LymeNet Home LymeNet Home Page LymeNet Flash Discussion LymeNet Support Group Database LymeNet Literature Library LymeNet Legal Resources LymeNet Medical & Scientific Abstract Database LymeNet Newsletter Home Page LymeNet Recommended Books LymeNet Tick Pictures Search The LymeNet Site LymeNet Links LymeNet Frequently Asked Questions About The Lyme Disease Network LymeNet Menu

LymeNet on Facebook

LymeNet on Twitter




The Lyme Disease Network receives a commission from Amazon.com for each purchase originating from this site.

When purchasing from Amazon.com, please
click here first.

Thank you.

LymeNet Flash Discussion
Dedicated to the Bachmann Family

LymeNet needs your help:
LymeNet 2020 fund drive


The Lyme Disease Network is a non-profit organization funded by individual donations.

LymeNet Flash Post New Topic  New Poll  Post A Reply
my profile | directory login | register | search | faq | forum home

  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » Does this look like Bart?

 - UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!    
Author Topic: Does this look like Bart?
psano2
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 11711

Icon 1 posted      Profile for psano2     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I have this rash right now. One pic of my elbow and the other of my hip. The lineal length are about 1.5-2" long. Classic bart pictures seem to be much bigger, although I think I have a long one on my back.

I never tested positive for Bart, but I'm being treated for it w/Rifampin, azithromycin and doxy. I'm curious as to why I've gotten this rash now after months of treatment w/o any rash. The rash also extends over a lot of my back. I guess that's a silly question, since this illness doesn't behave rationally.

I'm going to see a dermatologist tomorrow for his input, but in the meantime I thought I'd get feedback here.


 -

 -

Posts: 975 | From California | Registered: Apr 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
steelbone
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 14014

Icon 1 posted      Profile for steelbone     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
The first picture looks like one similar to what i have on my forearm. My isn't very noticable but certainly looks like what I have

I had a positive test bart a few weeks ago as well

--------------------
All The Best,
Paul
[email protected]

The harder you work the luckier you get!

Posts: 965 | From Nebraska Cornhuskers fan in Massachusetts | Registered: Dec 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
bettyg
Unregistered


Icon 10 posted            Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
2nd photo looks really nasty; painful! [group hug] [kiss]

have them do a skin biopsy and send to a LYME DISEASE DIAGNOSTIC LAB!

i had 4 done; 2 came back from QUEST,,,"unknown bug bite"! [cussing]

IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
CD57
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 11749

Icon 1 posted      Profile for CD57     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
any chance it could be poison oak?? that's what mine looked like, with little clustery things.
Posts: 3528 | From US | Registered: Apr 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
map1131
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 2022

Icon 1 posted      Profile for map1131     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
The second pix looks like my skin breakout that I've been getting on my elbows for 6 mths. They come and go. Stays infected and inflammed for 2 weeks, clears up and goes away and then comes back again in two weeks.

They are very hard red bumps that itch, the skin surrounding the whole elbow will be red and inflammed. One elbow might be worse than the other.

I've got many sx of bart. Never tested positive. Just started levaquin yesterday. It will be interesting to see how many things react.

Since I've been home from NYC 3/16 I've had severe throat, sinus, mouth infection that is believed to be staph or strep. Didn't waste time or money testing for it.

I contolled it with rife for 4 days after coming home and then all heck broke loose. I'm only doing 250 mg (my request) per day for 30 days.

I'm frightened of abx and levaquin really scares me.

Pam

--------------------
"Never, never, never, never, never give up" Winston Churchill

Posts: 6454 | From Louisville, Ky | Registered: Jan 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
psano2
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 11711

Icon 1 posted      Profile for psano2     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Thanks for the responses everyone. I thought you'd be interested to hear that the dermatologist said that I have a "textbook" drug allergy, he believes due to the Plaquenil that I started about 2 months ago. He said that the timing is perfect.

I have my doubts, because he said that one of the characteristics of a drug allergy is that (and I forget the term he used) when you scratch yourself, the rash appears on top of the scratch, leading to the "linear" appearance of the rash. However, I've scratched myself a lot around these rashes and haven't had new "lines" of rashes appear where I've been scratching, so I really wonder. I'm going to Italy for 2 weeks soon, so I don't want to have to deal w/this while I'm there, if I can avoid it.

However, I'm seeing my LLMD this weekend, so I'll talk to him about discontinuing the plaquenil for a while to see if that helps.

CD57, no, it's definitely not poison oak or ivy. I haven't been anywhere near anything like that.

Map, that interesting that the 2nd photo looks like your elbow, because that is a picture of MY elbow. I would also describe the rash as hard bumps that are very itchy.

He gave me some topical steroids for it, which have helped calm down the rash somewhat, but it hasn't gone away completely. He also offered me oral steroids, which I declined. An interesting comment he thenmade was that he's starting to "learn the drill" because he now has about 4-5 Lyme patients that he sees (this is my DERMTOLOGIST!)....and this is in an area that's not supposed to have Lyme disease...Southern California. Very interesting....

Posts: 975 | From California | Registered: Apr 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Tincup
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5829

Icon 7 posted      Profile for Tincup         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Hey ps... Just a thought...

Have you been exposed to or rubbed up against any other plants besides poison ivy?

Also...

Do you know what scabbies are?

Check this out...

http://www.medicinenet.com/scabies/article.htm

http://www.visualdxhealth.com/adult/scabies.htm

http://www.bug-guy.com/ticks_mites_&_scabbies.htm

http://www.jfponline.com/pdf%2F5508%2F5508JFP_PhotoRounds.pdf

http://scabbiesmedicine.weebly.com/scabies-pictures.html

Hope you get it cleared up soon!

[Big Grin]

--------------------
www.TreatTheBite.com
www.DrJonesKids.org
www.MarylandLyme.org
www.LymeDoc.org

Posts: 20353 | From The Moon | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
h8lyme
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 11765

Icon 1 posted      Profile for h8lyme     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Thats what my rashes look like from bart.

Do you have pain in the soles of your feet?

Do you have dizzyness?

Do you have persistent headaches?

Those are my symptoms.

The skin flare seem to cycle worse to ok.

Posts: 158 | From Santa Monica | Registered: May 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
James H
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 6380

Icon 4 posted      Profile for James H     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Larva Migrans or larva Currens in my opinion...

http://www.emedicine.com/derm/topic91.htm

 -

Both are caused by larva of hookworms, strongyloides, or their relatives under the skin. Note the tracks clearly visible in your bottom photo.

Ivermectin or Albendazole will cure them as well as others you are not aware of. Much, MUCH easier to get rid of than Bart.

That is my opinion from personal experience.

Posts: 714 | From San Antonio TX | Registered: Oct 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
psano2
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 11711

Icon 1 posted      Profile for psano2     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Scabies or larva migrans?? Yuck. I hope not, and I don't think so. I don't have any pets and I've very much alone. Don't have a boyfried [Frown]
or sleep w/anyone who could pass scabies on to me. And I would think my dermatologist would have suggested it if he thought it was a possibility.

I don't go hiking at all, and stay away from grassy, natural areas. One thing I didn't include was a picture of my back which is/was extensivly involved w/rash as well. Hopefully the dermatologist is right. We'll see.

H8Lyme, my feet used to hurt a lot, but now I have just a residual numbness in my big toe on my left foot. Also get numbness along my outside 2 fingers, primarily on my left had, sometimes on both hands. Yes,I get headaches or head discomfort which is usually accompanied by eye droop (bell's palsy). No dizzyness. Sore throat occasionally.

Hopefully the dermatologist is right about the drug allergy. We'll see. Thanks for everyones' input. I'll let you know what happens.

Patti

Posts: 975 | From California | Registered: Apr 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
James H
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 6380

Icon 1 posted      Profile for James H     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
You highlight one of the obstacles to getting proper treatment for Lyme and most of it's co-infections. There is this attitude in this country that we Americans are far too sophistocated to have contracted any of these yucky 3rd world diseases, so we just put them out of our minds and pretend they are something else.

If you are here because you have Lyme, you have been in contact with TICKS. Yet, your lifestyle is so pristine that you have never been in contact with other things in the world ticks and their creepy little friends live in, such as damp soil or BEACH SAND?

Your dermatologist will no doubt attribute it to an allergy and give you a steriod for the inflamation. That is what people want to hear, and the same reason we get steroids for our 'Lyme Arthritis'. I bet he or she won't even check for any kind of infectuous cause.

quote:
Originally posted by psano2:
Scabies or larva migrans?? Yuck. I hope not, and I don't think so. I don't have any pets and I've very much alone. Don't have a boyfried [Frown]
or sleep w/anyone who could pass scabies on to me. And I would think my dermatologist would have suggested it if he thought it was a possibility.

I don't go hiking at all, and stay away from grassy, natural areas. One thing I didn't include was a picture of my back which is/was extensivly involved w/rash as well. Hopefully the dermatologist is right. We'll see.
---
Hopefully the dermatologist is right about the drug allergy. We'll see. Thanks for everyones' input. I'll let you know what happens.

Patti


Posts: 714 | From San Antonio TX | Registered: Oct 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
sixgoofykids
Moderator
Member # 11141

Icon 1 posted      Profile for sixgoofykids   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by James H:
You highlight one of the obstacles to getting proper treatment for Lyme and most of it's co-infections. There is this attitude in this country that we Americans are far too sophistocated to have contracted any of these yucky 3rd world diseases, so we just put them out of our minds and pretend they are something else.

Funny point. Not only do I have a nasty disease from a dirty tick, but I also had a 7 ft. long tapeworm .... the only "risky" eating I'm guilty of is a medium rare steak at a fancy restaurant! LOL

It actually looks just like when I get poison oak .... which I get very easily, I swear I don't have to touch it! I even got it in January one year!

Poison oak always affects me systemically .... It will spread to areas I know it did not contact ..... and I get those rashes in straight lines, too.

I'm not saying it is poison oak ..... just passing on experience that may/may not be relevant.

--------------------
sixgoofykids.blogspot.com

Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Tincup
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5829

Icon 7 posted      Profile for Tincup         Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I know the thought of other bugs is an icky one.. but I totally agree with James.. and I must add that it is possible to have something besides ticks attacking you...

And I do so because...

Mites can carry Bartonella and Lyme... etc.

If there is a problem with them... you'll need to control it or you would be re-infected continuously and you would stay sick.

And remember I am saying IF that could be the problem.. not for sure that is what it is... not at all.

Just don't close doors now.. as your health is at risk if you do.

OK?

[Big Grin]

--------------------
www.TreatTheBite.com
www.DrJonesKids.org
www.MarylandLyme.org
www.LymeDoc.org

Posts: 20353 | From The Moon | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
psano2
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 11711

Icon 1 posted      Profile for psano2     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
James H, I got the tick bite 4 years ago when I was talked into going to see a vacant lot against my better judgement....seriously. I really didn't want to go down there because it was all shrubby and rough, but my friend talked me into it. I know that's where I picked up the tick that bit me. We had to push through shrubs just to get onto the lot from the street. I'll never forget it, because I had on a pair of brand new shoes and didn't like the idea of getting them dirty. The next door neighbors had mentioned that they'd see deer down there by the stream but at the time I knew nothing of ticks & Lyme disease...

That's the last time I ever ventured into that kind of wild area. I live in the city and am not a Sierra Club type...especially now. I'll reserve my hiking for the mall or on fully paved sidewalks and streets. I don't like going barefoot at all except indoors. Walking barefoot outdoors has never appealed to me. I rarely go to the beach, and probably haven't been there in well over a year. Even then, I think I was wearing shoes. I live in a 3rd floor condominium and have no yard to work in. I don't even take care of any live plants. I'm a former hospital pharmacist, and when we learned about some of the things that could be picked up by walking barefoot, that sealed the deal for me. No walking barefoot outdoors for me. Unfortunately, Lyme disease wasn't well known enough to be taught in 1977, so I didn't learn about TBDs.

I suppose the only other place I could pick up something is when I pet someone else's dog occasionally. Or maybe I might bring a bug home on some fresh produce from the market? It's possible that a spider or mosquito could move in and bite me, but it's highly unlikely that I'm going to get it from being in close proximity to nature.

No, my dermatologist won't check me for any infectious cause. I asked him if it could be Bart, and he said emphatically "NO", and I'm still not sure I agree w/that. If he did suspect any sort of bug, I think he would have told me to go to an ID Dr, because he did that once before. But since my interaction w/ID's hasn't been great, I waited to talk to my LLMD, and that's what I'm going to do again this time too. I'm glad that I'll see him this weekend.

FWIW, the rash seems to be going away right now.

Patti

Posts: 975 | From California | Registered: Apr 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
James H
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 6380

Icon 1 posted      Profile for James H     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I keep bringing this up because finding out that a disgusting yucky lowlife organism was causing a rash like that... and getting rid of it... finally got me well.

But, we don't have things like that in America do we, so it is probably just an allergy. Regardless, that is what you will be treated for.

I agree, you would seem to be low risk. I know someone who had very bad Strongyloidiasis, and I have no clue as to how she might have gotten that considering her 'non earthy' lifestyle, but she did.

I wonder if fresh produce grown in infected areas might be a vector for some of these pests? Not that I want people to become afraid of the salad bar! The benefits of fresh vegetables far outweigh the risks, and most of the pests are easily treatable.

Ahh... the marvels of globalization!

[ 01. April 2008, 07:10 PM: Message edited by: James H ]

Posts: 714 | From San Antonio TX | Registered: Oct 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
psano2
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 11711

Icon 1 posted      Profile for psano2     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
ok, I've made a note of all the "icky" things that have been suggested in this thread, and I'll ask my LLMD when I see him this weekend.
Posts: 975 | From California | Registered: Apr 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
James H
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 6380

Icon 4 posted      Profile for James H     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Just to clarify... The rash that I had was itself just an annoyance and not too useful diagnostically. It was a side effect of a systemic Strongyloides infection that had spread through my entire body and was causing all sorts of problems.

It was so bad that I could blow my nose over a slide, look with a low power microscope, and count 50 or so of the larval worms that had come out of my sinuses. Of course they were everywhere else too, but it is a bad infection when they can readily be found in the sinuses.

Ok, probably a rare situation, right? Well, since then several of our acquaintences suffering from 'allergy" and/or Lyme like symptoms have tried this little check and had Strongyloides larvae in their sinus drainage too.

As much as the Chamber of Commerce would want to deny it, this is probably an endemic area for Strongyloides, so it is maybe no surprise.

But... the woman I mentioned in the previous post lived in the Napa Valley and did not do things outdoors or garden. Our friends at Kaiser in Santa Rosa were treating her with steroid inhalers for 'allergies' while the little worms were out of control and doing permanent damage to her lungs. Strongyloides can kill you when they get out of hand.

I think there is a problem that is being ignored here.

This discussion isn't directed so much to you personally as it is to the whole Lymenet group. I would like all of them to be at least aware of this. Fortunately it is easy to treat.

There are some very good LLMD's in your area, and hopefully yours will be alert to other coinfections aside from the usuals. Good health to you.

Regards,
James

Posts: 714 | From San Antonio TX | Registered: Oct 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
map1131
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 2022

Icon 1 posted      Profile for map1131     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
psano2 & everyone interested in the pix (#2) and the skin reaction on my elbows or yours? My skin break out on my elbows runs in cycles.

Steroid creams and anti itch creams soothe them enough to tolerate until they clear up only to break out again in 2 weeks. So it's two weeks on skin breakout on elbows to clear it up some and then bam.

Not only is the skin effected by whatever this is? So is the joint in both my elbows. I've never had any elbow joint problems until about 6 mths ago.

About the same time I started having strange sores on my feet? Now those took weeks to heal those. Doc said I probably got staph or strep in them. My feet are scared from those sores.

My doc gave me non steriod anti inflammatory meds to take when the pain starts in my elbows. It helps during the flares. I usually just use tramadol and iburephon for inflammation, but that wasn't touching it.

So whatever this is on my elbows is also internal????? Sound familiar?

psano2, good luck with your treating.

Pam

--------------------
"Never, never, never, never, never give up" Winston Churchill

Posts: 6454 | From Louisville, Ky | Registered: Jan 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
James H
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 6380

Icon 1 posted      Profile for James H     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Map,

These are what I had...
http://www.emedicine.com/med/topic2189.htm

And a more detailed article with a broader perspective...
http://tmcr.usuhs.mil/tmcr/chapter13/intro.htm

Incidentally Kentucky is frequently mentioned as an endemic area for Strongyloides stercoralis.

You can look for them yourself in sinus drainage (or in sputum if you have a cough). All you need is a crude low power microscope with a 10x lens. Without stains they are totally transparent but easily seen and easily recognized.

My symptoms aside from the re-occurring rash on the backs of my thighs were a chronic low grade cough, sinus infections and headaches, joint and muscle pain, and sometimes bladder irritation. (yes, they were in my urine too.)

It gradually all goes away once you treat the worms. I would think that whatever is left of the Lyme is much easier to deal with when you aren't fighting multiple things at once.

It is definitely worth the trouble to look.

Posts: 714 | From San Antonio TX | Registered: Oct 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
map1131
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 2022

Icon 1 posted      Profile for map1131     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
James, I would say very interesting. But what I really think is this is disgusting. But I've been reading the info on this thread and something is concerning me.

One I had bloody mucous sinus blobs coming from my nose from Dec until just 2 weeks ago. I had a deer/nymph tick on the tip of my nose for 14 days the first of Dec. No, I didn't realize the sore on my nose was a tick. I thought it was a spider bite that I was treating for 2 weeks.

This is when these sores starting appearing in my nasal cavity. Blowing my nose due to feel of something up in my nose. Plugs of mucous and blood mixed. I've been really quite puzzled by it all.

My grandsons were spending the night that the "supposed" spider bite me. I go to their house quite often. They only live 20 minutes away from me. But they so live out in the country.

In fact, they live next to a family farm. Cattle, horses, outdoor dogs. Of course they have the mouse fight that happens every fall before winter. Barns aren't good enough for the mice in winter.

Two children that are messy and leave food droppings everywhere they go. Perfect house to set up camp in for the winter.

I killed the tick on my nose with peroxide and abx creme early on, I think. The son of a gun was buried deep. It bleed everyday and I treated it every day.

This country house is up for sale. Lots of action on it since Nov. I can't wait till I don't have to worry about my grandsons and myself and ticks out in the country life.

I HATE TICKS. Hate is a strong word for me. I don't allow my grandsons to use that word. I HATE Ticks.

Thanks for info, James. I will read more later.


Pam

--------------------
"Never, never, never, never, never give up" Winston Churchill

Posts: 6454 | From Louisville, Ky | Registered: Jan 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Lymetoo
Moderator
Member # 743

Icon 1 posted      Profile for Lymetoo     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
****I suppose the only other place I could pick up something is when I pet someone else's dog occasionally.****

You CAN get poison ivy or poison oak from a pet who has been running around in it.

I agree....parasites are MUCH more common than any of us care to know.

Thanks for all the info, James! I may find it usueful for myself!

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

Posts: 96063 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
James H
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 6380

Icon 1 posted      Profile for James H     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Tick diseases are pretty disgusting too. At least these are easy to diagnose and will go away with treatment.
Posts: 714 | From San Antonio TX | Registered: Oct 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
   

Quick Reply
Message:

HTML is not enabled.
UBB Code is enabled.

Instant Graemlins
   


Post New Topic  New Poll  Post A Reply Close Topic   Feature Topic   Move Topic   Delete Topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:


Contact Us | LymeNet home page | Privacy Statement

Powered by UBB.classic™ 6.7.3


The Lyme Disease Network is a non-profit organization funded by individual donations. If you would like to support the Network and the LymeNet system of Web services, please send your donations to:

The Lyme Disease Network of New Jersey
907 Pebble Creek Court, Pennington, NJ 08534 USA


| Flash Discussion | Support Groups | On-Line Library
Legal Resources | Medical Abstracts | Newsletter | Books
Pictures | Site Search | Links | Help/Questions
About LymeNet | Contact Us

© 1993-2020 The Lyme Disease Network of New Jersey, Inc.
All Rights Reserved.
Use of the LymeNet Site is subject to Terms and Conditions.