TSH 2.150 Free T3 2.5 Free T4 1.09 Antibodies Normal
During the 48 days I've supplemented my Adrenals- and for 30 of those days I supported my thyroid with supplements (no iodine, no synthetics, no armour)
My Naturopath said the Free T3 was on the low end. But I'm about to start Iodine supplementation soon. So there's a good chance I can get that rT3 number down and get the Free T3 up a little bit.
Is this decent improvement though? Or can these thing fluctuate this much by the hour/day?
-Hey at least nothing got worse : )
Posted by seekhelp (Member # 15067) on :
The numbers don't look horrid to me. Yes, I believe numbers can fluctuate a lot daily. Remember, this could put them in a better place too though.
Posted by Lemon-Lyme (Member # 19229) on :
Both results are within what would be considered a normal fluctuation. You probably could have had both tests done within the same day, separated by several hours, and gotten similar results.
That said, at least the numbers didn't get worse. And overall, they look pretty good. T3 and T4 are on lowish side, but maybe iodine will help there.
Just avoid soy, if you eat it in large quantities for some reason. It's not very thyroid friendly.
Posted by Pinelady (Member # 18524) on :
How do you feel?
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
Cold hands, cold feet Low Body Temp Hair falin out
Posted by Pinelady (Member # 18524) on :
I don't know what dosage synthroid you are on but I take 100 and have the same symptoms. But hair is much better than in beginning.
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
I'm not on synthroid.
I support my thyroid with selenium, zinc, tyrosine, etc etc
Posted by Pinelady (Member # 18524) on :
Thsts great if it works for you.
Posted by djf2005 (Member # 11449) on :
cane for your cold feet and hands, perhaps take something for hypercoagulation like serrapeptase or nattokinase which will thin your blood and increase circulation.
for the hair loss, it will resolve once treatment is effective (whenever that is...lol)
low body temp is indicative of thyroid/adrenal issues as you know, but there is no magic fix for this, that's for sure. some report changes w/ synthroid/armour, others not.
Derek
Posted by TX Lyme Mom (Member # 3162) on :
This is our favorite website for looking up answers on thyroid questions.
I would jsut feel horrible with numbers like that. I need my ft4 and ft3 at least in the middle, and better somewhere above the middle.
Most other people need their numbers above the midpoint too.
(I see you are not taking any Armour or anything, then it is okay to have a highish TSH like you have. Normal TSH is very close to 1, most normal people have a TSH around 1 and 2 and 3 and more are just a few outlayers.
Many patietns on thyroid hormones get low TSH or undetectable TSH, and thta is logical since TSH is a signal hormone from the pituitary that screams at the thyroid gland to send out more thyroid hormone. Now when you take thyroid hormones, the TSH does not need to scream...
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
Ya- my naturopath won't put me on any real thyroid replacement because she said it'll be like beating a dead horse (my adrenals)
I definitely will say that she conquered A LOT of my symptoms just by supplementing my adrenals.
But I feel like now I need to focus on thyroid and get it to come around.
I'll let you guys know if the iodine makes a big difference. I just did a loading test to see how deficient I am (I know I am deficient... most people are)
Thanks djf,
I'll look into those.
Posted by ping (Member # 6974) on :
canefan17 - Please DO let us know how the iodine works for you, as I might be starting it soon.
What type / brand / % iodine is your Naturapath putting you on?
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
Not sure yet- I get the results back in about 10 days.
probably Iodoral or Lugols if I had to guess.
Posted by ping (Member # 6974) on :
I'm doing Lugol's, 2%.
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
You already start?
You ramping up to 50mg?
Posted by ping (Member # 6974) on :
Not starting until next weekend. Have to make sure most of the thyriod meds are out of the picture and that will be another week.
Don't think I'm going to aim for 50; haven't quite decided yet. Starting as low a dose and percentage as possible. I think any results will take a while.
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
So you're gonna stop thyroid meds?
What do you do for thyroid and adrenals currently?
Posted by ping (Member # 6974) on :
cane, I'm on PSP (Allergie-Immun) and I need to come as close to minimal meds as possible in order to find out if PSP is working and allow it to do it's job. Right now, ramping down from ~75mg Armour and adrenals are in good shape, but support for them is all food and drink items.
Since my Lyme has been in remission for about 3 years, many of my systems have improved. The 2 that need further improvement are thyroid and hypertension.
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
I've read a lot of people have success with iodine. Goodluck.
Oh and coconut oil (which I'm sure you already do)... can really help to ween off prescription thyroid meds.
Posted by ping (Member # 6974) on :
Thanks for the well wishes; and also to you!
No, I don't do coconut oil.
Posted by pas (Member # 22416) on :
Hey Cane and Ping,
Just wanted to let you know that iodine is a huge NO-NO with autoimmune hypothyroidism. Probably worth reading about before launching into supplements...
If your hypo-t is not autoimmune, don't worry about it though.
I think most people feel best with their FT3/FT4 in the upper 1/3 of range, and TSH around 1.
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
pas,
I'm worried about this. But I've tested for antibodies TWICE now and it was normal both times.
but one of my MD's in Houston said... "I wouldn't risk it."
***!! So what do I do??
Posted by ping (Member # 6974) on :
quote:Originally posted by pas: Hey Cane and Ping,
Just wanted to let you know that iodine is a huge NO-NO with autoimmune hypothyroidism. Probably worth reading about before launching into supplements...
If your hypo-t is not autoimmune, don't worry about it though.
pas - This is an excellent point. I'm not sure what to think in my case though. Since I'm in remission and TBD is not the primary factor, I really can't make heads or tails of if mine is an autoimmune case or not and my doc is not much help at all.
Can you provide any links. We might be looking in different places, but maybe not.
Thanks pas!
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
pas bump
Posted by pas (Member # 22416) on :
The Merck Encyclopedia says:
"People with Hashimoto's thyroiditis should avoid excess iodine (which can cause hypothyroidism) from natural sources, such as kelp tablets and seaweed."
It's also contraindicated in the One Earth Herbal Sourcebook and several other good herbal texts...
I was told the same thing by my alternative GP (not to take kelp/iodine). I know many people with Hashi's that have had adverse reactions to supplemental kelp - worsening of hypo symptoms and changes in function that took months to resolve.
Cane, at least 15% of people with Hashi's test negative for antibodies...this can be for a number of reasons:
-you may have been hypo for long enough that the gland is destroyed, and your body does not perceive a reason to keep "attacking"
-your autoimmunity may be caused by something other than antibodies (T-cell mediated)
-you may have low IgG
I don't have antibodies to my thyroid, but my identical twin sister does. But I have clinical disease (labs and symptoms) and she doesn't. Our mother has Hashi's diagnosed with biopsy but never tested positive for antibodies.
I have antibodies to my stomach (parietal cells) but not to my adrenals, small bowel, etc. But I have Addison's Disease (adrenals), Celiac, vitiligo, atrophic gastritis, and a bunch of other stuff.
I have low total IgG and this can be responsible for the lack of antibodies. A rise in IgG can make the antibodies re-appear (IVIG therapy can induce the production of antibodies for this reason).
Antibodies wax and wane the same way with endocrine disease as they do with Lyme. So yes, it's possible your hypo-t is totally attributable to Lyme and will resolve once you're healthy (I hope this is the case for you!).
On the other hand, it might be autoimmune...but either way, you need a working thyroid to be able to fight the fight! I would feel crummy if my labs looked like yours. And you can't possibly metabolize your meds/supplements normally if you're hypo.
If I were you, I'd treat the thyroid with Naturethroid/Armour/compounded T3-T4, etc. I think you'll feel like a new person. Just my opinion, though!
Posted by Sammi (Member # 110) on :
Everyone is different, but I would also feel horrible with these results.
Some people, including myself, feel their best when the Free T3 is in the upper 1/3 of the range. It took me a long time to find a doctor to work with me on this, but raising the Free T3 has helped me tremendously.
It can take time to get adrenal and thyroid function optimal.
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
Sammi,
What did you take?
Posted by Sammi (Member # 110) on :
canefan17, I take Armour and Cytomel. When my Free Ts were in the low normal range, I felt terrible and had a lot of low thyroid symptoms.
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
If I were you, I'd treat the thyroid with Naturethroid/Armour/compounded T3-T4, etc. I think you'll feel like a new person. Just my opinion, though!
^^^^ what is compounded T3-T4
Posted by Sammi (Member # 110) on :
Since this is working for me, I am not going to mess with it! When I am unable to find Armour though, I will switch to compounding.
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
What does compounding mean?
Posted by Sammi (Member # 110) on :
Compounding pharmacies make customized medications for people. Sometimes people need specific strengths not available or need a different form of a medication due to allergies etc. They can also make time released formulas for many meds.
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
I wish I could go on armour and just call it a day.
Stinkin armour!!
Posted by Sammi (Member # 110) on :
You could try calling a compounding pharmacy in your area to see if they can make something similar to Armour.
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
Would it be considered natural?
It's still synthetics right (sorry.... as much as I do know about thyroid/adrenals... I get so confused with all the different treatments)
Posted by Sammi (Member # 110) on :
Yes it would be. I was told by a compounding pharmacy in my area that they can make something similar to Armour and that they are making it for those who are unable to get Armour.
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
So it's porcine? that's what I don't get.
What animal? lol
Posted by Sammi (Member # 110) on :
I am not sure. That would be a good question to ask them!
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
haha ok. Thanks
Posted by Sammi (Member # 110) on :
Good luck!
Posted by pas (Member # 22416) on :
Compounded thyroid (T4 and T3) are not usually porcine/bovine. Technically they are synthetic, but they are bioidentical. Through a compounding pharmacy, the only filler should be magnesium (or something like it). So at least you're not dealing with lots of additives. It's just hormone and magnesium.
Since Armour is off the market for now, the compounded meds are the next best thing. I think some people still use Naturethroid, etc. And apparently you can buy glandulars from Canada or something...I'm not sure.
Right now I take Synthroid and have just added Cytomel (T3). After my dose of T3 is determined, I'll switch to slow-release compounded T3 and compounded T4.
Armour contains much more T3 than some people can handle. This is especially true if you have adrenal problems. In this case, the compounded meds are better because they can be adjusted to suit you...
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
pas,
makes sense my man. Appreciate it.
Would someone still need to worry about hashi's if they used compounded meds?
Like you were saying with iodine?
Posted by pas (Member # 22416) on :
Hey Cane,
Compounded meds are just hormones. So you'd be replacing what you don't make anymore. Doesn't have anything to do with autoimmunity. It's just replacement.
I think the iodine just aggravates the gland. That's my understanding, anyway.
p.s. I'm a woman! Oh, SNAP! But I forgive you, haha! Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
haha sorry - I forget this site is 95% female
Ya, replacement hormones wouldn't effect autoimmune, makes sense... I'm not thinking much tonight as you can see.
: )
I guess I'm gonna keep on trucking... treat Lyme, support my adrenals and see if those numbers don't get better in a month or so.
I want to avoid synthetics all together if possible : )
Posted by pas (Member # 22416) on :
Believe me, I understand wanting to avoid synthetics! Had a long talk with my doc yesterday about that, as a matter of fact.
He pointed out the fact that we need our hormones to fight, and if we wait for things to "turn back on" while we have Lyme...we'll be waiting for a long time, treatment will actually take longer, etc.
He keeps saying "band-aid and heal, band-aid and heal". Fix the little problems for now (I know, thryoid isn't a little problem...but comparatively speaking...) so the healing process is quicker. Get control/rid of the infections and then see if the glands recover.
I don't know. Makes sense to me, though. Hypothyroidism makes us feel depressed, and I really believe that slows the healing process.
As long as your thyroid isn't autoimmune, you can always try weaning off your meds later. This would have to be done slowly and carefully, but it's possible to regain function.
It's great that you're supporting the adrenals first, but I really think you should address the thyroid! There are still naturals/dessicated available - just not Armour brand. Worth a shot!
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
pas,
Ya.... thanks.
If I did anything I would probably use compounded T3 T4.
Like you said... armour can be tough on adrenals.
So maybe I'll do some T3 T4 meds while I'm doing treatment for Lyme... then when i put this thing into remission I'll work on weaning off and rebuilding the gland.
: )
All sounds good in theory... but my naturopath in Houston is gonna KILL ME. lol
Maybe I won't tell her until I start.
- So is the only true test to rule out hashimotos getting an ultra-sound? Is it even worth it at this point?
Posted by massman (Member # 18116) on :
Heal the glands as you treat the lyme ! Radical thought, I know.
Old hippies still have some radical thoughts.
pas - your doc is not an old hippie ?
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
mass,
Most LLMD's don't think you have a chance at rebuilding while fighting lyme.
*shrugs shoulders*
(I will forever be split in this discussion of thyroid support) haha
-- If we take a low dose compounded T3 T4... will that be enough? Does the thyroid still continue to do SOME work on it's own?
Or the second you start synthetics the thyroid just stops all together. if so, then how is a low dose synthetic supplement enough.
What's stopping somebody from REBUILDING the thyroid with supps WHILE taking synthetics during Lyme treatment?
Posted by massman (Member # 18116) on :
Those LLMDs are like many people. Clueless on newer things.
Let's sit them down and get them to memorize that Steve Earle song that says:
"Whatever you do Be a seeker"
They do not want to learn from their patients ? Are they continually playing that "I'm smarter than you" game ?
Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
What does it take to rebuild the thyroid gland anyhow?
![[lol]](graemlins/lol.gif)