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Posted by WPinVA (Member # 33581) on :
 
About a month ago, I went on a no sugar, low carb, no white carbs, lots of protein diet. I had a terrible time with it - hungry all the time, difficult to eat enough to feel energetic and I gained weight on it. That didn't seem healthy so I decided to ease off and try to find something more moderate that works for me.

So... I'm wondering what has ACTUALLY WORKED for other people in real life? thanks!
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I do not do well with low carbs. You can cut out white carbs without cutting out all carbs. You might Google Mercola and diet. He talks about eating right for your metabolic type. I'm mixed, so I need protein and carbs. I just get my carbs from good sources.
 

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Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
 
VERY. Were you eating vegetables on your diet?? Nuts?? You can fill up on safe foods... but it takes a little work to find what is safe for you.

I just posted this to someone in General.. so will copy here:

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Let me put it this way. Yeast WILL at some point be a problem... and once that happens you will be playing "catch up" forever. Do everything you can to prevent it.

So... avoid white foods, pastas, white rice, potatoes, etc.

I am gluten intolerant and avoid most gluten free processed foods. I eat bread maybe once a week. "Mary's Gone Crackers" has some crackers that do not contain grains. That helps, but don't consume too many.

I think quinoa is OK .. but in moderation. It's still a carb, like the crackers.

There's nothing wrong with a meal consisting of steak, broccoli and salad. I think it is OK but the best combo would be chicken instead of steak.

I keep it simple. I eat proteins and vegetables. That makes it very easy. Do I prefer to eat that way?? not really

But I took abx for 4 yrs and 7 yrs later I'm still battling yeast. SOOOOO..... That is why I say PREVENT.
 

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Posted by Harmony (Member # 32424) on :
 
I agree totally with Lymetoo - was going to say the very same word: VERY

I also agree with "it takes a little work to find what is safe for you."

it has been a loooonnngg road for me - since I did not know I had Lyme and was told I had food intolerances for 8 years - what a long battle - but I did improve 95% with diet!!! imagine that!!! so diet is crucial in my experience

when I got bitten again in June - this time with Bull's Eye Rash, my body finally broke down and I got a lot of very definite CNS symptoms and I learned about Lyme

BUT I still go by my diet to help get over this again

here are a couple of things that I have done / have worked for me:

this 90 year old doc who was still practicing medicine and had focused on food intolerance for 45 years said he could help me and he said:

1) if you have food intolerane (which is common in Lyme) "it is not what you put in but what you leave out" - that matters - i.e. you improve not by taking supplements but by elimnating offending foods that your immune system reacts to - he used to tell me "the body makes everything it needs if you provide it with protein, carbohydrate, and fat" and it is working well - he did not know about Lyme but was a food intolerance expert!

2) your weight should stay the same overnight or drop, even when you eat all you want, if your metabolism is ok with what you put in your mouth - any weight gain over about 1/2 lb is an indication of a disruption of proper metabolism / food processing by your body which often results in fluid retention

3) every molecule matters, so do NOT eat what you react to, ever again (he said)

4) he put me on white rice, boiled turkey breast, rye bread, margarine and salt - I know, I know it is not ideal but he was trying to eliminate most common allergens - it turned out I could not have the rye due to gluten and not have the margarine due to corn oil in it

after about 10 days of that - and trust me, I would have rather had a bowl of warm vomit than another bowl of rice with turkey without any spices or dressing or anything - I was whining about the food and deficiencies and he told me very sternly that he had lived through two world wars and they had nothing to eat for years and I was going to be ok - I was more than ok: after months of insomnia, I started to sleep like a baby and my joint pain stopped and my brain cleared etc etc etc and I was sooooo happy

often hungry and grumpy about food I could nto have, but getting rid of my symptoms and ready to eat whatever it took

nothing passed my mouth except the allowed foods and if I was sick of them, I went without - "you are not hungry enough, obviously" - so I lost 45 lbs (from 165 down to 118 lbs - about 7 dress sizes - whoo-hooo) I even stopped using tooth paste because there are unknown ingredients in it I may absorb

after about 10 days, my doc said to add in one food, not tomato sauce but just tomatoes, for example, first add them in cooked and if tolerated then raw is ok - eat as much of the one food as you can in three days and observe the reaction

if negative, leave the food out, go back to the original clean diet for 10 days and then start with another single food

since this is sooooo difficult (I did it because I was desperate to get rid of my delibilating symptoms!) I later did a York Laboratories Food Allergy test that you can send through the mail to them (no doc required - docs did not help me during those years) - it is expensive and I am not sure about the truth of their claims

but I paid $400 to test my blood for 113 foods at once - what a great break compared to the tedious elimination/provokation trials - and I tested highly reactive to eggs, which made a ton of sense when I found out - and reactive to gluten, dairy, yeast, vanilla and a couple of otehr food stuffs

I left those things out and got better

I think food intolerace (also called Delayed Onset Food Intolerance = DOFA) is common in Lyme since the Bb changes something in the gut and makes us gluten sensitive without testing positive for celiac, necessarily, and if the gut is aggrevated and leaks food stuffs, other immune responses begin

mostly to foods that you commonly eat since those will leak into your system and the immune system starts to "see" them as invaders

I started eating all sorts of unusual foos for our culture to avoid a reaction in me, and I started to rotate food at least 4 days - not eat anything more than once every 4 days to avaoid new reactions

having said all this - I hope it helps somebody - I think you really can't go by what someone else is eating but need to find your own safe foods with a food diary, very strict trials, and being brave in doing provokation trials - and/or something like a York Lab test (you can google them) whatever is available to you and makes sense to you

Lymetoo has already stressed the abx/yeast danger and that is another important consideration - to stay away from refined sugars and starches - and eat your probiotics religiously - my LLMD has also recommended a friendly yeast product to combat dangerous yeast while taking abx btu I may not take it since I tested positive for yeast

the product is Saccharomyces Boulardii by Nutricology

I think the trick is that this is a yeats and not killed by the abx like the other probiotics, but it is a friendly yeast that can serve to crow out dangerous yeasts (Candia, C.diff)

(still doing my homework to find out what yeast I tested positive for - then I may take the prescribed yeast if I think it is ok, not decided on that one yet, need more info first)

Good luck with your diet!!!

Don't get discouraged. It is a huge topic to tackle and you get better every day if you stay on it.

A good book is "Conquering Arthritis" by Barbara Allan - it talks about food intolerances and I learned a lot from this book even though my "arthitis" is really Lyme

[ 10-10-2011, 10:53 PM: Message edited by: Harmony ]
 

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Posted by Tammy N. (Member # 26835) on :
 
I think diet is HUGE HUGE HUGE. It reminds me of the quote "Let thy food be thy medicine and medicine be thy food".

A diet high in animal protein is a disaster (read The China Study). Plus it causes an overly acidic environment. It's terrible. Eating lots of veggies, some fruits, some whole grains, beans, small amounts of meat, etc. is the best way to go. There are so many choices, it doesn't need to be boring. And you shouldn't be left feeling hungry. Oh, and it should be preferably whole and organic.
 

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Posted by Harmony (Member # 32424) on :
 
well, Tammy, I think you have to be careful in generalizing

I did so much work on myself with food and symptom diary and elimination/provocation trials (see really long post above) and I found that I do best with meats

I eat a lot of meat: lamb, chicken, chicken livers, too, turkey, pork, fish, and used to eat huge steaks with the grizzle and all until I overdid that with the Costco family pack, I think, and started to react to beef

meat makes me feel full, good, clear minded and I loose weight on it - I think is is easy to digest for my body and it is what my body needs (or at least can easily digest and use)

so I think it is different for everyone and you need to find your own way

I am sorry for the animals, but from a food stand point, I have to say, I do best with meat and lots of it
 

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Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
 
Harmony.. I was waiting and waiting for you to complete this statement!

"2) your weight should stay the same overnight or drop, even when you eat all you want, if your metabolism is ok with what you put in your mouth - any weight gain over about 1/2 lb is an indication of ....."

My chiro told me last Friday that he thinks the gluten issue comes BEFORE Lyme. Not that Lyme CAUSES gluten intolerance, but those with celiac or gluten intol. are more likely to CRASH if they are bitten by a tick. He could be right!!

He said eating gluten (when you shouldn't) lowers your immune system.

I'm going to have him muscle test me for more foods this week. Seems to be pretty valid and more accurate than blood testing.
 

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Posted by Harmony (Member # 32424) on :
 
WP, if you gained weight on the low carb diet, then, according to my experience and the doc I talked about above, this diet was not right for you - you were eating something that was not right for you

when I got on my "safe" diet I felt great, kept gradually loosing weight, easily, without being hungry all the time, and symptoms were getting better all the time

this is just one experience, we are all different and different factors are at play

again, best of luck to you and don't give up - this is a very complex topic but you can make good progress if you care

sounds like you are one the right track by asking questions
 

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Posted by Harmony (Member # 32424) on :
 
I took a long time to finsh - yes - really wanted to share my whole story in case it may help someone ok, now I got it - completed statement #2 for you

Lymetoo, your chiro / you could be absolutely right that gluten issues > immune issues come before Lyme...

there are so many possible scenarios

the only thing, **for me**, was that I used to laugh at people drinking skim milk and eating margarine; I used to eat the "good old German" way with whole milk and butter and bread every day and I was totally fine until all this Lyme stuff started...

I am not saying it is the same for everyone and I am all ears when someone has found something new - it may well be the answer for many! and maybe even for me, I have to think about it again...

[ 10-13-2011, 06:09 PM: Message edited by: Harmony ]
 

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Posted by METALLlC BLUE (Member # 6628) on :
 
It depends on the person. Some people change their diet and see immense progress. Some change it and see little to nothing. Most fall in the middle, so it's one thing that "may" give you a few percentage points in health. If you've given it a sincere shot and it didn't change anything for you then it doesn't make sense to be strict with it in my opinion. Everyone is different when it comes to this illness.
 

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Posted by RubyJ (Member # 28711) on :
 
A low-carb diet was what kept me going when I didn't know what was wrong with me.

I started eating low-carb seven years ago when my son's girlfriend gave me the book "Protein Power LifePlan" by Drs. Eades. At the time, I had to use a cane to walk and was afraid that soon I'd be in a wheelchair.

I not only lost 50 lbs, but it turned out that my pain decreased by half and it also helped many of my other neuro symptoms. I was able to get off of BP meds and my triglycerides dropped like a rock.

I've stayed low carb, gluten-free, no grain for SEVEN years because for me carbs = PAIN!

Most people on low carb find their appetite decreases. Did you follow a plan? Did you eat plenty of good fat? After seven years, it's not that difficult. I have plenty of great food to eat. Tons of recipes on line and in LC cookbooks!

It's not for everyone - everyone is different, but it's best to do it right before deciding it isn't right for you.

The South Beach diet is good for people who may not want to go completely low carb.

I recommend the following:

"Protein Power LifePlan" by Drs. Eades

"Good Calories, Bad Calories" (difficult to read) or "Why We Get Fat and What To Do About It" (easier to read version of GC,BC)
by Gary Taubes

"What if it was all a big fat lie?" an article by Gary Taubes (google and read online)

"Living Low Carb" by Jonny Bowden

"Life Without Bread" by Dr. Allan and Dr. Lutz

"Know Your Fats" by Dr. Mary Enig

"The Oiling of America" an article by Dr. Mary Enig (google and read online)

A new book (I haven't read yet) "Wheat Belly" by Dr. William Davis

A good LC support website is Low Carb Friends www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/

Lots of good recipes (not all are gluten-free)
www.genaw.com/lowcarb/
 

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Posted by Harmony (Member # 32424) on :
 
obviously I don't have this thing licked yet - rather a loosing battle again tonight - so much for listening to me

great comments and references from Metallic and Ruby

thanks for starting the thread, WP

I am obviously still learning, too, and this is helpful
 

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Posted by faithful777 (Member # 22872) on :
 
Another book to read is "Live Right For Your Type, Dr. Peter D'Adamo, Geno Type Diet by the same doctor.

Since following my blood type diet, digestion has taken a huge turn for the better for me.

Not everyone can do high protein, or low carb,or even low fat. What works for one person may not work for the next. Mix in Lyme disease, and it is a complicated mess.

I think what everyone is saying is to stay away from junk food, sugars, gluten and eat as close to nature as you can. Try to make your own food so you really know what is in it.
 

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Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
 
faithful - if someone has the blood type "AB+", do you think it's less important for them to follow a blood type diet, since they have a "mix" of backgrounds? thanks
 

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Posted by Tammy N. (Member # 26835) on :
 
Harmony - I hear what you say about not making generalizations. Everyone is different and we all need to find our own way. I've come to some of my conclusions based on my own researching. (But then again as we continue to learn more, we tweak our beliefs.) Have you read The China Study? It's the largest study ever conducted on food and it's relationship to disease? Worth looking into.

On the one hand.... Acid/alkaline balance is so important and animal products are hard to digest, therefore our bodies need to produce for acid in order to digest. An acidic environment is problematic. On the other hand.... animal products are higher in the B vits, which are hard to come by in other ways.

I think your idea of elimination/provocation is great. Tedious though, huh? I'd like to try it some time. It really sounds like it would be worth the trouble. So glad you found what works for you.
 

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Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
 
Harmony .. one German to another!! I didn't grow up eating German food, but like you, I've never been "afraid" of butter or whole milk. Now I can't do either!

I'm with you, Ruby! I feel tons better eating low carb. For yeast reasons and esp for pain reasons.

Tell me which websites have the best low carb, gluten free, sugar free recipes. OH.. and dairy free. Sigh.

The eat right for your type doesn't work for me. I think mine says to eat (whole) grains.

James..maybe "AB" is more restricted because it's a mix of two types. ..??
 

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Posted by jlp38 (Member # 27221) on :
 
The big problem I have with the china study is that it doesn't differentiate between grassfed/wild meat or game and traditionally raised meat that is fed corn till they are sick and fat and miserable and then are slaughtered for us to eat. For me, the china study only tells me that corn fed beef is bad. IMO, grass fed meat and slaughterhouse meat are two completely different foods. All that corn the cows are fed is what makes them unhealthy for us to eat.
 

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Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
 
jlp - Good point! Another point is that it's not only that the livestock are fed grains instead of greens, but the grains are GMO on top of that!
 

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Posted by ItsMyTurn (Member # 31469) on :
 
I believe diet has a lot to do with how you feel also. I have been a longtime fan of the low carb diet. I also believe that I have had Lyme for SEVERAL years and when on "Atkins" it kept my symptoms to a minimum. But I will say that it can be very difficult and takes discipline. Something that I lack during certain time of the month. LOL
 

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Posted by faithful777 (Member # 22872) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by James1979:
faithful - if someone has the blood type "AB+", do you think it's less important for them to follow a blood type diet, since they have a "mix" of backgrounds? thanks

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quote:

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Originally posted by Lymetoo:

I'm with you, Ruby! I feel tons better eating low carb. For yeast reasons and esp for pain reasons.

Tell me which websites have the best low carb, gluten free, sugar free recipes. OH.. and dairy free. Sigh.

The eat right for your type doesn't work for me. I think mine says to eat (whole) grains.

James..maybe "AB" is more restricted because it's a mix of two types. ..??

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Tutu - I also tried the "Eat Right for Your Type" diet and it didn't work for me. I'm an A and supposed to be mostly vegetarian with lots of grains. Nope, it made me sick.

Have you checked out Paleo diets? No gluten, no grains, no dairy (they do use grass fed butter). They also use honey and fruit in their desserts, so just watch that.

There is a new cookbook out "Paleo Comfort Foods". Mine just arrived today. I haven't had a chance to go through it completely, but I like what I've seen so far. Big pictures! I like that.

For anyone trying low carb, don't forget the fat! LC diet should be low carb, medium protein, and high fat. Butter, olive oil, coconut oil, avacado oil, and macadamia nut oil are the good guys. Saturated fat is not evil.

The low fat dogma pushed on the public for the past 40 years was based on bad science, sneaky politics, and funded by the wheat, corn, and soy industries. The corn people weren't having success at selling their gross magarine until they funded a giant anti-butter campaign.
 

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Posted by RubyJ (Member # 28711) on :
 
Oh, and when I say the word 'grains', I mean cereal/grass grains. That's things like wheat, rye, corn, rice, oats, etc.

Quinoa is not a cereal/grass grain. It is a seed and great for low carb in moderation. Chia, flax, sesame, sunflower are seeds also.
 

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Posted by Tracy9 (Member # 7521) on :
 
Diet has not made a huge difference for me, that I can discern. I try to eat healthy but I do eat some sugar, carbs, etc. One thing I seem to feel a lot better without though is dairy and I do ART test as allergic to it, so I avoid that as much as possible, especially milk. I do eat yogurt and sometimes a little cheese or ice cream, one of my weaknesses.

I just read yesterday, and this is not verified, that Dr K is now saying his latest theory is to eat sugar, and all the bad stuff because it gets the spirochetes out of hiding and into the blood where they can be killed off. Good diets push them further into the tissues and organs, bad diets bring them out of hiding and then they can be better attacked. I said, "I was ahead of my time."

This supposedly came from his recent free talk which I did not hear firsthand, so I am saying it is heresay, but it was posted on Facebook.
 

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Posted by glm1111 (Member # 16556) on :
 
Totally agree with the sugar, bad stuff theory of Dr. K. I drink lots of milk, eat choc cake and ice cream and everytime I eat something I take my antiparasitic herbs, digestive enzymes etc. Getting rid of the parasites, also got rid of the yeast.

He is so right because it works like a charm. The parasites can't resist the goodies and eat the poison along with them. I have always done very well on milk, but everyone is different.

I used to juice, and eat ONLY a great diet. I still eats lots of organic fruits, fiber and vegetables, but feeding the bugs with "bad stuff" has really worked. I don't think starving yourself is a good idea. Just my 2 cents.

Gael
 

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Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
 
I'd never be able to get away with Dr K's new idea. I feel worse every time I cheat.

Ruby.. you are right on many accounts. Let me know about the cookbook!
 

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Posted by glm1111 (Member # 16556) on :
 
I think he only means to do this if you are taking antiparasitics. Otherwise, I would have gotten really sick myself eating bad stuff.

Gael
 

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Posted by bcb1200 (Member # 25745) on :
 
My diet is "ok" but not great. I tend to to well Monday - Thurdsay when I juice 2x / day and have restricted carbs and sugar.

Friday I binge and have a bagel for B-fast and Pizza / Ice cream with the family for dinner (gasp).

Weekends are so-so...I try to be good, but it is hard.

I'm on a ton of probiotics (upwards of 150B / day) and also take Nystatin, GSE, Oil of O, and OLE daily. So far, no yeast issues that I'm aware of.

ONe comment...I recommend Ezekiel bread for those folks who miss bread / carbs. It isn't quite gluten free (trace amounts), but the big benefit is it is made from sprouted grains and not flour. This makes it very low gycemic..like Quinoa and Sweet Potatoes. Yummy!
 

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Posted by Harmony (Member # 32424) on :
 
Tammy, thank you so much, I will read The China Study, and of course, I am still experimenting and learning, too, maybe there is more to the acidity/meat than I thought

it is hard to consider so many things at once, so sometimes I just want to simplify and go with that thought but life does not allow it, it is more complex than that, usually

Lymetoo, back at 'ya - you asked about recipe sites, I have one for you but you probably have been there many times already since it is so famous and has been mentioned on LymeNet: http://bodyecology.com/recipes/recipes.php

You don't have to buy the book or "stuff" from them - watch out it is sorta commercial - the recipies are on their web site and are free. You can pick and chose what may work for you. I can't eat any corn, dairy, gluten, pepper, etc recipies either and just have to pass on those.

I did end up buying the book to support the woman and learn more but I am not buying all their "stuff" to go with it right now. I need to keep things simple and listen to my LLMD mostly.
 

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Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
 
Thanks, Harmony! I'm now GF AND dairy free. So not much to pick from. I'm a very lazy cook, so that's a problem! If I have to buy something out of the ordinary it just doesn't happen.
 

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Posted by Tracy9 (Member # 7521) on :
 
What I read about Dr. K's new theory is that it brings the Lyme/spirochetes out of hiding and back into the bloodstream making them easier to kill. They come out to feed on the sugar, yeast, etc. They are easier to kill in the bloodstream then in the tissues and organs.

I will say sugar has been making me nauseous lately and I probably need to go off it again. Not a huge loss.
 

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Posted by Harmony (Member # 32424) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Lymetoo:
Thanks, Harmony! I'm now GF AND dairy free. So not much to pick from. I'm a very lazy cook, so that's a problem! If I have to buy something out of the ordinary it just doesn't happen.

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Lymetoo, you have to buy food to cook and you have to cook to eat well - pretty much -

how's this:

plan to try ONE new recipe per month, if it requires 4 new ingredients you don't have at home, get one new ingredient per week, to keep your stress level low

then, if you liked it and your body liked it, this recipe becomes "ordinary" and you're off to the next one, one step at a time...

I had to get out of my comfort zone when I changed my diet, and I know how hard it is, time consuming, stressful, etc.

but I got pretty good at it for a while - I was the pesky Lady at the Asian grocery store who would ocasionally corner an innocent victim to ask "How to you cook/eat THOSE?" whatever weird food I was interested in at the moment

Thanks for reminding me to keep after it - I got lazy lately, too and did not think about it that way, but that's what it is, isn't it? You hit the nail on the head.
 

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Posted by Kudzuslipper (Member # 31915) on :
 
Could some one pm me....who dr. K is? And if you have articles I would so appreciate it.

Before Lyme... I tested for food allergies. Out of a hundred foods tested. I was not allergic to 5 foods. There were 5 more that were low, the rest were moderate to highly allergic.

Not sure how to avoid everything. But I do feel better eating protein and veggies. Most proteins are fairly low to medium. but most veggies are high. All grains, nuts and seeds are high..even rice.

So not sure which came first for me, the allergy or the Lyme...
 

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Posted by sbh93 (Member # 30429) on :
 
Lyme came before food problems for me. And I do agree that each person has to find out for themselves what is good for them. That said, all the different theories and my own experiences have me throwing up my hands.

My blood type says go vegetarian and small amounts of dairy are ok.

My food allergy testing says no eggs, dairy, gluten, or shellfish.

My stomach says no meat at all (jives with the blood typing), but it also says no raw vegetables. It likes beans.

Yet my kidney doc says to limit protein and salt to slow progression of my other fun disease. Kinda hard when you're living on beans that only taste good with lots of salt.

And then there's the yeast...so my bread replacers of tortilla chips, rice, and gluten-free oatmeal (that only tastes good with sugar) are all problematic.

What the h*** do we eat? I am so sick of steamed broccoli and Amy's organic soups it's not funny.
 

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Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
 
kudzu .. just PM someone the next time they mention him.
 

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