do you have a favorite flavor of either, abxnomore?
Posted by Abxnomore (Member # 18936) on :
I always use plain when I can. I like to add my own flavor by way of organic frozen berries.
The paleo meal only comes in flavors so I have tried both vanilla and chocolate. Both good and you can add frozen berries to the vanilla for more flavor.
Posted by Carol in PA (Member # 5338) on :
I also found it at Amazon.com. Less expensive when you sign up for their "subscribe and save" program. (You can cancel that any time.)
Carol
Posted by sammy (Member # 13952) on :
I like Jay Robb whey protein powder. I've tried both the vanilla and strawberry flavors, both are great, very mild tasting. The powder mixes easily with a spoon, no chunks, no blender or shaker required. It is much cheaper to order this stuff online at places like amazon.com instead of vitamin stores.
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
- WHY WHEY NEEDS SPECIAL TREATMENT:
If you use whey, be sure it is undenatured whey and from a animals not exposed to farm chemicals and allowed to be free GRAZING.
And, here's why it is important NOT to put undenatured whey in a blender - and also not to combine it with most foods: ---------------
ImmunePro RX� contains Lactoferrin, Immunoglobulins (IgGs), Bovine Serum Albumin, Active Peptides and Growth Factors to promote optimal immune function and detoxification. . . .
� What is the best way to store ImmunePro RX�?
60 degrees Fahrenheit (or cooler) in a dry location; refrigeration is acceptable.
� What is the best solution to mix it in?
Purified water is the best liquid to thoroughly mix ImmuneProRx�. Use a sealable container to shake it, or a MANUAL eggbeater.
� Do not use an electric blender. The whey proteins are easily denatured through heat and pH change.
Mixing the whey protein with any other types of food can induce a pH change and slow the transit time in the stomach through its digestive response to the solid food.
Liquids that are not neutral in their pH can also denature the proteins, for example: most fruit juices, coffee, and tea. By following the above guide, the uptake of the undenatured protein fractions in the upper small intestine is optimized.
A small amount of Stevia is an acceptable sweetener, if desired, for palatability. . . . -
Posted by momlyme (Member # 27775) on :
My LLMD suggested whey powder because it helps the body make glutahione... and I was asking for IV glutathione.
So she asked me to try it. Someone on the board suggested BioChem (can't remember who) so I tried that one through vitacost.
The kids HATE it. (chocolate fudge) Hubby and I like it... but we don't love it. I don't tend to waste anything, so I will drink it myself.
How about taste?
Can these others be much better tasting? The kids complain about a smell. I don't smell anything offensive... but you would think I was trying to feed them poop.
Posted by sammy (Member # 13952) on :
The Jay Robb powders smell and taste good (I really like the strawberry). You can get single serving packets at the vitamin shoppe and GNC and probably online. That way the family can taste them before you invest in a whole tub.
Posted by FYRECRACKER (Member # 28568) on :
you all are awesome! keep the posts coming if anyone thinks of anything else...
Posted by FYRECRACKER (Member # 28568) on :
i think i'll start with source naturals for now since i work at a health food co-op and get 50% off supplements. The other ones sound awesome too but these bills are adding up quick and need to do cost control when i'm able.
I see with Source Naturals and Keebler's suggested powder that the Protein amount is seemingly low. When i was trying to gain weight i was looking for something that had at least over 15 grams of protein in it. These ones have around 4-8 grams in 1 scoop?
Hmmm, what is that about?
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
- It's best to get major sources of protein from whole foods. the benefit of whey is that this is light - easy on the stomach - hardly any taste or substance at all but beneficial to get some chain reactions going.
This will not replace whole foods and is not intended as a beverage, really but a few select foods can make it enjoyable. It is a medical light food that has subtle power but will not replace a meal. -
Posted by Carol in PA (Member # 5338) on :
The amino acids in the undenatured whey provide your liver with the stuff it needs to make glutathione.
You also need magnesium, fish oil, CoEnzyme Q10.
The liver uses glutathione to detoxify poisons in the body, such as the neurotoxins left behind by the dead Lyme bacteria.
I read that uptake of the whey begins in the mouth, and that you can chew on a spoonful of it. I did that when I started out on ImmunePro RX™.
The Source Naturals whey is lightly flavored and sweetened with stevia, so it's not too bad.
Carol
Posted by FYRECRACKER (Member # 28568) on :
got coq10 and waiting for good source of alpha lipoic to take with it. fish oil and plant oil, and soon to be on IV magnesium plus other goodies.
from what i gather the source naturals is non-denatured so gonna start there and work my way up. will post a report i'm sure at some point.
I'm eating meat and veggies as much as possible, very important indeed.
thanks for the tips all! Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
I like Biochem vanilla. The other flavors taste horrible.
Jay Robb is okay in a pinch.
Posted by jarjar (Member # 8847) on :
My favorite that my Dr. recommends is Ves Pro Nitroplex, it's easy for you system to breakdown and contains growth hormone enhancers which many of us need. They are currently out of the product for the first time unless some came in recently. So I bought Jay Robb a few weeks ago.
Posted by chaps (Member # 25286) on :
My understanding is that (as Keebler mentioned) taking regular old whey protein powder is virtually useless.
It has to be UNDENATURED in order to have it's glutathione precursing and immune boosting properties. For a person with Lyme or with mercury toxicity, there's almost no point in taking whey protein if it's not undenatured. Undenatured whey will help build up L-glutathione in cells, help to detoxify, and strengthen the immune system. Denatured whey doesn't do these important things.
If it gets shipped through hot weather, that could denature it.
If you mix it in a blender, that will generate enough heat to denature it.
Bluebonnet nutrition makes an undenatured whey that is less expensive than ProHealth's ImmunePro or Immunocal (recommended by a CFS guru doctor in N.C.) but the Bluebonnet brand has vanilla in it. Most of us with leaky gut have allergies to vanilla (whether aware of it or not).
I've tried the Bluebonnet. It's sticky and gooey. I much prefer the other two brands which aren't cheap, by the way.
I'd go with ImmunePro or Immunocal. I scoop it dry into my mouth and just let my saliva begin digesting it before swallowing it. I take it on an empty stomach and let it digest for 20 minutes before eating or drinking anything. This is supposed to yield the best absorption and prevent ph contamination from other foods.
Both of these brands have a plain, but palatable flavor. I don't look for flavored stuff. I want to get well and I'm not concerned about tickling my taste buds with tasty delights.
Posted by richedie (Member # 14689) on :
I like Whey Factors.
Posted by chaps (Member # 25286) on :
Here's a good link for info on non-denatured whey:
And below is an article I found on Yahoo about it:
quote: "What is undenatured whey protein?
A denatured whey protein is one that is processed at temperatures that are above 1600 Fahrenheit or 72 degrees Celsius, a process called pasteurization.
Milk bought from stores undergoes pasteurization to kill all micro organisms that may be harmful to your health.
Undenatured whey protein is therefore protein from whey that has not been denatured, i.e. it is the opposite of denatured whey protein. Its processing involves destroying harmful micro organisms without harming amino acids that are heat sensitive. These amino acids make the undenatured whey protein bioactive and are called branched chain amino acids.
To achieve undenatured whey protein, it is not pasteurized. This preserves the amino acids that are heat sensitive. An Undenatured whey protein, having a high biological value, contains amino acids in large quantities.
The undenatured whey protein deception
Due to people's awareness of the value of whey protein, manufacturers are making products and insinuating that the product provides the undenatured whey enzymes. But by the fact of it being in a tub, is a clear indication of the contrary. Undenatured whey protein is expensive to make.
How to tell if a protein is a denatured whey protein
Exposure to air, heat or moisture reduces bioactivity. Flavoring also reduces bioactivity since it involves hydrolyzation i.e. denatured to mix easily.
Undenatured whey protein is always extremely difficult to mix and unflavored. This is the perfect test. Any protein that is not undenatured whey protein will not help in raising glutathione in your cells."
That confirms what I was told by a very knowledgeable person on the topic. If it's got flavoring, such as vanilla, strawberry, chocolate, whatever, then it's not the real deal.
Posted by FYRECRACKER (Member # 28568) on :
Awesome info chaps! thank you!!
Posted by SEREN J WEED (Member # 7280) on :
Is that true, Chaps & others, that if the Whey has flavoring it's not the real deal? Bummer if so!
My question; What is the difference between Isolate and Undenatured?
I keep running into the word Isolate and no mention of the word Undenatured.
Posted by momlyme (Member # 27775) on :
Chaps - I can't get that link to work... tried the root domain too. Problem loading the page.
??? Anyone else have the same problem?
Posted by chaps (Member # 25286) on :
Seren J:
quote: Exposure to air, heat or moisture reduces bioactivity. Flavoring also reduces bioactivity since it involves hydrolyzation i.e. denatured to mix easily.
I can only quote what the article says about flavoring. I'm not a scientist and can not elaborate.
As far as the question about "isolate" is concerned:
All whey protein is an isolate. Whey is a liquid by product that is produced when cheese is made. Whey protein isolate is created by isolating the globular proteins from that liquid by-product.
Once the whey protein isolate is created, it's what you do from there that counts. Further processing, such as adding flavoring, heating, mixing, any changes that affect ph, etc. can denature the whey protein. I would imagine that adding your own flavoring with berries or sweeteners would probably denature it because adding those things can change the ph.
If all you are using the stuff for is buidling muscle, then denaturing probably doesn't matter a whole lot.
And I don't think bodybuilders without any health problems are going to be hanging around Lymenet, so for all intents and purposes, denatured whey is useless to anyone here. Lyme or CFS patients absolutely do not want anything else but undenatured whey for reasons stated in my previous post.
To sum it up:
All whey protein is an isolate. Not all whey protein is undenatured. Undenatured = Good Denatured = Bad Flavored = Denatured, hence Flavored = Bad
The only undenatured whey products out there that I know of that are truly undenatured and not flavored are ImmunePro, Immunocal, and IMUPlus.
Everything else that's been mentioned on this thread thus far is flavored.
If anyone out there is taking unflavored, undenatured whey protein and it's not one of the one's I've mentioned, I'd like to know what it is, because all three of the ones that I've mentioned are not cheap. I'd love to find one that's less expensive, but I doubt it's possible, because sweating the details to provide truly undenatured whey is not cheap, even the packaging.
Mixing this stuff with juice will denature it.
Since the initial uptake of active peptides is in the mouth, this is why I don't mix it with anything. I just put the powder right into my mouth dry and let my saliva mix with it. I chew it and move it around my mouth and let it dissolve as much as possible before swallowing it. The manufacturers suggest this as an option.
The only other options are to mix it with water or milk, if not allergic.
Posted by Abxnomore (Member # 18936) on :
This one is plain and non denatured. Do you think it's good?
Looks like good stuff. I'd prefer it if they packaged the servings in individual foil packets like Immunocal and IMUplus. But other than that it looks like a good product.
It's almost 2lbs for 68 bucks. That's a decent price, probably about the same as ImmunePro and less than the other two.
Good find.
There are some other products sold on that same site that I noticed aren't good.
One of them has L-aspartic acid and phenalynine. This is an attempt to disguise the fact that it has aspartame (Nutra-Sweet) which is neurotoxic. You really have to read all the ingredients on these things.
[ 12-06-2010, 05:51 PM: Message edited by: chaps ]
Posted by Abxnomore (Member # 18936) on :
Thanks for your opinion. I've been using it for almost four years.
Yes, some of their protein bars and meal replacement bars have bad stuff in them.
Posted by sammy (Member # 13952) on :
From the Q&A section of the website: "Is your protein powder denatured in the process of making it? No. There is NO heat used during the cold-filter processing of our whey protein formula. (This special process DOES NOT DENATURE the protein.) This unique process also yields a whey protein isolate that is much higher in protein than a whey protein concentrate and is also rich in immunoglobulins, alpha-lactalbumin, and beta-lactoalbumin and other immune boosting factors." http://www.jayrobb.com/qa.asp#Is_your_protein_powder_denatured
What do you think chaps? Is this a good product too?
Posted by RubyJ (Member # 28711) on :
I use MRM whey from Whole Foods. It's the only one I've tried, so I don't know about others. I bought it because it was a really good sale (BOGO).
I have vanilla and dutch chocolate. I think they taste pretty good. It is not denatured, sweetened with stevia, hormone-free, antibiotic-free, and BSE free. It has added L-glutamine.
Posted by jarjar (Member # 8847) on :
Back when I was misdiagnosed with CFS my doctor tested my glutathione level and it was at the bottom of the barrel. She gave me the option of taking glutathione shots mixed with atp or take Ves Pro nitroplex protein powder to raise my levels. At the time I was sick of taking shots so I went with the the Ves Pro nitroplex protein powder and it shot up my glutatione levels and my stamina and energy levels made a big jump.
To this day if I overdue things and tax my body I know ves pro will pop me back up to where I need to be. I tried Immunepro once and it sat on my stomach like a rock as my body had trouble digesting it so I sent it back. Ves Pro has ingredients that helps your body break down and digest the powder that really helped me.
Posted by momlyme (Member # 27775) on :
jarjar - what about taste? I don't want to buy another bucket of powder my son won't drink.
Got any kids you could test it out on? Posted by jarjar (Member # 8847) on :
momlyme For the first time ever last time I called Ves Pro was waiting for more of the product to be produced or I would give you the reaction of my 16 yo son tasting it. So I bought Jay Robb to get me thru the pinch. To me Ves Pro has kind of a vanilla taste, doesn't bother me.
Shame you don't live by a whole food store or a health store that would give you 30 days to bring back if they were unsatified with the taste. Many products you can order should have that policy.
Posted by chaps (Member # 25286) on :
I really don't understand why so many people seem to be so focused on taste!
You take this stuff in an attempt to get well and hopefully save your a$$ from a life-threatening and complex illness. It's not about having a pleasurable, flavorful gourmet dining experience.
When you go for your infusion of I.V. antibiotics, do you ask the doctor if it will feel good running through your veins? Do you ask if you will feel invigorated afterwards?
Like abx, taking supplements is done with a therapeutic goal in mind and pleasure should be the last thing on one's mind.
Aside from that, unflavored whey does not have an unpleasant taste. It's more on the pleasant side of neutral. Creamy is how I'd describe it.
A product may be perfect until they add flavoring which reduces bioactivity. If you want to pay the same money for a product that is less effective just so it can taste like a chocolate or vanilla shake, then go right ahead.
Look for undenatured, no flavors, no sweeteners. Don't mix in a blender or otherwise vigorously. Best to eat the dry powder slowly, allowing plenty of uptake to occur in the mouth. If you must mix it with a liquid, don't mix with anything but water (no fruit juices).
Meeting the aforementioned requirements yields the best results in increasing L-glutathione levels. Any product meeting those requirements is fine.
I'm glad to see that there are a couple of which I was not aware.
Posted by momlyme (Member # 27775) on :
Chaps, I appreciate that it's not about taste, it's about getting well. Try to tell an 11 year old boy that he has to drink something he can't stand. It just puts added stress on an already sick kid.
If it were me... I'd drink it. You should see the s*** I drink & do so I can stay well enough to figure out why he is so sick.
quote from chaps ** "Aside from that, unflavored whey does not have an unpleasant taste. It's more on the pleasant side of neutral. Creamy is how I'd describe it."
+++ Now, that is helpful. Thank you.
Trying to get a sick kid well not easy. "Drink this, it's good for you" only works if he sees results.
Unfortunately, he is taking many things and feeling somewhere between bad and worse every day... it's hard on him. And yes, he refuses to drink the stuff I bought.
I did make the mistake of buying BioChem... flavored with chocolate... so it's probably not good for him anyway. So, not worth the fight.
Posted by chaps (Member # 25286) on :
Abxnomore and Sammy:
I looked closer at the products you mentioned. While they are good products, they are not inexpensive. The Jay Robb has only 11 servings per $23 container. The Whey Cool is 30 servings per $68 container. ImmunoPro available from ProHealth (made by Well Wisdom) is $39 for a 60 serving container.
Doing the math, the ImmunoPro is the best deal and a great product. You can't go by the weight of the container, because ImmunoPro is concentrated while the others aren't. The container is only 10.6 oz. or 300 grams, but since it's concentrated, you get 60 servings out of it.
Just wanted to pass that along, albeit late.
[ 12-09-2010, 08:51 PM: Message edited by: chaps ]
Posted by Pinelady (Member # 18524) on :
Some people with low blood sugar or low thyroid can have trouble with the Whey.
If you get good results great---if it makes you feel worse/more tired --give it its best shot and then consider it may not be for you...
Or try again another time just to see if its for real not good to you..
Posted by Abxnomore (Member # 18936) on :
Wow, thank you so much for taking the time to analyze that. You're terrific. I did what you suggested today. I melted it in my mouth. It was interesting. I didn't mind it. It got kind of chewy. Less mess and fuss that way!
Posted by Abxnomore (Member # 18936) on :
I thought it's supposed to help balance blood sugar.
In what way (whey!) does it affect the thyroid?
Posted by Pinelady (Member # 18524) on :
I am not advertising---but letting you know most all ---- contain soy lecithin.
And for that you can find hundreds of articles on actions of soy lecithin.
All I am saying if it does not work for you ---you may need to work it in a different way...
Many also say it does no good to take the Whey without C and E.
But whatever---do your research not just listen to the few---and decide for yourself...
Posted by Lauralyme (Member # 15021) on :
I've been shopping for whey protein and I noticed that Immunopro has only 4g of protein....that is hardly much.
I would want at least 20g of protein in a whey powder as it is to be a meal replacement.
Just thought this is something worth paying attention to
Posted by Abxnomore (Member # 18936) on :
It depends the reason why you are taking it. Many of us here are using it to increase glutathione levels in the liver to help clear toxins and heavy metals from the body. In that case it's enough protein.
If you want a meal replacement you may be better off with Paleo meal made by designs for health. That's what it is designed for.
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