I've been on Methylene Blue and Rifampin for a month now.
Bartonella was always my most serious issue, Rifampin would get it under control, but I would experience rapid relapses when I went off medication.
With MB, the herxes simply haven't stopped. Whenever I take a dose of Rifampin and MB, several hours later, I'll experience a herx. That's never happened to me before. Certainly not for 30 straight days.
There are two forms of Bartonella, a growing and a stationary form. Conventional treatments, like Rifampin, can kill the active form, but do nothing for the stationary form. And then you have the issue of biofilms. With conventional treatments, you would never get well.
MB kills the stationary form though, and is effective at breaking down biofilms. If you combine it with Rifampin, you might actually defeat Bartonella.
It's possible I always had Bartonella, we had cats growing up, and it may have been the preexisting weakness that made my immune system so vulnerable. No way to know.
I do think this combination is effective, if only because I continue to experience herxes.
Another drug worth looking at is Nitroxoline, but it's not approved for use in the USA.
Posted by Kristyn (Member # 51857) on :
Good point stressing on stationary phases, biofilms etc. I believe this doesn't get enough attention than it should.
This could be very well the reason why some people don't see improvement, are discouraged and maybe even question their treatment protocols.
Posted by Garz (Member # 52095) on :
good luck with the treatment Charles
please keep us posted of progress
I am very interested to hear how you get on as have lyme with bart and exploring all the different treatment options
Posted by Kristyn (Member # 51857) on :
I agree Garz, keep us posted Charles.
I am in the same boat, it is just so frustrating.
Posted by Cignet133 (Member # 52286) on :
Hey Charles, how are you doing these days? Have you heard about Dr M using clarithromycin and rifabutin simultaneously? He's specialising in bart.
Posted by Tincup (Member # 5829) on :
I've heard some encouraging words on MB and Bartonella.
Hope you are doing well!
Posted by Mountainsky (Member # 51857) on :
Someone mentioned MB the other day on one of my posts.
I've been on Rifabutin and Clarithromycin now for 3.5 weeks for the Bart.
As you can see in my previous posts it's been no walk in the park. Not throwing in the towel yet.
My next appt with my LLMD is May 3rd.
Posted by Tincup (Member # 5829) on :
Hey Mountain Sky,
I do hope you get help for the Bartonella. It is a nasty one, for sure.
Lettuce no how you are doing, ok?
Posted by orrn71 (Member # 50137) on :
The Methylene Blue that you are talking about is
it a pill or injectable? I hear everyone
talking about it, but am unsure what it is. I
use something at work that is called Methylene
Blue, but I didn't know it had and other value
than staining tissue or going through our
kidneys(ureters) to know they are still intact.
I'm just wondering if this is the same thing as
people are using for Bart. Thanks for any
clarification you might have.
Posted by Garz (Member # 52095) on :
yes - its the same thing
methylene blue was actually the first synthetic drug ever developed. it has since been largely superseded as a drug but still used in staining tissue for surgery and in microscopy.
Zhang et al recently rediscovered its ability to kill bartonella persister cells in their large bartonella drug screening study.
doses range from 50mg a day to 1000mg a day (was used for malaria at these high doses)
please use only pharmaceutical grade as heavy metals are a common impurity from the manufacturing process.
i have started at 25mg a day along with bart herbs ( MB must be used as a combination therapy - as it does not kill growing cells well - it is instead specific to persister cells)
i experienced mild to moderate herx like reactions when i added it to my bart herb regime - so its doing something
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)