So today I went to an infectious disease doctor. Thankfully I am already on meds but I went to see him to test me for co-infections, which he is doing. However, he said alot of ignorant things today and I can tell hes totally ignorant about Lyme. He said that once you get treated 21 days for lyme, it is gone and will not come back. And that anyone who thinks their lingering symptoms after treatment are related to lyme is crazy. altho he said one thing that sounded really dumb but it kind of got me thinking he said
"Lyme disease has only been discovered since the mid 70's, but tons of people were bitten by ticks before that and they ended up being fine. tons of people had lyme disease before treatment came along for it and they were fine. so people dont really need treatment"
what is your response to him saying that. I dont see how its possible that the people who gotten bitten in the 1950's and such didnt get lyme and didnt get lyme symptoms and if they did it just went away on its own with no medical treatment? that sounds absolutley bogus..
what do you think?
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
- I wonder what lab he is using for your other tick-borne disease tests.
He does not sound like he would have scouted out the best labs. THAT's what I'd be concerned with. He is speaking nonsense, of course, but you don't have time or energy to get ensnarled in that.
Move on to a LL doctor. -
Posted by momindeep (Member # 7618) on :
Did people have Lyme disease before the 70's? I mean, it could be possible that it did not exist, and I only say this because of the Plum Island debacle.
Or did it exist before the seventies? Does anyone know?
Posted by lou (Member # 81) on :
Have your read Polly Murray's book on lyme? She and her family were getting sick from lyme in the 1950s, and they definitely needed treatment.
Posted by kday (Member # 22234) on :
I would ask him if he thinks underlying immunodeficiencies and natural killer cell abnormalities from a condition like CFS could possibly make infections such as Lyme chronic.
There can be chronic viruses such as mono (and more), and these weren't recognized as chronic conditions until 1985 after the first major CFS outbreak in Incline Village, NV. This proves that things that used to not be regarded as chronic conditions can become chronic conditions. The world isn't stagnate. Science isn't stagnate. It changes.
Could something about our immune system (an abnormality) promote persistent bacterial infections such as Lyme Disease?
Also pathogens can evolve very rapidly, and new (more resistant) strains can emerge. Look at MRSA as an example. That's pretty new here and it continues to get more resistant. It made its first major appearance in the U.S. in 1981 among intravenous drug users.
Even if Lyme wasn't a chronic condition back then, does that mean it couldn't become chronic condition? If you study science, it's obvious that the answer is no.
It seems that your ID doc believes in a stagnant world, where nothing changes.
I don't even argue with these doctors anymore. If I say anything (sometimes it's just not worth saying anything when you sense arrogance) I just say facts that make the ducks stop quacking. Whether I influence them or not, I don't know, and I don't care anymore.
Posted by kidsgotlyme (Member # 23691) on :
It's really sad that our medical schools in this country are producing such dummies.
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
That was stupid!! I've had Lyme since the late 50's.. Tell him I'll be glad to talk to him about it!! (not really.. I don't talk to IDiots)
It's been around for hundreds of years.
Posted by purplemom (Member # 21064) on :
I had an ID doc tell me that IF my daughter had lyme she is probably immune from getting it again. **JACKASS** (note **CDC positive IGM, preceded by a tick bite, 6 weeks of fevers and muscle aches and then bell's palsy with our dog infested with ticks and positive for lyme at the same time**) And this was a pediatric ID and the only children's hospital in the state--well known as a teaching hospital for an Ivy league college.
I very carefully listened to what he had to say and repeated back to him what he said to me--"immunity from lyme" are you kidding? This is not the chicken pox.
Her IGG never converted to positive so he questioned whether or not it was lyme to begin with (**note also that she responded to antibiotics**)
It is so important to get your own education. I have had more than one JACKASS experience and realized that pretty quickly.
Posted by 'Kete-tracker (Member # 17189) on :
All of us here know that Most "ID docs" are worthless when it comes to getting Proper treatment for Lyme disease, even 'early-stage'. They're TRAINED to believe in the IDSA way of seeing the world.
But this guy seems to be saying things regards Lyme infections that are SO foolish, ignorant & even non-sensical, that calling Him a quack would be insulting to the intelligence of ducks.
I honestly wouldn't trust THIS guy even for interpreting any of those co-infection test Results! I'd take [copies of] the results to another doc, if I were you. Posted by sammy (Member # 13952) on :
Tons of people died from strep before penicillin was discovered. Does that mean we shouldn't use antibiotics to treat strep?
Tons of people had leprosy before we had treatment for it too. Should we not treat them, go back to having leprosy colonies?
That doctor's comments were absolutely ridiculous.
Posted by nenet (Member # 13174) on :
Wow that's some amazing willful ignorance from that ID doc. He seems to be confused over a very basic concept of clinical medicine (and basic logic for that matter).
Your question has been part of some debate for a while. Though Lyme bacteria have been around at least since before the last Ice Age, it is possible that there could have been more recent "changes" made to an already existing pathogen to increase its virulence, etc..
Whether any recent changes to the Lyme-causing strains of Borrelia spirochetes would be through natural mutation or external manipulation is another question that is also sometimes raised.
But, back to the ID's absurd statement (just because I feel like arguing against an absent ID Lyme-denier extraodinaire) - just because there is not a name or treatment for a condition does not mean that it doesn't exist.
I do a lot of historical records research in my genealogy work, and have read hundreds of death records and other historical info. Many conditions and causes of death in previous decades and centuries were labeled as rheumatism, senility/dementia, endocarditis, dropsy, and other more obscure conditions.
For instance:
People were at times warned to watch out for an "epizootick", which apparently was meant to refer to "a disease found in animals, primarily cattle, which could be transmitted to humans." It was a term improperly used as a catchall for all kinds of ailments.
So, like people with the disease that later was labeled as Multiple Sclerosis, but was originally called "Faker's Disease"(!!!), those with Lyme Disease used to have any number of labels for their ailments, usually describing whatever parts or systems in their bodies were most effected.
This is still happening of course, because of the lack of correct identification and diagnosis of Lyme Disease. There are tons of people out there with no diagnosis at all, or misdiagnoses of things like CFS, Lupus, Rheumatoid Arthritis, Parkinson's, MS, etc. etc., that actually have Lyme.
[ 10-14-2010, 12:02 AM: Message edited by: nenet ]
Posted by nenet (Member # 13174) on :
If you're curious, here's a link to a blog referencing several studies looking at the age of Lyme-causing bacteria:
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