctor's office, try to lay down and not stand up. If you lay down on your stomach and turn your feet inwards toes towards each other you will be more relaxed.
Also ask the nurse or MA to inject the medication slowly. It hurts less that way, allows the muscle time to accommodate to the medication.
Good luck Posted by gardenoflyme (Member # 9261) on :
I never found the shots that painful--after.
They would hurt as you inject as you should inject slowly so you absorb the medicine and the less "lumpy" you get.
I did these 2 separate times in my course of treatment. Once per week during the first few month of treatment. Sometimes would need to wait until 10 days or 2 weeks if herx got too bad. This happened twice in the 6 months I took them.
Second time, I took them 3 times per week for about 13 months. Herxes were much more manageable and not lifestyle altering at all.
Bicillin was a good med for me!
Posted by Rumigirl (Member # 15091) on :
I have used the Emla cream an hour ahead of time (before you leave, put in on with a big band aid). And afterwards (when you come home), use a moist heating pad, that helps a lot. They hurt some, but it's manageable. and, yes, they have to be done slowly, like over 2-5 minutes or so.
Plus, they have to know where to inject---outer, upper quadrant of the butt, and rotate spots.
Posted by Sammi (Member # 110) on :
Thank you all for your very helpful replies!
I think I will give the EMLA and the ice a try to see if it helps. I guess I will have to sit on an ice block on my way to the doctor's office (brrr)!
I will also be sure to lie on my stomach and turn my toes in. The nurse said she has given these before, and I asked her if she injects them slowly and she said yes.
I am glad to know that walking and applying heat afterwards helps. It is about a 40-45 minute drive so I will not be able to apply heat until I get back.
I am glad this med seems to help each of you. Thanks again for the great responses.
Posted by sapphire101 (Member # 6638) on :
This was the best med I took. It did wonders for me but it did take a while.
I was on them for over 2 years. They do hurt but if they do it slow that helps a lot. I never used any cream or ice.
I herxed really bad on them when I first started them but gradually got to where I didn't herx at all and just felt better all the way around.
If I had to pick one thing that has helped me the most it would be bicillin. I hope you have as good a result as I did.
Sapphire
Posted by lymebytes (Member # 11830) on :
Heat worked for me - after the shot and then walk!
Posted by Myco (Member # 9536) on :
I started about 2 months ago. Herxed the first and fourth week but smooth sailing mostly. I do not ice (the nurse did not recommend because it may interfere with dispersement of meds) or numb. I have no pain from the shots if done correctly.
Really no big deal and much easier on the stomach than orals.
The question for me is whether patients can go off the shots without relapsing. I can't seem to get any straight answers from patients who have been on them a long time.
To those who posted above - Are you symptom free off the bicillin now? This would be really good to know. I don't plan on doing them for more than a year.
Posted by Loonie1980 (Member # 18637) on :
Hi all, I wish we could have a sticky about Bicillin, I'm sure I'll be doing them soon. I find it very hard to go back and search posts.
Posted by sapphire101 (Member # 6638) on :
Myco, I will be honest with you. I have relapsed but not sure the cause. I think I could have Bart and it's the problem. I really don't know.
I stopped them in Sept. and I've been really bad the last couple of months. Had to call an ambulance once with stroke like sx. I couldn't talk or walk, etc.
I wish I had better news but like I said my sx could be caused from something else. I got to where I was feeling really good on them and could do things I hadn't done in years.
I almost went back on them but decided against it. I'm going to try something else.
Sapphire
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
I like Bicillin a lot....haven't gone off yet, but so far, I am impressed.
Thank God for Bicillin.
I hear Moxatag (extended release Amoxicillin) might be an alternative.
I think it's important to get rid of all coinfections to suceed, so now that the Bicillin is handling the Lyme, I'm focusing on Bart and Babesia, and even the filaril worms, which are treated with things like Albenzadole (related to Flagyl).
Posted by Myco (Member # 9536) on :
It would be great if everyone who has been on Bicillin long term would give feedback! Thanks.
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
I've been on it over 6 months...so not super long. At this point, I don't seem to be herxing anymore, but I'm planning on staying on it at least a year.
Posted by gardenoflyme (Member # 9261) on :
It has been about 18 months since my second round of Bicillin. Hubby gave me shots for about one year. Went to Biaxin then Minocycline each after the Bicillin. Now I only take Samento and some rotating herbals and am holding my own and still moving forward one baby step at a time.
I can honestly say this disease is no longer lifestyle inhibiting, just causes some "slow days".
It has been 8-9 years of treatments for me but considering this is the winter and it has been a cold one, I am doing very, very well and did well last winter also. Just not well enough to pull everything and go it alone.
I must say I have used some therapies I never even knew existed. Some helped more than others. Bicillin definitely helped alot.
Posted by Myco (Member # 9536) on :
What about for late stage lymies who never took rocephin? I took doxy and zith and rifampin on and off for a few years and improved alot but recently went onto IM BIcillin 2x a week because I wanted to get a higher dose into my body to see if it would get rid of my remaining symptoms.
Anyone do well on Bicillin without having to do IV first?
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
Myco,
I think it does happen. I have seen people post on here that Bicillin got them or someone they know better (along with some orals), and I know for a fact some of them never did IV.
I have done IV, a long time ago, but I don't think it helped me a lot. The Bicillin seems to be helping me more than IV did. I did IV Doxy then IV Rocephin (the latter just for one month).
Posted by Chronic Triathlete (Member # 15245) on :
Of the people Bicillin helped, was it mostly your physical symptoms (joints, muscle pain, etc.) or your neuro stuff that it took care of?
I'm talking to my LLMD on Monday about Bicillin, but 75% of my issues are neuro. Very few physical.
Just wondering if it's right for me.
Thanks! /CT
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
I don't have a lot of physical symptoms, but I feel it has helped me. My main symptom is fatigue. I don't really have the twitches or buzzing sensations, or muscle/joint pain as major symptoms. Only get them in passing.
Overall, it just seems to give me a boost. Cognitive for me has been helped more by treating bartonella. Fatigue and the all-over "sick" (heavy body) feeling got better from Bicillin I would say, though slowly.
The other people I talked to that were helped by Bicillin, I get the sense that it helped them in pretty much every area they were having problems (so beyond muscles/joints). It works slowly though, so it's not like you wake up, and a symptom is better.
I'm not sure what neuro symptoms you are talking about exactly? But my main symptoms are fatigue and all over sick feeling. Like mono.
The Bicillin hasn't totally eliminated them yet, so I may need more babesia treatment for that, but the Bicillin is helping the process along.
Posted by Chronic Triathlete (Member # 15245) on :
@Hoosier51... my symptoms are mainly brainfog and some minor tingling in my feet. I also feel over all slow and maybe heavy, but not really "fatigued" in the way that many here describe. I run 3 to 10 miles a day without any physical payback.
After hearing that the shots need to be taken for a year or more I'm almost tempted to skip it and go right for 3-4 months of IV. I guess it all comes down to what the insurance picture looks like.
Anyone else see resolution/improvement in neuro symptoms from Bacillin?
Thanks! /CT
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
It would probably at least help the all-over slowness, if it helps you at all. Can't speak one way or another on the brain fog, because I have never asked people if Bicillin helped that.
Bactrim DS helped my brain fog, but I also tested positive for bartonella henselae. So it would depend on if you had Bart.
My LLMD doesn't think my fatigue is likely to be from Lyme itself...he thinks there might be something else going on causing it, like babs or mycoplasma, etc.
Posted by coltman (Member # 21272) on :
I been using bicillin for 2 month. I buy it overseas and its dirt cheap ($3 /shot) .
My bicillin is also actually mixed with procaine short acting part which makes the shot painless. I do the shots myself and frankly the pain barely comes into picture -the spot is sometimes sore the next day but nothing major. Shot itself is completely painless. just make sure you use long needle - if it leaks (or worse injected) subcutaneously the soreness is much much worse and there is bump
First few shots were the hardest (psychologically hard to stick yourself with long needle) but with good sharp needle it is actually painless.
Biggest trouble I ran into is actually mixing the powder (there are a few little details ) and injecting it without clogging the needle. I do sometimes have to change the spot replace the needle and repeat again. With 18G needle it always works but that needle is imho too big to use regularly (it causes bleeding and more soreness). I found that relaxing helps but its rather hard to maintain when you doing shots yourself, I also found that mixing it with large amount of solution (7-8 CC) helps too
Anyways here is summary to make shots painless (if you dont use powder 1) and 2) do not apply):
1) Use sodium chloride and not water for injection 2) Use powder with procaine penicillin mixed with benzathine (it also provides more "oomph" -procaine penicillin is short acting but reaches much higher blood concentrations) or use lidocaine 3) use long sharp needle with smallest gauge possible (for penicillin 21G usually the smallest you can get away with) 4) relax
I inject fast and it frankly does not make difference to me . Nor does the volume (I did up to 12 cc - no difference)
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