My daughter has been on Advil PM (I know, not the normal sleeping med but the only thing that worked for her) for about a year.
One pill before bed.
She tried going cold turkey a few weeks ago and couldn't fall asleep on her own until 3-4 am. She went 5 nights without the pill and this happened every night.
Can anyone suggest a better way then cold turkey?
Thank you!
Posted by penguingirl (Member # 28688) on :
Maybe try Melatonin drops? I get mine from a compounding pharmacy. Works like a charm. Drop a few drops under the tongue then immediately shut off the lights and close your eyes.
I was on a lot of other night meds before and now I am just on Melatonin so that is progress for me!
Posted by faithful777 (Member # 22872) on :
I us source naturals sublingual melatonin. You can get the one mg tablets, use what ever she needs to fall asleep and slowly back off. Melatonin is perfectly safe and sleep is so important. If she isn't sleeping after backing off, I would consider using the melatonin until you figure out what is preventing sleep.
Is she in pain? Can she stay asleep once she falls asleep?
Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
She was on Melatonin for over two years. We ran out a few months ago and she never noticed a difference so I didn't get more.
Maybe I should have given it to her with breaks in between as I remember it helped a lot in the beginning. Maybe she got resistant or something.
But she took a 3mg melatonin tablet. I have never given her sublingual or drops. I'll try the drops and maybe that will work.
Are they expensive penguingirl? Hope not. Lookin' for two cents to rub together at the moment, but sure would like to see her off the sleep meds.
faithful777, no pain and yes she stays asleep.
Thanks everyone. Melatonin it is!
Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
Hens, it should be taken only every other day, otherwise it stops working. Max of 3-4 times per week.
My favorite is sublingual. The thing I don't like about the sublinguals though is that they contain sorbitol and mannitol, and I'm afraid maybe those feed the candida in the mouth.
Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
One more thing - have you tried 5htp? It increases the melatonin stores. It doesn't make you sleepy immediately, like the melatonin does, but it helps you get tired at night.
Another huge trick is to make sure she sees the sun as early as possible when she wakes up in the morning.
Posted by tickbiter (Member # 31829) on :
i was using melatonin but it made me so groggy when i woke up...have been using GABA lately seems to work pretty good.
Posted by nefferdun (Member # 20157) on :
Zhang's Herbsom is powerful. It contains corydallis root which you used to be able to buy by itself, but I can't find it any more. I never developed a real dependency and it worked for a very long time. I have had insomnia most of my life and tried everything. After awhile it all just quit working. Melatonin, L trytophan, 5HTP, valerian, skull cap, hops, chamomile. . .
But when you are addicted, herbs etc don't do the trick. I am taking 5mg of seroquil (which is one quarter of the lowest dose) and I don't sleep without it. The herbs just won't work any more. When I was addicted to Ambien it was very hard to get off. I just had to go sleepless until my body gave out. I worry about how I will get off the seroquil.
You might get your daughters progesterone levels checked because if they are low it will cause sleeplessness. Progesterone supplementation cured my insomnia for several years - until the tick bite.
I just noticed a few days ago that the compounding pharmacy making my hormones changed the amount for my prescription from one ml to two mls. So I was taking half my dose and not knowing it. This is probably why I had so much trouble sleeping and had to resort to the seroquil. I think they told me but I just spaced it out.
Posted by penguingirl (Member # 28688) on :
Hens - no, it's not that expensive - a small bottle goes a long way - I think it was like $20 but it lasts like 2 months - make sure you just drop no more than 3 drops (not 3 dropfuls of the tube - that is too much). It tastes like cherry (kind of like Nyquil, haha).
I don't get groggy - I used to a bit when I took then along with gabapentin but I'm only on Melatonin now.
Posted by GiGi (Member # 259) on :
Reducing the toxic load; especially reducing EMF exposure - pulling the fuses - all will help to eventually get sleep back. Biophotons mobilize neurotoxins, ALL toxins including toxic heavy metals and getting them out of the body is an important process that requires knowledge and patience. It is not a do-it-yourself job.
Take care.
Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
Is it a Liquigel or tablet?
If it's a tablet, I would cut/shave tiny amounts off each week until there is none left.
If it's a gel, I wonder if you can poke a hole in it with a needle and little by little lessen the amount each week.
I had to do some CRAZY things to get myself off a benzo.
It's probably just rebound insomnia she's experiencing and will get better with time. Replacing it with something else is just going to cause her to be dependent on the other thing.
Is your goal to just get her off the Advil PM?
Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
James, wow, good info. So if you take melatonin every other night, can you get to sleep OK on the nights when you don't take it?
neff, tickbiter, thanks. I will keep in mind the GABA & Herbsom (& 5htp) in case this plan doesn't work well enough.
Gigi, toxins, yes, that's always the answer, isn't it. We do have someone helping to reduce toxins and improve health. Started at the liver and will move on from there. The frustrating part is it takes so long - and school doesn't wait.
Hambone, it's a tablet. Good idea to shave it. Hope I don't cut off a finger - the tablets are pretty small.
Do I add the melatonin while shaving the tablet of Advil PM? I guess the answer is, if she needs it.
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
When I got back from Germany I slowly weaned off sleep meds. I had been taking two lyrica and one lunesta every night. I first switched to one lyrica and one lunesta altnernating nights, then the full dose every other night. When I could finally get to taking one of each every night, then I went every other night with Lunesta alone.
Maybe you could try some kind of every other night method. Or maybe switch to a half dose.
When I finally got to Lunesta every other night, I'd take 5HTP on the off nights. I now take 5 HTP every night. I still muscle test well for it so I've never tried to wean off it.
Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
Has you daughter done an anti-parasite protocol? In my case, I think the parasites were active at night & keeping me awake. Just an observation... My pain was worse when I was trying to sleep. The pain kept me awake.
I tried the brain function supplements/herbs & they didn't help much. They do have pill splitters at the drugstore. I used to do that with Ambien. It works well but I didn't want to get dependent on it.
Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
hens - the big thing is to get on a SCHEDULE! If the body is accustomed to going to sleep at the same time every night, and waking up at the same time every morning, then everything becomes a ton easier.
I used to have sleeping problems all my life, but finally now I consistently get 6-7 hours of continuous sleep every night (that's all I need and I feel fine).
So in answer to your question: Yes, even if you only take the melatonin every other night, you can still get tired the nights you're not taking it, because the body wants to follow the schedule.
A huge thing for me was to completely eliminate naps during the day. I'm sure many will disagree with this, but it really does help some people. I force myself to stay awake during the day, even if I get super sleepy. If I force myself to not take a nap during the day, then that night I get super tired and I sleep like a baby. It's all about staying on schedule.
That's the same reason it's important to try to wake up at the same time every morning, and also to see the sun as early as possible. The minute the eyes see the sunlight, the body's biological clock gets reset. The earlier the clock is reset, the earlier we will feel tired at night.
Concerning the melatonin again, if the user starts automatically waking up too early (like 3-4:00am) in the morning after taking the pill the night before, then the timed-release version might be better.
I always keep the timed-release, the "regular" oral, and the sublingual versions on hand at all times. If I see that I'm a little late for bed, or if it's bedtime and I'm not feeling tired, then I'll take the "regular" oral or the sublingual, so that I get knocked out earlier and quicker. If I feel sleepy already and I probably would've slept fine even without the melatonin, then I'll take the timed-release, just so I don't automatically wake up too early. But even if I "accidentally" wake up too early from the melatonin, I find that I'm usually not tired the following day.
I've read (and I agree with it from my personal experience) that the sleep with melatonin supplementation is more deeper and effective than "normal" sleep without supplementation. I think I read somewhere how 6-7 hours of melatonin sleep can be as beneficial as 8-9 hours of "regular" sleep.
Another interesting thing about melatonin is that it's a powerful antioxidant, so even if you didn't need it for sleeping it would still have other health benefits. Melatonin is also shown to lower incidences of certain types of cancers.
I realize that everybody's different, and for some people melatonin might not be effective. I also realize that some people have horrendous insomnia, and I'm not trying to belittle their suffering or make it look like there's an easy solution. This melatonin solution is just what I've personally found to be beneficial in my own personal experience.
Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
quote:Originally posted by 17hens: Hambone, it's a tablet. Good idea to shave it. Hope I don't cut off a finger - the tablets are pretty small.
If it will dissolve in water or olive oil, you can make it liquid ( I put it in a 10 ml syringe ) and squirt out 1 ml every few days or week, or however long it takes.
Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
You guys are brilliant! There is a reason I keep coming back to my LN friends for help!! Thanks, everyone!
(sparkle, yes, I put her on Parastroy a week or two before I went to Germany. She had the worst bout of stomach acid she's had in years before she ever reached full dose so hubby took her off. I know parasites are an issue, I'm just not ready to deal with it yet. One thing at a time is all I can handle, although with my family, it's actually four things at a time! )
Posted by Maradona (Member # 24552) on :
Advill does not effect sleep so is just adiction to that med. Some of the advill may have on them substance that help to sleep but usually is week.So as six sugests do it just taper of the advil everyday.And if she can do some exercise it can help big time to get tired in that way,warm bath helps to .Melatonin helps to .
Take care
Posted by BP-Ladybug (Member # 32880) on :
The ingredient in Advil PM that makes you sleepy is Diphenhydramine. Also known as Benadryl. I would switch her to Benadryl and gradually reduce those doses, working my way down slowly to a pediatric dose. I would not go cold turkey as such loss of sleep can affect mood and the immune system. I think the Benadryl is less of a problem than the loss of sleep.
Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
I'll say it again... you guys are brilliant!!!
Thanks Maradona and BP!
The last few nights, I've been having trouble staying asleep, so I took one of the Advil PM to see if it would help.
Sheesh! All day, I've been feeling drugged, like someone ran a bowling ball over my brain!
So... that's what it took to get this brilliant mom to decide DD needs to wean off the drug.
I do have liquid Benedryl here, so I'll give her that instead, giving her less and less. That'll be easier than shaving a litle pill, I would guess. I'll start her back on Melatonin and go from there. If those things don't work, I've taken notes on the other things that might help.
I appreciate all your help so very much! Posted by BP-Ladybug (Member # 32880) on :
Liquid Benadryl is brilliant. You can control a slow titration with a liquid with simple tsp measuring spoons and drops. That is a great idea.
Personally I would not refer to this as 'addiction.' Dependence or being habituated is different from being a drug addict. I am habituated to Ambien currently - but I am not out at night seeking more Ambien or doctor shopping. I am not drug seeking.
Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
Just a note in case anyone cares... I checked the Advil PM bottle and the Benadryl bottle and the Advil PM contains 3 tsp. of Benadryl!!
3 tsp!!!
No wonder I felt like a train ran over my head for 24 hours after I took it!
Weaning started last night. Thanks for everyone's help!
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