Does something like lyme really have to cause auto immune or can auto immune totally be a disease within itself?
I've heard it said both ways.
Posted by beaches (Member # 38251) on :
I think you can have "regular" autoimmune disease without Lyme. I asked a LL doc about that recently and he seemed to think so as well. I think genetics likely plays a huge part.
But Lyme can definitely cause your body to turn autoimmune. There are some good explanations out there as to how this happens but can't direct you to anything in particular at the moment.
The immune system is such a complicated thing.
Posted by sutherngrl (Member # 16270) on :
I believe that once your immune system recognizes something foreign in your body, it naturally wants to fight it. Then sometimes once the foreign agent is removed, the immune system keeps attacking, and that would become an autoimmune problem.
I think this happens to a good many people that have LD for a long time. I have heard that even after the Lyme is gone, your body can keep attacking; but in some cases it will eventually stop.
Posted by desertwind (Member # 25256) on :
Sure...why not? Not everyone with an autoimmune d/o has Lyme.
Posted by Starphoenix (Member # 2402) on :
Yes. I have both Lyme and Lupus, separate entities.
Posted by tickled1 (Member # 14257) on :
If anyone has any info on Lyme leading to autoimmune disease I'd love to see it. Thanks!
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
Well, I'm living proof, tickled! I have Sjogren's, thanks to Lyme. I also have IC which I've heard recently is considered auto-immune.
Posted by Messa (Member # 38065) on :
Starphoenix, do you mean your Lyme didn't cause the lupus? Did your lupus come first? I'm just trying to figure out this entire autoimmune thing.
My legs and my chest rash up when I'm in the shower or tub. It's not a heat rash either. Autoimmune? My hair seems to be falling out more.
Posted by tickled1 (Member # 14257) on :
Is there really any way to know for sure which came first?
Tutu, Is Sjogren's the one that causes dry eyes? My eyes have been incredibly dry lately and this is new. Something's up.
I had a positive ANA also about the time of my Lyme dx.
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
Messa .. the rash could be from yeast.
tickled.. yes, that's the one. My mouth is not severely dry, but my insides are and so are my eyes. So far, it is manageable. My Dr was looking for Lupus about 5 yrs ago and found the Sjogren's.
Posted by TF (Member # 14183) on :
ticked1, there are a few pages in "The Lyme Disease Solution" that address lyme causing autoimmune dysfunction.
See, for example, pages 178-179 and many of the pages following.
It says that lyme disease triggers an inflammatory response in the body which becomes a major player in the symptoms and the illness itself, and also is very difficult to shut off.
The book even has an anti-inflammation diet that it suggests certain lyme patients (or even all lyme patients) adopt to stop the inflammatory response.
It says that inflammation is the body's natural response to infection, including infection with lyme bacteria. The immune system can perceive chronic inflammation as the body being under continuous attack and an autoimmune dysfunction can occur as a result. "Autoimmune dysfunction is an increasingly common cause of chronic inflammation among many people today." (p. 179)
It even says that lyme disease disrupts the body's normal inflammation control mechanisms for its own protection and describes it scientifically--what it does in our bodies.
"Therefore, whenever we are dealing with chronic infections like Lyme, we must be careful not only to treat a person with appropriate antibiotics, but also to address the chronic inflammation problems that have been triggered by Lyme." (pages 186-187) Then, he goes on to discuss the crucial role nutrition plays in dealing with lyme infection and inflammation.
Posted by tickled1 (Member # 14257) on :
Thanks TF! I actually have that book but have yet to read it!
Posted by TF (Member # 14183) on :
Here is an article about the subject, author Garth Nicolson.
Until proven otherwise, I am going to continue to believe that all so-called autoimmune diseases have a pathogen causation of some type.
Posted by signs9 (Member # 37116) on :
My husband got Lyme about 7 years ago. He had it bad for about a month, took antibiotics and felt better for several years.
Then in the fall of 2011 he got very sick and we believe either he was reinfected or the Lyme woke up in his system....maybe both. Anyway he just deteriorated so much over 2012 that at his worst he weighed 120 lbs and resembled a stroke victim.
He was finally diagnosed with a very rare autoimmune illness called CLIPPERS syndrome (Chronic Lymphoctic Inflammation with Pointine Perivascular Enhancement Responsive to Steroids) We believe it was triggered by the Lyme.
The symptoms are double vision, ataxia, slurred speech, tingling in the hands & feet, facial numbness, etc. He was really in terrible condition and I feared the worst!
To get well he spend two weeks in the hospital in Oct.of last year and was given five days of intravenous prednisone....I know taking steriods is a BIG NO NO if you have Lyme and my husband was very aware of that so it was with much trepidation that he decided to go this route.
Amazingly it brought him back from almost near death. He did however insist on being able to continue getting his antibiotics intravenously while on the steriods.
Today almost six months later he's still taking steriods orally while tappering off very slowly and he also continues to take antibiotics orally as well. He watches his diet, only eating organic produce, wild caught fish & grass fed beef. He takes a lot of suppliments too.
While he's not 100% well...I'm not sure if he ever will be...He's much better and returned to work last month after being home for almost a year.
Sorry for my long winded post but I just had to jump in when I saw this thread asking about Lyme & autoimmune disease.