Notwithstanding the effects Bb has on all other systems,the thyroid gland, at least in part may be tied in with this mood swing thing.

Stay away from gingko if your taking it; it makes some people 'crazed' true it does increase circulation to the brain, and it has helped me in this respect, but eventually I pegged this to my thyroid.

While I didn't do a comprehensive search on this connection between the thyroid and gingko, I did find a caveat about the thyroid-gingko thing on a package gingko on the counter-top of a WaWA/Krauzer type store.

I've also found that large doses of omega 3 oils(in the form of cod liver oil affected my stress level, and I've cut down to a lower dose. I figured the adrenal glands get stressed when doing high dose W3 fatty acids.

To answer your question about the use of anticonvulsives used as mood stabilizers, the "big picture" answer is that both epilepsy and bipolar mood disorders share the common problem of episodic misfirings of neuron groups. As such, these drugs basically modulate signals from neuron to neuron, something that is disrupted in both conditions.

How this neuronal signal regulation is accomplished by these drugs is a very active area of research -- the current answer is folks don't know, but the two most "implicated" areas have to do with (A) ion channel changes/modulation and (B) kinase regulation issues (it appears that some drugs work more on A and others more on B).

Is this the level of analysis you were looking for?

Look closely, figure out how Depakote (for one) works. It has to do with sodium.

George Eby, developer of zinc lozenges and a brilliant chemist, has a HUGE DOCUMENTED website on Mg. He cured his own manic depression using more natural (read: no dangerous side effects)nutrient(s).

Yes, avoid ginko!!! And anything with MSG. Glutamates are bad news.

If you don't believe me re: the hit this pathogen takes on our nutrients, PLEASE get your mineral levels checked (it will be worth the $200 - approx.- insurance won't cover) to have this simple urine test done.

Find a doctor willing to order this test for you. The results have to be sent to a doctor. This is one good lab: Doctor's Data 3755 Illinois Avenue, St. Charles, IL 60174. Phone (630) 377-8139. Website: www.doctorsdata.com. Other lyme patients can supply the names of other good labs too.

I PROMISE you won't regret having this test run. The results will give you an understanding of what you need to begin to rebalance your nutrients.

Once again, research your particular Rx in depth and try to figure out HOW it works. Think: why was this drug developed, what does it do? Why is this necessary? What's wrong? What are the potential side effects of this drug...esp. long term? Could natural things (the right nutrients) help instead?

So headaches, bipolar disorder and seizure disorders may all have something in common.

Neurontin is also being used "off-label" for pain problems...Maybe Durameter understand why. Folks with neuropathies seem to find it helpful.

Durameter, are you a doctor, or biologist, or...? Your posts are always very informative, thank you!

Low dose Dilantin is recommended for a host of problems, many of which are common among Lyme patients -- irritability, flash anger, difficulty concentrating, insomnia, headache, chronic pain.

I tried it for headaches, and it does help.
I highly recommend this book for Lyme patients.

Carol

p.s. High doses of Dilantin are used for epilepsy.

And chronic pain, like the other disorders mentioned, also may be a function of neuronal disregulation (causing, for example, increased Substance P or decreased Substance P uptake or a whole variety of things "gone wrong").

Right now, the understanding of causes of disorders like epilepsy, mood disturbances, chronic pain (including headaches) and neuropathy is so primordial that the commonality of "disrupted neuronal regulation" is "useful." And the fact that drugs exist that appear to balance to some degree such neuronal disregulation also speaks to our limited knowledge. Because the balance of proper neuronal firing is so complex, it is likely that these various disorders in fact have subtle differences in the actual cause. Further research will elucidate such differences and then drugs will be targeted at the specific causes. For now we just have meds that sort of help at the "big picture" level, but because the nature of that picture differs at a smaller level, those drugs have a hit & miss record. This tale is an example of why basic research is so important...

Doc Dave, I guess the best answer to your question is that for some of these problems (bipolar, headaches, pain) certain drugs are used (off-label, or not for their original purpose) simply because they sometimes work, or at least sometimes help.

We were surprised too, when meds like depakote and topamax were offered for headache.

The docs don't always really understand why they work, as they will often readily tell you.

When you throw in the mysteries of Lyme's neurological effects, things get really complicated!

p.s. when one of my children had a bout of bipolar illness whle on antibiotics, they also wanted to do an EEG- this illustrates what Durameter was saying, that there is some similarity in brain activity with bipolar and seizures...

Consider neurotransmitter therapy? I never heard of it, but it sounds, more 'sound' than psycho drugs to me. psych meds to have their place, temporarily in some cases. whether for lyme, I don't know. http://flash.lymenet.org/ubb/Forum1/HTML/034610.html

also consider:
http://www.breggin.com http://www.garynull.com http://www.mentalhealthandillness.com Robert Bransfield,MD, LLMD "Head expander"
Fallon at columbia; leignor. http://www.Dr-Zhang.com

some,if not most ssri drugs cause a degradation of the frontal cortex of the brain, and, Bb causes a degradation of the subcortical structures of the brain.

You've undergone intense antibiotic and other regimens. Consider healing/herxing, effects, and sideeffects, both therefrom and thereby, weeks to months out since stopping heavy abx, and other meds.

I don't know anything about your situation, but my then13 year-old daughter developed a full bipolar psychosis on her first Lyme med, tetracycline. She is a very stable child and had never had any such symptoms before or since.

I still f eel badly that I followed MD advice and kept her on the tetracycline as long as we/she could stand it (I say we because the entire household, including two other kids, was very affected by her being completley psychotic).

The LLMD and other MD's, inlcuding a neuropsychiatrist, prescribed Neurontin, which made her much worse. They were talking about going to depakote or lithium. I also tried Omegabrite (fish oils) for her.

When I finally strongly insisted that we try taking her off, and we did, she was pretty much back to her normal self within 3 days. It took a few months for a little residual anxiety in the evening to go away.

She went on amox., then Biaxin and Plaquenil- and then, 18 months later, again did tetracycline at a small dose, w/no adverse psych. effects.

I am extremely grateful that I listened to that voice inside that said to take her off, and even more that she never went on the meds. In her case, the meds would ahve just confused the picture even more.

ON THE OTHER HAND, I have two friends and two relatives who have bipolar illness
and their lives have been saved and turned around by anticonvulsive meds. Just want to put this in too.

Olive branch in one hand, and uzi in the other.

Although Ant-siezure meds may be affective on preventing seizures they are also good for reducing pain.

Cymbalta, classification antidepressant, is used for nerve ending pain, etc. etc.

There are many meds that cross over.
The brain is the key.

Many of these manifestations exist, but it is difficult to determine why.

Several of the post have explained some of the processes the meds go thru.

It is important to keep your lens open wide!