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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » Has anyone tried CBD oil?

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Author Topic: Has anyone tried CBD oil?
stefi42
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Hello everyone!

I was wondering if anyone here had any experience with CBD oil and if they do, any recommendations for certain brands hey like.

My boyfriend got my this free sample from Gentleman's Brand a while back befor with even knew I had Lyme. It was he only thing that would give me near immediate relief from whatever pain or symptoms I might have had that day.

I got a new vape pen and have been trying to find an oil that works best for my symptoms.

I used to smoke a lot more often but now I only do in small dosages bc too much THC makes my heart palptitations even worse. But that's not to say that THC doesn't help me. It helps tremendously. And even more so with CBD.

Does anyone have any experience or suggestions with this?

Thanks in advance!

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Robin123
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There's a new book out on this - yes, it helps some Lyme patients -

https://www.lymedisease.org/book-review-cannabis-for-lyme-disease-and-related-conditions/

I also see that there's a speaker on cannabis oil today, the first day of the online summit on detoxing. I haven't watched yet so don't know how it is - you could check it out - sign up to watch at www.thedetoxproject.com

[ 09-26-2016, 04:56 PM: Message edited by: Robin123 ]

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MichaelTampa
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My doc recommends "bluebird botanicals". I haven't tried anything else.
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S13
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CBD is great for neuro inflammatory diseases!

Read up about the NO-ONOO cycle and how this vicious oxidative cycle gets overactive by the immunesystem and NMDA receptor stimulation. CBD seems to be able to reduce both elements and more!

Chris shade (from mercury detox) has a recent video showing the potential of CBD:
https://youtu.be/b4Gv4e-kJBk
(there is also a second part to this video on youtube now)

THC by itself doesnt provide the benefits that CBD does. So always use either a mixture of CBD/THC or a more pure CBD oil.

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Muscle Car55
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CBD oil is incredible, but that’s only if you buy the right brand! A lot of the CBD oil online is just industrial hemp, not the same thing as the CBD oil derived from a high CBD cannabis/marijuana plant, which Charlotte’s Web used to be.

I haven’t tried this new Charolttes Web version that’s being sold online by the Stanley Brothers, but from what I remember, the Stanley brothers claimed they bred a high CBD cannabis plant with a Hemp Industrial plant to conceive this “legal” product.

I honestly don’t think you’re going to get the same affect you will with a CBD oil that’s derived from a high CBD cannabis plant.

Many of these CBD oil companies know this, yet they still market these industrial hemp oils with big claims.

The major factor as I’ve found out through research, is keeping just enough THC in with the CBD to give synergistic effect, along with plenty of other cannabinoids and terpenes, which I assume a lot of these industrial Hemp plants are lacking.

Industrial Hemp is still very nutritious, high in protein, and has cannabinoids. But it's just no as potent as cannabis is for inflammation, as well as chronic infections like antibiotic reistant MRSA.
http://reset.me/story/marijuana-the-super-antibiotic-of-the-future/

(breaking up the post for easier reading for many here)

[ 09-28-2016, 02:17 AM: Message edited by: Robin123 ]

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Keebler
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-
Is there a different delivery system you could use other than vaping as the propellants / vapor producers have been found to contain some harmful chemicals. And you'd never have to worry about a battery possibly exploding.

Some people with epilepsy use CBD oil just as drops under the tongue. It would be prepared a certain way, of course.
-

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Keebler
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-
While you might want this for other reasons, you might want to connect with some of the Epilepsy groups around CBD oil use. They have blazed the trail and would know the best forms / delivery methods.

Some good links pop up with a Google search for:

Epilepsy, CBD
-

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Muscle Car55
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quote:
Originally posted by Keebler:
-
Is there a different delivery system you could use other than vaping as the propellants / vapor producers have been found to contain some harmful chemicals. And you'd never have to worry about a battery possibly exploding.

Some people with epilepsy use CBD oil just as drops under the tongue. It would be prepared a certain way, of course.
-

The platium vape cartridges I use are just CO2 extracted, based in coconut oil with organic cannabis. No harmful chemicals that I know of...

You can vape with a vape pen or with a vaporizer, which you put the cannabis flowers in directly in the machine which then turns it to vapor without becoming a carcinogen(no additives at all).

There's much cheaper machines than the Volcano, I had a friend give me one, but can't remember what the name is, it's in my basement. I'd just rather do the vape pen with the platinum vape cartridges...

http://www.vaporizergalaxy.com/volcano-digital-vaporizer.html?gclid=CLGuvJyLsM8CFQIpaQodD3oBdg

But yeah, you gotta be careful with inhaling products of any sort. I know cannabis is considered to have healing properties, it still makes me wonder if it irritates our lungs.

I haven't smoked since I was like 16 and when I did, I did it like for a week. But I'd never do traditional vaping with all the crap thats out there, I'm still weary of claims like these.
http://www.leafscience.com/2014/01/11/3-studies-prove-vaporizers-good-lungs/

But for the most part, I think it's a better alternative for smokers like my girlfriend. I just do cannabis vaping 100% for the medicinal purposes which are pretty amazing, it's basically cured my sciatica, it slowly slowly went away.

Now it could come back if I get off, but like ILADs says, treat until you don't feel any symptoms left!

I was skeptic too of marijuna, never tried it till last year, but it works!!! Works beyond anything I've ever tried naturally too! Instantly you can feel the effects, compared to Turmeric or other stuff...

That's when I tell people, if you're not feeling any affects in your joints or pain within minutes with CBD oil, chances are it's weak industrial hemp.

The Special FX brand I use actually got me a high at first, it no longer does that. The high was nothing like the marijuana high, just a little euphoria for short 10-20 minutes that's all... Here's an image of it
 -

A lot of the industrial hemp has THC .3 and lower, I'm guessing whatever this company does they use a high CBD cannabis plant, leave in a little THC, definitely more than .3 to keep the synergistic affect going. That's probably why they still just sell it at the dispensary, not online.

What's scary too is, a lot of the marijuana dispensaries in Michigan are starting to carry the industrial hemp sold online, a lot of them probably aren't aware of the difference.

I might just stick with CBD oil and RSO, but haven't decided yet. I think I felt the most affect on my sciatica with CBD, but you get the synergistic affect adding in THC vaping. It all works in my opinion!

You have to be aware the different strains of cannabis do different things, Joe Rogan talked about it on his show. Sativa can give you energy, while Indica can make you sleepy. Hybrid strains also made me sleepy, they all work good for pain, but at different levels.

Smoking is way to potent, at least with vaping you can do it in tiny little concentrates so you're not knocked out on the floor.

Right now I'm close to 90%, it's hard to tell if vaping marijuana is killing off the borrelia bacteria. I'll say this, I've had the same muscle twitching and symptoms I did with using antibiotics when I first got on them 5 years ago.

Is it herxing? Hard to say, considering this article, maybe...
http://reset.me/story/marijuana-the-super-antibiotic-of-the-future/

Still a matter of getting past the biofilms which most antibiotics cannot do, but if this stuff works as a powerful antbiotic,

it might be the best alternative we got compared to traditional antibiotics, as well as the other natural antibiotics that's available, which in my opinion are very weak.

Find another natural supplement that treats antibiotic resistant MRSA? They're might be some, but I'm sure it's overhyped!

Think about cannabis plants is, they've been bread over and over again with different strains to build a pretty powerful plant.

I can't believe how strong the odor is, considering if you grow it you could probably smell it a block away. Not many plants have same effect, something special with this plant.

And I'm downright pissed off I didn't use it earlier when I first contracted this disease. Sad it's been concealed by our government for decades, I guess we know now why, especially when you see the US government hold patents on it..

I beg you guys to watch the special Real Sports did on cannabis in the NFL. Sad this is the only video that shows the whole episode, but it's still watchable, there's short little clips in other place on YouTube, but this is the whole episode
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AccREj2l7c4

Dr. Raphael Mechoulam of Hebrew University of Jerusalem claimed mice were able to recover from a brain injury by 50%. The study was published by “three” major medical journals!

(breaking up the post for easier reading for many here)

[ 09-28-2016, 02:20 AM: Message edited by: Robin123 ]

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Robin123
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I listened to Philip Blair speak on the first day of the detox summit yesterday, which is running everyday through Oct 3 - www.thedetoxproject.com -
He made CBD oil sound fantastic! He recommends a brand called Elixinol.

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hopingandpraying
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My young adult son is using CBD oil, but no changes in his symptoms have been noticed. His LLMD recommend using a stronger type of oil as well as looking into Medical Cannabis and referred us to Shelley White's book, "Cannabis for Lyme Disease and Related Conditions".
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MattH
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Tried the CBD for 3 months with no neuro improvements. Was using one of the brands mentioned above but not sure it is the brand or me. I did not sense any changes what so ever.

All the Best, MattH

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Rumigirl
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This a a good thread. Thank you for the good links, Muscle Car, and others.

It's sad that there is still so much ignorance and obstinnce in this country, reflected in the laws of many states, including mine. Of course, we know that greed is behind it for the most part. Sigh, mustn't interfere with the profits of you-know-what!

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Rumigirl
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quote:
Originally posted by Muscle Car55:
CBD oil is incredible, but that’s only if you buy the right brand! A lot of the CBD oil online is just industrial hemp, not the same thing as the CBD oil derived from a high CBD cannabis/marijuana plant, which Charlotte’s Web used to be.

I haven’t tried this new Charolttes Web version that’s being sold online by the Stanley Brothers, but from what I remember, the Stanley brothers claimed they bred a high CBD cannabis plant with a Hemp Industrial plant to conceive this “legal” product.

I honestly don’t think you’re going to get the same affect you will with a CBD oil that’s derived from a high CBD cannabis plant.

Many of these CBD oil companies know this, yet they still market these industrial hemp oils with big claims.

The major factor as I’ve found out through research, is keeping just enough THC in with the CBD to give synergistic effect, along with plenty of other cannabinoids and terpenes, which I assume a lot of these industrial Hemp plants are lacking.

Industrial Hemp is still very nutritious, high in protein, and has cannabinoids. But it's just no as potent as cannabis is for inflammation, as well as chronic infections like antibiotic reistant MRSA.
http://reset.me/story/marijuana-the-super-antibiotic-of-the-future/

(breaking up the post for easier reading for many here)

That link is quite good, thank you, Muscle Car. Your name brings me a chuckle.
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Muscle Car55
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quote:
Originally posted by Muscle Car55:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by hopingandpraying:
[qb] My young adult son is using CBD oil, but no changes in his symptoms have been noticed. His LLMD recommend using a stronger type of oil as well as looking into Medical Cannabis and referred us to Shelley White's book, "Cannabis for Lyme Disease and Related Conditions".

quote:
Originally posted by MattH:
Tried the CBD for 3 months with no neuro improvements. Was using one of the brands mentioned above but not sure it is the brand or me. I did not sense any changes what so ever.

All the Best, MattH

Don't give up hope with this stuff, believe me it works. You should feel some type of weird feeling in your head when you first get on the stuff, like a little bit of a high. I had a friend of mine try the CBD oil by Special FX and even he said he got high as a kite. It goes away after a month once your body gets used to it, but you should feel the effects instantly.

Some of the CBD oil I've bought by "Motor City Medicine" at a dispensary in Ann Arbor Michigan was tested by IRON Labrotories, it actually shows all the percentages on cannabinoids. As you see this CBD oil has .6 THC which makes it illegal. This stuff works great, you feel instant relief. The stuff you're buying online, no one knows the level of CBD nor the level of THC, THC might be nonexistant! And as you see with this CBD oil, it has CBD percentage of 53.5, that's pretty powerful. As well as other cannabinoids like CBG, CBN, CBDV, CBC... The industrial hemp online could be missing a lot of these cannabinoids, which prevents the synergestic effect you get with a high bred CBD cannabis plant, I just don't think you can get the same effect with industrial hemp! As I'm seeing in these statements by you guys, you're feeling nothing.

I tried this legal crap I bought at a Dispensary in Detroit, pluscbdoil.com it tasted like coffey and I felt no benefit, nothing! It's completely legal and can bought online, why some dispensaries are starting to carry this crap I don't know, I guess because it's labeled CBD and the dispensary owners think it's the same thing as the real high CBD cannabis stuff. But I'm sure people are buying it and thinking it's the same thing, it's not!

The industrial hemp even tastes different than the Special FX oil which I bought in a syringe like this PlusCBDoil stuff which is in a plastic syringe.
 -

And honestly, I'm thinking of dropping the vape pen and going back to just the vaping machine, which heats up the whole flower so you get the whole effect. Like Keebler said, problem with oils and vaping pens is, they have to use solvents to strip all the cannabinoids off and terpenes, same way they do stuff like Cat's Claw which has alcohol in it. Some of these new products use CO2 which supposed to be better, but I believe you probably get more of synergistic effect if you vape the whole flower with a vaping machine that way it's in its most pure form.

But don't get me wrong, the Rick Simpson Oil(THC), CBD oils are still super powerful!!! They are a Godsend, I still use CBD oil with vaping cannabis Sativa. Oils have shown to shrink tumors and help pain time and time again. I'm just saying if you're going to do cannabis vaping/smoking, I would do the vaping machines like the Volcano that way you get the purest form, there's no unwanted additives, and it's not a carcinogen!

Anyways, I was like all of you 2 years ago, didn't know anything about cannabis and CBD oil, until I tried both of them a year ago and couldn't believe the relief I got with joint pain, sciatica, and even neurological thinking. I can think better now, think of things more on the spot that I could before. I still get those days where I have small brain fog, but it's a lot better.

I know I was a little harsh in previous posts chastising natural antibiotics like Samento, Cats Claw, some of the natural biofilm busters, and Rife Machines. Someone actually called me up anonymously must of got my phone number of my domain on the web, which I don't mind. But she thought I was completely against natural products. I'm not, I just think a lot of them are overhyped and you'd be wasting your money using some of them. Lets face it, a lot of this stuff is costly and the money could be used on other stuff like actual antibiotics and CBD oil/cannabis, stuff which has been proven to work in studies, as well as feeling it instantly. I still take Vitamin D, Vitamin C, Turmeric and garlic... I feel vitamins do work and they can slowly help you get back to your normal state with battling this horrible disease. But anyways, please dont take these statements the wrong way, don't want to get in another argument on here, maybe Rife machines do work, but I'm really skeptic on those machines, especially the ones bought on the web. Maybe the original machine did work! Maybe there's differences in the original to the ones on the web, just like we're seeing with the CBD oils. I don't know, but what I do know is things aren't so black and white with these treatments, there's a big gray are there...

There's something about cannabis, it might make you brain dead when using it. But maybe because it makes you think harder when using it, you're stimulating brain function or something, my friend came up with that theory. Or it just might help with brain function plain and simple.

And just remember, as Joe Rogan expresses on his popular show on YouTube. There's a big difference in the types of cannabis out there!!! I swear to God that Sativa type can give you energy and get you out doing things you normally wouldn't have the energy for, which most of you would benefit from with Lyme Disease. I noticed an improvement with my sexual drive as well when vaping Sativa based cannabis strains.

Indica and other hybrid cannabis works great for pain and neurlogical function, but as Joe Rogan said this stuff can make you extremetly sleepy and put you on the ground. Just like I stated with the CBD oil above, remember that your body is slowly adjusting to it. While you'll see a few side effects here and there like paranoia, maybe some hangovers, dizziness, of course highness as well. Your body will adjust and you'll handle it bettter.

Here's some interesting news, GW Pharmaceuticals, a British biotech company announced positive results on its latest Phase 3 clinical trial for its cannabis drug Epidiolex.

"GW Pharmaceutical Gets Closer To Forcing FDA On Cannabis"
http://www.forbes.com/sites/debraborchardt/2016/09/28/gw-pharmaceutical-gets-closer-to-forcing-fda-on-cannabis/#4adb188c22d9

And by the way, do make sure you check out Joe Rogan's channel men and lades on LymeNet. I know some of the stuff can be controversial on there and possibly angler/frustrate some people. But from time to time he's got some really really good nutritionists and naturalpaths on there like Chris Kesser. Rogan's a pretty open minded individual, very spiritual, very smart and an impressive memory bank where he can think of things right on the spot. Who would of ever guessed right? The guy from Fear Factor was so deep, lol... He even lights marijuana from time to time up on the show, lol. Anyways, be sure to check him out and this great clip here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_2vNj8pshY

It would be great if he could of Dr. B, Dr. H, or someone from ILADs on the show one of these days. His podcasts can be 3 hours long! I'll message him and see if he'll do it!

Take care!

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Rumigirl
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Muscle Car,

I haven't yet read all of your new comments yet, but on Dr. B & Dr. H coming on a radio show about cannabis, they both have MD's in a state that is quite strict on cannabis, in spite of now finally having a medical MJ law. It is the most restrictive such law in the country, except for Minnesota which is also as bad.

They need to preserve their MD's, which has already been a horrific battle for both of them, esp Dr. B.

If Cuomo, the governor, who made the law so strict, had to spend just one night in the kind of pain that I'm in every minute, he'd run screaming to his doctor!!

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Muscle Car55
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quote:
Originally posted by Rumigirl:
Muscle Car,

I haven't yet read all of your new comments yet, but on Dr. B & Dr. H coming on a radio show about cannabis, they both have MD's in a state that is quite strict on cannabis, in spite of now finally having a medical MJ law. It is the most restrictive such law in the country, except for Minnesota which is also as bad.

They need to preserve their MD's, which has already been a horrific battle for both of them, esp Dr. B.

If Cuomo, the governor, who made the law so strict, had to spend just one night in the kind of pain that I'm in every minute, he'd run screaming to his doctor!!

I don't mean Dr. H and Dr. B coming on the show and talking about cannabis, I meant just Lyme Disease in general. I just intertwined Rogan into the conversation because he's helped me understand cannabis more. But then a light bulb went off in my head, why doesn't someone from ILADs come on the show to talk about Lyme, maybe even Tom Grier who's been on C2C, I'll talk about that later...

Joe Rogan show has blown up, if you look at how many views it gets, along with the information involved in each episode and how long it is(3 hours long.) It's just very educational. He's always having good guests on about health, medicine, drugs, guns, wars, etc... All types of different controversial things in the world, the recent one is John Antony West - John Anthony West is an American author, lecturer, guide and a proponent of Sphinx water erosion hypothesis in geology.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGu7MLp574A

I just think think Lyme would be a great controversial topic to be talked about on JRE. Just like how it's been talked about on shows like Coast to Coast AM, when Tom Grier went on. The stuff Noory and Tom Grier talked about was incredible.

You learn a lot from radio shows, a lot more than the TV which is just a short program. I couldn't believe how there was a Doctor that worked on the connection of borrelia to MS all the way back decades ago at my own local college Wayne State, way before Dr. MacDonald. As well as how Tom Grier and his colleagues joked about MS standing for multiple spirochetes.

I recommend listening to every episode with Tom Grier in the Coast to Coast AM archives! They were up on YouTube for a moment back in the day but they were taken down due to copyright infringement. It costs like $6 bucks or so to just subscribe fore a month to listen to them. And really, that's another plus, Joe Rogan's show is free to watch other than some short commercials, but even those can be blocked out with ad-block I think.

Having incredible tips on Lyme Disease on a show that lasts 3 hours long could be super valuable for anyone with Lyme. Problems when these LLMDs make appearances on TV and other shows, they tend to be short and not enough information. They try to cram too much information in one small show... I think at Joe Rogan, it's a more relax atmosphere, no rush, just start spewing things...

I also think Rogan is the best host, because he knows how to ask the right questions at the right time. He's been doing it for a long time, he's a comedian as well. Comedians have to think on-spot, respond to how the crowds reacting to their jokes, adapt, etc. Being a stand-up comedian is not easy. And if you've ever watched Rogan, the guys has incredible memory bank!

Just considering how many people watch the show, I just thought he'd be great to talk about Lyme, as well as the controversial link of borrelia to these autoimmune disorders.

I sent him a message on Facebook, hopefully he reads it.

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MattH
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Muscle Car,

Thanks for sharing your experience!!! I am glad your approach has worked well for you and I appreciate your passion to help others.

A bit of an explanation to provide a bit more clarity. I tried 3 different, highly recommended CBD oils at different times starting about 3 years ago and did one of those as a longer trial for about three months. I did not feel much if anything.

It may have been that I was pretty sick at the time and maybe I needed several years of the stuff. However between the cost and not getting results, I quit.

The ABX I took for over 3 1/2 years seems to have helped me get over Bartonella, but I am still dealing with Lyme. The ABX has caused a fatty liver condition so now I am dealing with pre-diabetes (elevated A1C and the symptoms).

I was stunned with the diagnosis so I again did a lot of research and read a couple books, websites and videos. About 60 days ago I started a Ketogenic diet and have lost some weight while I am cleaning up my body. It may take a good 4 to 5 months to really show great results (lower LDL, triglycerides, BP, reduced internal inflammation, reduced brain fog, and more energy). Thankfully I can currently operate well enough to do this diet and fight the Lyme (yes I still have those very bad and listless days).

Additionally I tried several months of an herb from Oregon that is illegal in many states that many Lyme patients were having success with. A very specific Lymie blend if you will. I did get to sleep better, had wild dreams, and seemed to sleep longer. However I did not improve against the Lyme, so after about another 3 months I called it quits. Also if I over-did it before bed, because it is a gooey mess to handle, I would be in slow motion for most of the morning.

I work 50 hour weeks most weeks so moving slow in the morning is an issue at work. I did lots of research, hung out on a Facebook site, and asked questions, and watch hours of videos. I wished it would have worked for me but to no avail.

So yes there may be that unique combination of bud that will help me but I have not experienced it yet. So it is back to numerous herbs, a Rife machine, and Ozone saunas. I still have some mercury detox to do and this diet will help with that also.

All the Best, MattH

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Muscle Car55
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quote:
Originally posted by MattH:
Muscle Car,

Thanks for sharing your experience!!! I am glad your approach has worked well for you and I appreciate your passion to help others.

A bit of an explanation to provide a bit more clarity. I tried 3 different, highly recommended CBD oils at different times starting about 3 years ago and did one of those as a longer trial for about three months. I did not feel much if anything.

It may have been that I was pretty sick at the time and maybe I needed several years of the stuff. However between the cost and not getting results, I quit.

The ABX I took for over 3 1/2 years seems to have helped me get over Bartonella, but I am still dealing with Lyme. The ABX has caused a fatty liver condition so now I am dealing with pre-diabetes (elevated A1C and the symptoms).

I was stunned with the diagnosis so I again did a lot of research and read a couple books, websites and videos. About 60 days ago I started a Ketogenic diet and have lost some weight while I am cleaning up my body. It may take a good 4 to 5 months to really show great results (lower LDL, triglycerides, BP, reduced internal inflammation, reduced brain fog, and more energy). Thankfully I can currently operate well enough to do this diet and fight the Lyme (yes I still have those very bad and listless days).

Additionally I tried several months of an herb from Oregon that is illegal in many states that many Lyme patients were having success with. A very specific Lymie blend if you will. I did get to sleep better, had wild dreams, and seemed to sleep longer. However I did not improve against the Lyme, so after about another 3 months I called it quits. Also if I over-did it before bed, because it is a gooey mess to handle, I would be in slow motion for most of the morning.

I work 50 hour weeks most weeks so moving slow in the morning is an issue at work. I did lots of research, hung out on a Facebook site, and asked questions, and watch hours of videos. I wished it would have worked for me but to no avail.

So yes there may be that unique combination of bud that will help me but I have not experienced it yet. So it is back to numerous herbs, a Rife machine, and Ozone saunas. I still have some mercury detox to do and this diet will help with that also.

All the Best, MattH

Sorry to hear you haven't had much success with cannabis Matt. I've been having little bit of hangovers here and there smoking and vaping Sativa cannabis. I noticed it can give you some energy here and there, as well as help pain, but I cant get passed these hangovers so I'm quitting Sativa.

CBD oil has never given me hangovers, great for pain and energy as well. So I'm probably going to just stick to the oils from now on... Yeah, not all the different brands work, you gotta find what works for you. And as you've found out, it becomes an expensive journey. Especially since all this industrial hemp CBD has hit the market.

The hybrid cannabis vaping never gave me the hangovers I'm getting from Sativa strain. My conclusions is, I gotta stick with what works and keeps me functional...

I'm going to be dropping Sativa because of the hangovers. Is this actually leftover herxing, not sure. But doesn't feel very good. Going to stick with oils, which I love... Rick Simpson Oil, CBD oil...

Since RSO can make you drowsy, I'd take that at night and CBD oil during the day...

Hope you get better Matt, it's a realy tough disease to fight, I lift weights and do cardio, I think that has helped me tremendously with the fight of Lyme, but it's something that's hard to measure how much it's actually helped.

Keep taking your vitamins and pulsing antibiotics here and there, you'll get better!

Bottom line, I think edible oils is the way to go. Sure they say vaping absorbs THC and other cannabinoids, but whether or not this is still irritant for the lungs is still up in the air. Maybe it will actually heal the lungs, but ya gotta be careful...

I'll probably vape here and there still, but I love my oils.

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Muscle Car55
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Listen what Joey Diaz says, right around 1:00:07

Small percentage of THC is vital to keep that synergistic effect for CBD oil! I know the guy's just a comedian, but he knows what works due to dealing with his own pain and inflammation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gg8TPNFrLCk&t=58m5s

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dan67
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Many articles on pub med say cannabis is immunosuppressive. Isn't anyone worried about that? Couldn't that be why it makes us feel better, followed by a potential relapse, just like steroids?
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Muscle Car55
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There's also articles on pub med suggesting antibiotics do not work against Lyme longterm, published by the CDC and IDSA. Do you trust those studies?

Or the study once stating cigarettes were healthy...
http://www.healio.com/hematology-oncology/news/print/hemonc-today/%7B241d62a7-fe6e-4c5b-9fed-a33cc6e4bd7c%7D/cigarettes-were-once-physician-tested-approved

I published articles in both CBD posts you've posted in, stating the benefits of cannabis through "recent" studies and articles, results showing it as a powerful antibiotic and being healing properties to the brain. If you're worried about it being immunosuppressive, it's simple don't take it then!

I'd be more worried about the pain pills that people are taking to dealing with Lyme, than cannabis. That's the real immunosuppressive, well actually they just kill you!

"Painkiller Overdoses Kill More Than One American Every Hour"

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/07/01/america-s-prescription-opiate-problem-isn-t-going-anywhere.html

You don't see people overdosing on cannabis do you? You have very few options with longterm pain...

Natural Supplements
-------------------
Turmeric - Helps, but pretty weak
Fish Oil - Helps, but still pretty weak
Kratom - Powerful, but now illegal, few if any side effects
Cannabis - Powerful, Legal in some states, few if any side affects

Pharmaceutical Pain Pills
-------------------------
NSAIDS - 16,500 - NSAID-related deaths occur among patients with rheumatoid arthritis or osteoarthritis every year in the United States http://americannutritionassociation.org/newsletter/deadly-nsaids

Opioids - 18,000 in 2014 - Opioid addiction is driving this epidemic, with 18,893 overdose deaths.

Those are pretty much your options, good luck!

You can't take any of those pharmaceutical pain pills longterm, which chronic Lyme Disease is! They will end up giving you ulcers short term, long term heart attacks and probably death, regardless of what your Doctor says, which basically are drug dealers now, since they get kickbacks.

Again, one can only assume why Hillary promised the bankers to keep cannabis illegal.
https://www.mintpressnews.com/leak-reveals-clinton-promised-bankers-to-stand-against-marijuana-legalization/221341/

Maker of Deadly Fentanyl Kicks in Half a Million to Defeat Pot Legalization in Arizona
http://www.alternet.org/drugs/maker-deadly-fentanyl-kicks-half-million-dollars-defeat-pot-legalization-arizona

God I hope you can put two and two together dan67. One you can grow in your backyard, the other you have to buy from a pharmacy down the street...

P.S. Stop watching Nancy Grace!

"After a shocking video shows a 1-year-old girl forced to inhale from an alleged marijuana pipe, HLN’s Nancy Grace goes head-to-head with pot-supporter Norm Kent and renowned addiction specialist Brad Lamm on just how harmful the legalization of pot can be for children."
http://www.hlntv.com/video/2014/03/11/video-shows-toddler-girl-forced-smoke-pot

She's willing to demonize marijuana, but all our young teenagers getting hooked on pain pills and dieing from opioids is alright though.

Stop buying into propaganda!!!!

But hey, I understand where you're coming from. It's very similar to Lyme Disease in the fact that a lot of Lyme Patients are told one thing from the CDC and their doctors, but come to find out truth is the other way around. A lot of people have complete nervous breakdowns because of this! This was going to be shown in the documentary Under Our Skin, but was stripped out because the director didn't want Lyme patients to seem like nuts.

I guess it was easier for me, since I knew the government, organizations like the CDC and doctors were corrupted by lobbyists and corporations. A lot of people lay to much trust in the government and their studies, which we've all found out through Lyme can easily be manipulated!

Sometimes your brain just needs a full reset to understand things in the Lyme World. Hope some of the information I provided you helps.

Director Chris Bell whose a big advocate of Kratom made a good documentary about all this, it's call Prescription Thugs, I recommend you watching it to better understand the world you live in.
https://thevideobee.to/tt5tenaanvgt.html

And if you do try cannabis, remember there are a lot of forms to take, some will make you lethargic and sleepy. CBD oil and Sativa strains don't do that.

A lot of people will take Indica and just be done with it. Lot of options out there folks!

[ 10-20-2016, 10:09 AM: Message edited by: Muscle Car55 ]

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LisaK
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some peopel I know use a capsule and insert it in their rectum and they say this helps with the anxiety or heart palps related.

it all makes me have extreme anxiety and so I don't ususally use this. but after herxiing much with it , it does make me feel like 50% better
the next day. with pain and other things.

--------------------
Be thankful in all things- even difficult times and sickness and trials - because there is something GOOD to be seen

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dan67
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Muscle car, I'm not talking about big pharma I'm talking about university studies, many, which show it is immunosuppressive. This shouldn't turn into a huge political conspiracy theory.
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Muscle Car55
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quote:
Originally posted by dan67:
Muscle car, I'm not talking about big pharma I'm talking about university studies, many, which show it is immunosuppressive. This shouldn't turn into a huge political conspiracy theory.

lol, problem is people like you don't think there is a conspiracy, because you've been programmed not to! People with your type of ideology are the ones who fall with hardest with Lyme Disease. There are people like Mandy Hughes who put 10 years of trust into the system and doctors, they fall hard, some do not survive, and are written off as some type of other cause on their death certificate. If she didn't have the money to get IVs from Dr. J, she'd be in sad state of affairs right now.

I'm assuming she had some close calls in those 10 years where she almost died or almost committed suicide, I'm sure a lot of that was left out in Under Our Skin, which the director emphasized on an interview with Amy Tan!!!

Myself, I was able to get a diagnosis within a year and half because I pushed and pushed, didn't believe a word any of the 30+ doctors or 10+ hospitals I went to said, I believed in my own symptoms regardless of what some bloodwork test showed or spinal tap showed. I did research on the web and matched up with my symptoms with candida, which only one doctor in my area claimed to treat. That's when he was able to link my symptoms to Lyme. And yes, this was the same doctor that a lot of people call a nut, even the Vet doctors down the street. Which my Father was really surprised to hear.

So yeah, when you think outside the box and go against studies that claim to represent the truth, yes you're chastised a nut/conspiracy theorist all sorts of things.

If you don't think big pharma influences college studies you gotta another thing coming.

I stand by what I said, people dieing from pain pills, yet cannabis is still demonized.

People dieing from Lyme Disease, but IDSA/CDC's studies still stand as the guidelines for "universities" who teach doctors.

There's plenty of hardcore studies like this with big words and long paragraphs that will support the CDC's guidelines. Yet what ya know, long term antibiotics like Flagyl, Minocycline, and Tindamax somehow work for Lyme patients.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3005548/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18031185

Look, studies aren't perfect, nor are scientists. Lyme Disease has proven that! We still don't entirely understand how the human body works! Scientists haven't a clue what causes MS, Parkinsons, and ALS. I suspect it's an infection and think they're all wrong for thinking it's autoimmune.

I've read some of these immune-suppression studies, but I've come to the conclusion it's more of a modulation of T-cells and cytokines. Or people like Joe Rogan, Willie Nelson, Tommy Chong, and Jesse Ventura would be dieing at the age they're proliferary smoking at.

But they aren't, people who are taking pharmaceutical pain pills are.

I would still say take your antibiotics, but the problem at hand is what to take for longterm pain management, many Lyme patients really don't have many options for treatment! Most pharmaceuticals will kill you longterm.

Nothing worked for my sciatica, I mean nothing. When I got on CBD and RSO, took away the pain within a week, now I can sit for 24 hours straight in a chair.

I've been on cannabis for year now! I bench press around 270 like 5-6 times. Can run 4-5 miles in a day, but yet still have fatigue symptoms just like everyone else. I suspect I'm still infected!

Ever noticed how these scientific studies don't support what actually happens in the real world?

For decades Lyme patients trusted in their own symptoms and how antibiotics worked on their body rather than the primitive studies the IDSA and CDC pumped out through the years. Come to find out, the patients were right and the CDC/IDSA were wrong.

Personally, from my experience with life, trust in your own experiences and research rather than what doctors, your government, and university studies say. One of these days it may save your life, it did for me!

If I trusted what they said about Lyme Disease, I'd be tagged on the toe dead right now. Many of other people on here would to!

Good luck!

~ Coming from just another Conspiracy Theorist

I write detailed long responses in my post because I think this all correlates to what's going on with Lyme, I'm sure most cannot handle it and it ends up being shooting the messenger. But I write these detailed posts because I care and try to help people have realistic view on life rather than a fairy tale.

[ 10-21-2016, 11:39 AM: Message edited by: Muscle Car55 ]

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dan67
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I have no doubt CBD helps with pain. My question is, does it do that by suppressing the immune system?
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dbpei
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I think Medical Marijuana 'modulates' the immune system, as opposed to suppressing it. I am reading an excellent book written by someone who suffered for years with Lyme disease, who believes that medical marijuana got her well.

https://www.lymedisease.org/book-review-cannabis-for-lyme-disease-and-related-conditions/

I started taking it a few months ago. It has helped with sleep, increased my body temp from 96 to 98 and I think it is improving my sense of smell, that has been suppressed for years. I am also sweating more easily now.

What I don't like so far is that it tends to increase my tinnitus soon after taking. Also, if you take too much at once, it can make you feel anxious, shaky, paranoid... the key is to start with a very small dose and gradually increase until you think it is helping you.

I am trying different strains and find that the edible and tincture forms of Indica are best for me. According to the author, a blend of CBD and THC works well for healing lyme and reducing symptoms. Also she says that CBD oil alone, can be very helpful in reducing Lyme symptoms, but is less beneficial in killing bacteria.

MM is legal in my state and I find the people who work in the dispensaries where you purchase the MM to be very helpful. I am still working on finding something that does not make my tinnitus worse.

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Muscle Car55
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Thanks for chiming in dbpei, yeah I've heard of Shelley White story. Read a little about it, it's not at all that surprising.

I solely wouldn't drop your antibiotics to start using cannabis, but I definitely would use it combination!

But then again, cannabis may not your harm your digestive tract which antibiotics do, which in return damages your immune system. Remember 70% or so of your immune system lies in your gut.

Supposedly Shelley's not the only one that's benefited from THC and CBD oil http://www.thealternativedaily.com/weed-end-lyme-disease-good/

By the way, anyone hear on Dr. Sapi's work about cannabis, might of mentioned this in another thread. Would be interesting to know how well cannabis kills the bacteria under a microscope in vitro, she was supposedly doing a study???

 -

http://www.lymeneteurope.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5617

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